Embargo.

[duncanjwitham]

2 hours ago, Spanish said:

I think it is very simple, a specific audit statement that each club is complying with amortization rules as part of the accounts filing process.  No club can be faulted in those circumstances.  I know the auditors sign off the whole set of accounts but in my industry they do that and also provide a reliance confirmation to our regulators

Not sure that would make any difference TBH. The EFL appear to have decided that they know accounting rules better than the auditors, so why would another statement from them change anything?  

And even if they do it for amortization, it could be any other aspect of the accounts next.

[GboroRam]

9 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

That's a crazy approach though, unless I'm completely misunderstanding you. You can't have clubs submitting P&S returns and the EFL demanding they change them based on an unknown and undocumented set of rules. 

You'd have the situation where a club can submit a set of accounts that they believe meet FFP thresholds, that have been signed off by auditors, accepted by HMRC etc etc, and the EFL can come back a month later and say we redid your numbers based on rules we didn't tell you about, and now you failed by £Xm so here's a big points deduction?

Welcome to the world of EFL accountancyball. 

[kevinhectoring]

5 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

That's a crazy approach though, unless I'm completely misunderstanding you. You can't have clubs submitting P&S returns and the EFL demanding they change them based on an unknown and undocumented set of rules. 

You'd have the situation where a club can submit a set of accounts that they believe meet FFP thresholds, that have been signed off by auditors, accepted by HMRC etc etc, and the EFL can come back a month later and say we redid your numbers based on rules we didn't tell you about, and now you failed by £Xm so here's a big points deduction?

Didn’t explain it very well, sorry. The starting point for clubs’ accounts should be FRS. The EFl should then have detailed rules which require adjustments as the EFL (clubs) see fit, with the result that the P&S return does not come straight off the audited accounts. Their rules already do this to a certain extent eg with connected party contracts. But to get closer to a level playing field they need to expand the scope of their own rules to stop people using loopholes which are permitted by FRS (eg the one Mel has described )

[Sparkle]

19 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

That's a crazy approach though, unless I'm completely misunderstanding you. You can't have clubs submitting P&S returns and the EFL demanding they change them based on an unknown and undocumented set of rules. 

You'd have the situation where a club can submit a set of accounts that they believe meet FFP thresholds, that have been signed off by auditors, accepted by HMRC etc etc, and the EFL can come back a month later and say we redid your numbers based on rules we didn't tell you about, and now you failed by £Xm so here's a big points deduction?

Isn’t that the situation we are now sat in? 

[Ramslad1992]

[Ellafella]

This is on Twitter:

Edited August 24, 2021 by Ellafella

[duncanjwitham]

11 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said:

Didn’t explain it very well, sorry. The starting point for clubs’ accounts should be FRS. The EFl should then have detailed rules which require adjustments as the EFL (clubs) see fit, with the result that the P&S return does not come straight off the audited accounts. Their rules already do this to a certain extent eg with connected party contracts. But to get closer to a level playing field they need to expand the scope of their own rules to stop people using loopholes which are permitted by FRS (eg the one Mel has described )

That's basically what I said though.  It doesn't need to be a completely new accounting code written from scratch, but if they're writing a whole load of new rules on top of the existing ones, then everything I said still applies - they still need proper consultations to write those rules, to pay in-house auditors to sign off on clubs accounts, proper enforcement and the clubs to pay for it etc etc.  They either need to document and publish *exactly* what they want clubs to do, or just leave it alone and trust that the accountants and auditors know what they're doing.

11 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

Isn’t that the situation we are now sat in? 

Yeah, I read it as Kevin suggesting we make that the default process for everyone, but I think we had slightly crossed wires.

[Shake n Bake]

2 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

This is on Twitter:

 

[Ellafella]

Just now, Shake n Bake said:

 

I’m not saying it’s fact - just an illustration of what’s flying around. 

[JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta]

6 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

I’m not saying it’s fact - just an illustration of what’s flying around. 

Same stuff that has been flying around for about two years now, 99% of it was pushed out of the rear end of a cow.

[Steve How Hard?]

10 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

This is on Twitter:

That post seems to have been submitted by somebody called Sean Seal. Seems a bit Crazy to me, as if we're never gonna survive unless.....

[Lander]

9 minutes ago, Shake n Bake said:

 

Live footage of Rooney trying to locate some new players that we can sign.

[Ramslad1992]

1 minute ago, Lander said:

Live footage of Rooney trying to locate some new players that we can sign.

Connor Sammon on a loan until CKR is fit again? ?

[Ambitious]

44 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

That's a crazy approach though, unless I'm completely misunderstanding you. You can't have clubs submitting P&S returns and the EFL demanding they change them based on an unknown and undocumented set of rules. 

You'd have the situation where a club can submit a set of accounts that they believe meet FFP thresholds, that have been signed off by auditors, accepted by HMRC etc etc, and the EFL can come back a month later and say we redid your numbers based on rules we didn't tell you about, and now you failed by £Xm so here's a big points deduction?

Isn’t this almost the exact situation we found ourselves in? I mean, we even had the EFL sign them off and then come back years later and want them redone. 

They even had press release stating they were disappointed they couldn’t retrospectively give us a points deduction and relegate us. 

The EFL are completely cowboys. 

[Dan_Ram]

1 minute ago, Steve How Hard? said:

That post seems to have been submitted by somebody called Sean Seal. Seems a bit Crazy to me, as if we're never gonna survive unless.....

I struggle to understand him sometimes, his brother Ron is much more adherent.

[Steve How Hard?]

1 minute ago, Dan_Ram said:

I struggle to understand him sometimes, his brother Ron is much more adherent.

I'd prefer it if they both just varnished off the face of the earth.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

1 minute ago, Ambitious said:

Isn’t this almost the exact situation we found ourselves in? I mean, we even had the EFL sign them off and then come back years later and want them redone. 

They even had press release stating they were disappointed they couldn’t retrospectively give us a points deduction and relegate us. 

The EFL are completely cowboys. 

Saved me posting the same thing. I agree, it is exactly the position we found ourselves in. Its good sometimes to go back and touch base as it all almost gets lost in the detail.

[Red_ram]

8 minutes ago, Steve How Hard? said:

That post seems to have been submitted by somebody called Sean Seal. Seems a bit Crazy to me, as if we're never gonna survive unless.....

...we sign Danny (Kiss from a) Rose?! ITK??

[Steve How Hard?]

1 minute ago, Red_ram said:

...we sign Danny (Kiss from a) Rose?! ITK??

...or Kiss from a Roos?

[Lander]

11 minutes ago, Ramslad1992 said:

Connor Sammon on a loan until CKR is fit again? ?

Say no more.