Derby v Cheltenham Town - Match Day Thread

[Ambitious]

It's never a good sign when you get a universal disillusionment following a win, but I did think the performance was on recent trend and that's a concern.

Standards need to be much higher - it's been over a month since our last good performance and two months since we strung two good performances together. 

[Crewton]

I'm done here. I can't take anymore of this tedious shyte. Let's hope David Clowes doesn't feel like I do, though it's exactly what some of you deserve. W*nkers.

[Rich3478]

That first half performance was horrific, second didn’t start well but their goal at least pushed us forward. Two good goals from us, not many other positives though.

Centre mid was awful again, bird actually got a lot better when Thompson and Fornah came on. Although didn’t think either played well when the came on.

Blackett Taylor was poor too, just looked so casual. You’d think be eager to impress on debut but was almost the opposite.

good result but we need to play better very quickly! 

[sunnyhill60]

2 minutes ago, Rich3478 said:

That first half performance was horrific, second didn’t start well but their goal at least pushed us forward. Two good goals from us, not many other positives though.

Centre mid was awful again, bird actually got a lot better when Thompson and Fornah came on. Although didn’t think either played well when the came on.

Blackett Taylor was poor too, just looked so casual. You’d think be eager to impress on debut but was almost the opposite.

good result but we need to play better very quickly! 

Blackett Taylor saw little of the ball, 15 touches in 63 minutes, not entirely down to him I think

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

2 hours ago, Jourdan said:

What other metric am I supposed to apply?

Good results will lead to promotion. Good performances might only lead to glorious failure, as it has done in what must be 80-90% of our promotion attempts in recent memory.

Only three teams can get promoted. If it‘s not us this season, that’ll be because three teams have got better results than us and they will deserve credit for that.

We are in the top six and have a chance of promotion, but good performances on their own guarantee nothing.

Two teams and maybe one will get a dubious decision go their way to nick it by a point. Like us last season. As for place three, someone, as we well know, could finish 5 wins behind you and go up.  Better results is the medium it's settled by for top 2 but a fair few are always dubious or fortunate ones. Playoffs aren't better results by a better team.  The best finishes 3rd and could lose three top players in the last match and be beaten as a result. Reward given for failure and should be binned .  Costs millions . 

[Rich3478]

14 minutes ago, sunnyhill60 said:

Blackett Taylor saw little of the ball, 15 touches in 63 minutes, not entirely down to him I think

I know, but surely on your debut you’d try and chase things down and get involved? Was awful but the whole team was awful for an hour. Hopefully has a better game at Charlton next week

[one_chop]

2 hours ago, Rich3478 said:

I know, but surely on your debut you’d try and chase things down and get involved? Was awful but the whole team was awful for an hour. Hopefully has a better game at Charlton next week

I don't think he'll be playing.

[Magicman]

CBT has not shown anything yet hope he is not the next Blackman !! 

[TomTom92]

Quite concerning how many fans are moaning despite 3 points. 
 
Can totally understand why though. If we don’t pick up performances then top 2 won’t happen and then as we know play offs are a lottery. 
 
Who’d of thought missing a right back that offers nothing going forward would cause us so much grief. 
 
Hoping we can shift 1 on and bring in 2 before deadline day closes. 

[MACKWORTHRAM]

Honestly some of our fans are genuinely awful. The sense of entitlement some of them have is absolutely staggering.

Yesterday was all about winning. The performance didn't matter. We're absolutely littered with injuries. Booking them off at half time? Who's that helping?

Cheering the captain when he's subbed off? 

It's absolutely ridiculous it really is.

Now I'm seeing "Blackett-Taylor hadn't really shown anything yet" he's been here 5 minutes, trained with us twice. I despair I really do.

All I hear is "we aren't good enough, Peterborough are better than us, Bolton are better than us" 

Says who? Of course Peterborough were brilliant when they came here. But that was the same Peterborough side we put 4 past on their own ground? Bolton also just scraped past Cheltenham, Bolton lost at Leyton Orient. 

Oxford fans watching us that second half at their ground would have thought we were the best team in the league, we were outstanding.

You cannot play well every week. 

 

[Carnero]

44 minutes ago, MACKWORTHRAM said:

All I hear is "we aren't good enough, Peterborough are better than us, Bolton are better than us" 

Says who? Of course Peterborough were brilliant when they came here. But that was the same Peterborough side we put 4 past on their own ground?

Is that the Peterborough that drew 0-0 at Lincoln yesterday, the same result that we were castigated for last week?

[Gaspode]

43 minutes ago, MACKWORTHRAM said:

Honestly some of our fans are genuinely awful. The sense of entitlement some of them have is absolutely staggering.

Yesterday was all about winning. The performance didn't matter. We're absolutely littered with injuries. Booking them off at half time? Who's that helping?

Cheering the captain when he's subbed off? 

It's absolutely ridiculous it really is.

Now I'm seeing "Blackett-Taylor hadn't really shown anything yet" he's been here 5 minutes, trained with us twice. I despair I really do.

All I hear is "we aren't good enough, Peterborough are better than us, Bolton are better than us" 

Says who? Of course Peterborough were brilliant when they came here. But that was the same Peterborough side we put 4 past on their own ground? Bolton also just scraped past Cheltenham, Bolton lost at Leyton Orient. 

Oxford fans watching us that second half at their ground would have thought we were the best team in the league, we were outstanding.

You cannot play well every week. 

 

I’d agree with most of your post but would just say that while “you can’t play well every week”, you can play badly every week and it seems to be becoming a habit. Warne’s anti-football is utterly horrible to watch - and as was shown after he made the substitutions, we do have players that can make a difference if the manager wasn’t so damn stubborn in his approach…

[Rich3478]

49 minutes ago, MACKWORTHRAM said:

Honestly some of our fans are genuinely awful. The sense of entitlement some of them have is absolutely staggering.

Yesterday was all about winning. The performance didn't matter. We're absolutely littered with injuries. Booking them off at half time? Who's that helping?

Cheering the captain when he's subbed off? 

It's absolutely ridiculous it really is.

Now I'm seeing "Blackett-Taylor hadn't really shown anything yet" he's been here 5 minutes, trained with us twice. I despair I really do.

All I hear is "we aren't good enough, Peterborough are better than us, Bolton are better than us" 

Says who? Of course Peterborough were brilliant when they came here. But that was the same Peterborough side we put 4 past on their own ground? Bolton also just scraped past Cheltenham, Bolton lost at Leyton Orient. 

Oxford fans watching us that second half at their ground would have thought we were the best team in the league, we were outstanding.

You cannot play well every week. 

 

We never play well! Wigan was good for an hour and Oxford good. Since then been pretty rank in six games? 
 

call some fans awful if you like but the team were booed at half time, and warne even said he should’ve booed himself. If you are happy with first half yesterday then fair enough. But feel you’re in the minority.

not writing Blackett Taylor off at all but has been pretty uninspiring so far, in close to 1 1/2 games has achieved very little. That’s all that’s pointed out. 

[G STAR RAM]

9 hours ago, Andicis said:

It's purely common sense. I'm not going to trawl through all the other squads in the league to prove what we both know is common sense. I know you like to act like this is a court of law, and be ridiculously anal about points that are patently obviously to everyone, but I'm just not keen on playing that game. 

Why is it obvious that we have more depth in our squad than everyone else?

We've not paid a fee for anyone for 3 seasons.

We've been under restrictions for 2 seasons.

I don't see how common sense would lead you to the conclusion that we have more depth in our squad than everyone else.

I know nothing about anyone else's squad hence asking you if you could back your statement up, you clearly can't so I'll take your comment as hyperbole.

[Mucker1884]

I've never had a downer on Warne.
I was up his arse for a good few months... and personality-wise, I still like the guy/his humour etc, unlike many.
Any hint from me re Warne Out has been 100% "Tongue-in-cheek"/"WUM", call it what you like.
Even now, I'm not at the "I think it's time to go" stage.
Even if and when I get there, it will be more out of rueful realism than full on rant.  That's just my make up, I guess.  I'll just shrug my shoulders and plod on.

But even for a home-only attendee (Lincoln away aside), I very much agree with @sage with his "Hard work to watch" comments.
I don't currently envy our stalwart home and away regulars, that's for sure.  Nor even the home regulars that have a bit of a trek to get here!  

It's hard work to motivate myself to take the 30 minute stroll to get there.
It's hard work to skip up the steps to my seat, with even the slightest hint of optimism or excitement.
It's hard work to bellow out a "Come on Derby".
It's hard work to even truly believe "We'll win this" before a ball is kicked.
For me personally, it's even hard work to work out whether it's Warne's fault, the player's fault, or a combination.  

...But it's definitely a hard watch!

Points (and subsequent league position) just about trump performance for me, but there will always be a cut-off point.  I'm not there yet, and I've no idea how close I am.  I suspect if that comes, it will be a bolt out of the blue moment?  

But I'm not enjoying the watch.  I'm not shouting from the roof tops that I'm a Derby fan.  It's now't to brag about... unlike 14/15.

As winter isn't over with yet, it's even hard work for me to proclaim that I'll attend every remaining home game this season.  There's still the odd "Bitterly cold winter's mid-week evening" to come yet!  
I missed a few of those in Young Nigel's latter days.  It may come around again this season yet.

Of course, my absence (should it happen) won't matter a jot, as I'm not important, and my money's already in the coffers.  And regardless of how this season pans out, I'm not currently planning to forego my ST renewal for next season.

... But it's definitely a hard watch. 

4th, yer say?  Touching distance of auto's, we cry?
Cling on folks... there may just be some entertainment around the corner!

🐏

[jono]

8 hours ago, sage said:

It's not about me. 

It's not about Warne.

It's not personal.

Do you really think it's just me that thinks the football on display is largely poor?

 

Yesterday was, first half particularly and a handful of games at other times too, but no, I don’t think the football is “largely” poor. We are a bit inconsistent and make too many individual errors. Warne does ok, his post match summaries tell me that he sees what we see. His only failing seems to be having ideas that when  they don’t work, he sticks to them a bit too long. For example, early season 3 at the back and now the Bird / Hourihan thing. But remember, his options have been limited by a number of factors outside his control

1) Budget for new players

2) Washington, Waghorn, Thompson, Smith, Rooney, Ward all with, or coming back from  long terms injuries - Players that have a mix of skills or youth to switch things around. 

[Caerphilly Ram]

13 minutes ago, Gaspode said:

I’d agree with most of your post but would just say that while “you can’t play well every week”, you can play badly every week and it seems to be becoming a habit. Warne’s anti-football is utterly horrible to watch - and as was shown after he made the substitutions, we do have players that can make a difference if the manager wasn’t so damn stubborn in his approach…

Isn’t this an oxymoron? More than he did last season Warne has shown a willingness to change things which has resulted in us collecting more wins and scoring more goals.

He’s perhaps not setting us up in the right way from the off, but I can at least see some reasoning for that with the squad spread so thin due to injuries. 

I’ve pretty much come to the conclusion recently that he’s never going to be welcome here by some sections of the support, with people of course welcome to their opinions and plenty offering an explanation for how they feel. As I’ve said before, he’ll leave at some point and I hope at least whoever replaces him proves to be far less a divisive character. 

[IlsonDerby]

 

10 hours ago, Jourdan said:

I didn’t watch today as I was busy with wedding preparations, but seen enough of this season to know that there will be hyperbole and the bad will be super-imposed and over-egged.

Honestly wish I’d have been doing wedding prep. This season would be class if all you do is look for the results rolling in on final score. The fact is that player for player we are better on paper than probably 20-22 of the teams in this division. Now football isn’t played on paper but it’s the coaches job to ensure that the position of the club is at least par with the budget the club has compared to the rest of the division otherwise he’s failing. 
 

If at the end of the season we don’t finish top 2-3 then we’ll have performed under par. That doesn’t necessarily mean you sack someone but if in the next 17 matches we can’t string together at least 10 convincing points performances then I’ll be questioning what we are actually building towards because he’ll have had over 1 and a half seasons and 3 transfer windows. 

By this point things should be coming together. it should be getting clearer and clearer to see what his ideal football blueprint looks like and us getting closer to it. The last 180 minutes of football haven’t been that. 

 

9 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

Would folks be happy if we'd played well and lost 

Ofc we should be beating teams like Cheltenham at home, goes without saying 

It isn’t black and white is it? If we’d played well but the same things in the match unfolded - ie we go in to half time at 0-0, then go 1-0 down early in the second half before coming back and winning 2-1 then I think the fans walk away content and happy with the result. 
 

For context I was happy enough with the Burton game (my bar isn’t that high) - felt daft mistakes let them in but otherwise we were in control of the match for 75 minutes. How much of the match were we in control for yesterday? 
 

 

When people demand better performances we’re not being entitled. You’ve literally got the manager saying the performance wasn’t good enough in the post match interview - is he entitled? 
 

The only difference is - Warne thinks he’s the man to get us to those excellent performances consistently. I’ve seen enough over the last year and half to know he can get us to perform well but I’ve seen absolutely nothing to suggest he can get us to do it consistently…

[Tyler Durden]

1 hour ago, MACKWORTHRAM said:

Honestly some of our fans are genuinely awful. The sense of entitlement some of them have is absolutely staggering.

Yesterday was all about winning. The performance didn't matter. We're absolutely littered with injuries.

Now I'm seeing "Blackett-Taylor hadn't really shown anything yet" he's been here 5 minutes, trained with us twice. I despair I really do.

All I hear is "we aren't good enough, Peterborough are better than us, Bolton are better than us" 

Says who? Of course Peterborough were brilliant when they came here. But that was the same Peterborough side we put 4 past on their own ground? Bolton also just scraped past Cheltenham, Bolton lost at Leyton Orient. 

Oxford fans watching us that second half at their ground would have thought we were the best team in the league, we were outstanding.

You cannot play well every week. 

 

You can quite easily play the game of pin the quote to the poster on here, some of the replies are that predictable.

In this instance no surprises. 

[Tyler Durden]

3 minutes ago, IlsonDerby said:

 

Honestly wish I’d have been doing wedding prep. This season would be class if all you do is look for the results rolling in on final score. The fact is that player for player we are better on paper than probably 20-22 of the teams in this division. Now football isn’t played on paper but it’s the coaches job to ensure that the position of the club is at least par with the budget the club has compared to the rest of the division otherwise he’s failing. 
 

If at the end of the season we don’t finish top 2-3 then we’ll have performed under par. That doesn’t necessarily mean you sack someone but if in the next 17 matches we can’t string together at least 10 convincing points performances then I’ll be questioning what we are actually building towards because he’ll have had over 1 and a half seasons and 3 transfer windows. 

By this point things should be coming together. it should be getting clearer and clearer to see what his ideal football blueprint looks like and us getting closer to it. The last 180 minutes of football haven’t been that. 

 

It isn’t black and white is it? If we’d played well but the same things in the match unfolded - ie we go in to half time at 0-0, then go 1-0 down early in the second half before coming back and winning 2-1 then I think the fans walk away content and happy with the result. 
 

For context I was happy enough with the Burton game (my bar isn’t that high) - felt daft mistakes let them in but otherwise we were in control of the match for 75 minutes. How much of the match were we in control for yesterday? 
 

 

When people demand better performances we’re not being entitled. You’ve literally got the manager saying the performance wasn’t good enough in the post match interview - is he entitled? 
 

The only difference is - Warne thinks he’s the man to get us to those excellent performances consistently. I’ve seen enough over the last year and half to know he can get us to perform well but I’ve seen absolutely nothing to suggest he can get us to do it consistently…

I asked an open question; would folks on here be happier if we'd played well but lost the game instead.