Pearl Ram Posted August 22, 2021 Share Posted August 22, 2021 Imagine if that was the case, old Mr Pop over at OTIB would be apoplectic. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted August 22, 2021 Share Posted August 22, 2021 6 hours ago, Wignall12 said: I was pi$$ing by the wondow and heard they thonk it will be tuesday Toysday or not, it will be a greet day when it happens. Cone on you Rims. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted August 22, 2021 Share Posted August 22, 2021 4 hours ago, RoyMac5 said: I thought your opinion was, how would we be getting a penalty when we haven't even been charged with owt? Can we use VAR to see if it was a penalty. Dean (hick) Saunders 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 9 hours ago, kevinhectoring said: I think the club could send it’s preferred numbers to the EFl and say, here you go, we’ve submitted the returns, you don’t like them and what are you going to do about it ? That forces the EFl to decide whether to start another case. You’re right, that’s what I said we could do But based on what @Ellafella has said, it looks like we have seen sense and said : ok EFl, we and you disagree about the numbers, but we will submit numbers on the basis you and we have negotiated. And you agree that if we do submit those numbers, you won’t start a case and all we get is an agreed 3 point deduction. in other words, it’s done by agreement, outside the enforcement regime. It’s a great result if this happens and it’s in line with what Pearce suggested when he indicated the club was keen to work with the ELF and avoid further disputes The problem with that is do boro and other clubs then start banging on about taking action against the EFL and it all gets silly again worsened by the fact that we have accepted guilt by taking a 3 point deduction without a squeak? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 What size penalty would people accept to put the umbongo behind us? Nookiebear1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reggie Greenwood Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 5 minutes ago, sage said: What size penalty would people accept to put the umbongo behind us? Nil r_wilcockson, Rammy03, Indy and 6 others 5 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 15 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said: There are no rules to say it has to be straight-line Yes ! I seem to remember the original judgment only said, the explanation of the method “could have been clearer” Or have I made that up ? Indy, RoyMac5, The Scarlet Pimpernel and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamLad1884 Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 If three points penalty was the end of things now, no more chance for the EFL to have us for our accounts or late submission I'd take it all day. Think we have all acted a little entitled about the fight with the EFL and we're lucky we come out of this still in the championship. Three points at this stage of the season is more than enough time to prepare and make up ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 35 minutes ago, sage said: What size penalty would people accept to put the umbongo behind us? Whatever the results from the ffp calculations show. That assumes that we have spent the extra time agreeing what the method is with the EFL, so now is just the big reveal. r_wilcockson and RoyMac5 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
falconram Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 If we are within FFP with the new amortisation NIL deduction with a suspended 3 points due to late filing, if late again points will be deducted. What the EFL have to realise that they are part of the issue here giving Dcfc the green light to alter the way amortisation was done. r_wilcockson, Igor Igor Whats the Score?, RoyMac5 and 3 others 1 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 I was round at neighbours for dinner yesterday and he's an ex partner at Ernst and young plus a Leeds fan so I described our accounting issues. He snorted with derision at the EFL - there is no theoretical justification as to why a straight line amortisation method is superior to any other. In the context of football players he made the further point that a better amortisation method would likely be age dependent as players values typically increase whilst young/gaining experience then flat then decline as they age and lose physicality. Thankfully the dinner conversation moved on.... ? Reggie Greenwood, NottsRam77 and RoyMac5 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i-Ram Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 1 hour ago, sage said: What size penalty would people accept to put the umbongo behind us? Plus 10 points. Reggie Greenwood, CBRammette, Igor Igor Whats the Score? and 1 other 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MackworthRamIsGod Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 I'd take a 3 point penalty, just to be able to say we got a 3 point deduction and are still ahead of the red dogs ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 I think the (length of) embargo(es) has been worse than a points deduction would’ve been. r_wilcockson, Kernow, hydraulic ram and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rampage Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 6 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: I think the (length of) embargo(es) has been worse than a points deduction would’ve been. Where is the Embargofest being held next year. How can we get tickets. Ellafella 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crewton Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 I think the whole issue of amortisation of playing assets is problematic, but the straight line method recognises that what is being amortised is the initial transfer fee, not the players value at a particular point of his contract. The latter is too subjective to be a reliable method for a P&S calculation in my opinion. However, hauling us over the coals for using a different method is obtuse, when their preferred method did not form part of the FFP regulations (as far as I'm aware). The fact that they also signed off our alternative method without spotting it was problematic should have made them a bit more conciliatory - instead, they doubled down on it due mainly to the lobbying of Gibson and others. We've been pilloried for, basically, not breaking any rules (so far). They even changed the embargo rules recently specifically to address our accounting transgressions and cash flow difficulties which can be mostly attributed to failed takeovers and Covid. Ellafella 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gritstone Ram Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 1 hour ago, sage said: What size penalty would people accept to put the umbongo behind us? I think you need to see what the crime is before anyone can judge what the punishment is. I however fear that nothing will be fair and the EFL and their kangaroo court try and push us further under. Crewton and MaltRam 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donnyram Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 17 minutes ago, Crewton said: I think the whole issue of amortisation of playing assets is problematic, but the straight line method recognises that what is being amortised is the initial transfer fee, not the players value at a particular point of his contract. The latter is too subjective to be a reliable method for a P&S calculation in my opinion. However, hauling us over the coals for using a different method is obtuse, when their preferred method did not form part of the FFP regulations (as far as I'm aware). The fact that they also signed off our alternative method without spotting it was problematic should have made them a bit more conciliatory - instead, they doubled down on it due mainly to the lobbying of Gibson and others. We've been pilloried for, basically, not breaking any rules (so far). They even changed the embargo rules recently specifically to address our accounting transgressions and cash flow difficulties which can be mostly attributed to failed takeovers and Covid. The latter is too subjective to be a reliable method for a P&S calculation in my opinion. There is almost certainly sufficient data to justify a different model based on a player retaining a decent chunk of value until he is into the last year of his contract. Clearly not enough for the EFL though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 21 hours ago, simmoram1995 said: Anyone catch the 5 live reporter’s report about Derby apparently they’ve spoken to Rooney and he is hopeful our embargo might end as soon as Tuesday and he would like to add upto 8 new players to the squad? I think that's about what we actually do need - I know everyone has been saying we don't need that many but I think we do GK - Marshal is off (it seems almost certain), Alsopp is on a 12 month contract, Roos contract expires end of season RB - Byrne (contract up EOS) + youth players who will benefit more from occasional action/starts than pressure of playing every week LB - Fozzy (contract EOS) is getting on a bit, Buchanan gives us 2nd option - Probably fine here CB - We have 3, all old, all on 1 year (max) deals - Need to bring in minimum 2 options CM - Shinnie (Contract EOS), Bird, Knight, Bielik - If all were fit we'd be fine but I still think we need some proper cover for Bielik AM - Morrison and Lawrence (contract EOS), Sibley (for me) needs to be rotated out more often - A few weeks playing impact sub role and ease him back in - Think he needs protecting from the constant pressure of games like Boro (get kicked all over the pitch, barely and time/space etc) Wide-Mids - Jozwiak? Is that it? Definitely need more here ST - Baldock (contract Jan?) plus Stretton who I still think would benefit from taking away the pressure of being a 'starter' - Would bring in someone who's a 'different option' On Saturday we ended the game with Bird, Watson, Buchanan and Stretton in our 'attacking 5' - That (for me) is too much responsibility on too many young players - If you have 2/5 they have chance to blend in, mess things up, get told where to go and what to do a bit more by the experienced heads - Stretton looks a real talent but when he comes on he legs it around the pitch chasing everything because his adrenaline is up so much from playing first team football - Compare that to Baldock who's physically very similar, who holds his position so the defence/midfield know where to aim for to pick him out DCFC1388, RoyMac5 and Fraser_23 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaaLocks Posted August 23, 2021 Share Posted August 23, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, sage said: What size penalty would people accept to put the umbongo behind us? Can't say myself but I do have it on good assurance that the Python would pick the passion fruit and the Marmoset the mandarin Edited August 23, 2021 by BaaLocks GboroRam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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