Poll: what do you think of it so far? (Warne's tenure)

[RoyMac5]

6 hours ago, S8TY said:

How can you say we play long ball only? Do you actually watch the game ? 
we do though resort to aimless crosses and long ball when we are desperate but not before we get desperate….you need some new glasses🤓 I think 

Lol! Don't bother reading the post properly? Just see an opportunity!?! 😂

Didn't say we were ONLY a long ball team. I said:

"I'm bored with the long ball slung forward to no-one in particular or the wingers attempting to cross to the same no-one in particular."

Edited April 6, 2023 by RoyMac5

[BathRam72]

In my personal opinion.  I would say it is still too early to judge.

He inherited this team.  Ask yourself at the start of the season,  how many of these players would he have chosen to play his style.

I say his style of play because he has been successful at this level playing his team that way. Will that style work further up the ladder? Who knows.

I still believe he needs a couple of seasons to build the team he wants. Then he can be judged as it would be his sword to fall on.

Let's not even think of changing yhe manager AGAIN. As part of this mess us down to constant change.

Stability is the way forward for now.

[LeedsCityRam]

12 hours ago, David said:

Buckle up for some stats.

We're 17th in the league for long balls per game. 

Sheffield Wednesday in 18th and Morcambe in 19th play the same amount as us.

Bolton and Peterborough in 20th and 21st play just 1 more.

We're 6th in the table for short passes made per game.

3 less than Sheffield Wednesday in 5th, 4 less than Bolton in 4th, 5 behind Charlton in 3rd.

Finally we're 7th in the league on pass accuracy at 72.5%.

Just to put that out there.

Are those stats for Derby across the entire season or just for Derby under Warne? If it's the former and to state the obvious Rosenior's stint will likely have skewed the short pass % as higher & long ball % as lower than it currently is.

 

12 hours ago, David said:

Just out of interest, has anyone already officially moved into the Warne out camp and would genuinely be happy to see a corner flag tweet in the morning announcing his departure?

I'm in real conflict about this question. Instinctively I do not like sacking managers & believe the longer they get (particularly at lower levels), the more likely they are to succeed. This is primarily due to being able to get their 'type' of players & culture into the club but this theory also assumes that they are competent in the first place. I wasn't a fan of Rowett or Pearson's style of football either but still believed that both needed more time to deliver their ideas (accept Rowett walked but the club atmosphere was toxic by that point anyway)

On the flip side, I don't necessarily want the kind of athletes at Derby that Warne will need to make his style work & I also worry about the implications for the Academy as @IslandExile has highlighted. I don't enjoy Warne's style of football & there does seem to be some glaring flaws in his ability given the amount of times he has been out-thought by opposition managers in the second half of games. I also do not believe he is getting the maximum from this squad - ideally we want a manager who is able to get his team to out-perform expectations, not the reverse.

That said, I struggle with agitating for the removal of a manager hired by David Clowes - it's all too easy to gloss over our debt to him & therefore I want to give his pick the benefit of the doubt whilst still reasonably pointing out where Warne is falling short currently. 

I don't therefore think I'd be happy if he went at this stage but there needs to be some serious consideration within the club early May as to the long term implications of sticking with Warne. Until then I will support his team to the hilt at games & criticise on here when warranted.

Edited April 6, 2023 by LeedsCityRam

[Ambitious]

If we don't finish in the play-off positions then he's had an absolute s****** in his first season in charge, let's be honest with ourselves here. He will have the opportunity at Derby next season with a full pre-season, allowing him to bring some of his own players into the club, so he will be able to properly put his own stamp on things. 

Next season he will have no excuses for not getting this team competing at the top end of the division and that will have to be the expectation. This season is a free hit, but missing out on the play-offs would be concerning considering how comfortable we were. Nine points in nine games for a Derby County side playing in the third division should be embarrassing to him as a coach and the players, honestly - essentially 20% of our season in relegation form AFTER going nearly going 20 unbeaten. 

[Ram-Alf]

2 hours ago, CBRammette said:

You mean PW may be busy behind the scenes working for the club that we dont see which means he cant watch academy games live in person at this point 🙄😂

I'll wager there's quite a few Managers up and down the 4 divisions who have an academy that don't visit/watch those games, He has coaches to do that job, PW has more than enough on his plate with the 1st team...let those who are responsible for the academy to do their job without interference/influence.

Anyway he might be in the bushes

  

[Ram-Alf]

11 hours ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

I don't know.  Supposedly we had someone lined up for weeks in January, Flint was due in and someone else who agreed to come decided they didn't want to drop a league last minute.  I'm not feeling he's that big a convincer.

Now you know as well as me Gee that players follow the cash, Flints at Wednesday not sure whether loan or permanent, Guessing loan as Stoke will be paying some of the big wages he's on...which will be more than we can afford...even for a loan fee and wages that Stoke are helping with.

Archied who posts on here said he was told a deal was on the cards but he couldn't let the cat out of the bag as he'd be in deep shyte, Players are no different in the main to us, Leave your job, Have an interview at a couple of jobs, You've decided on the one job and someone comes in and ups their offer...simple

There's a limited market that we have to deal in...but enough for PW to put a decent fit/physical/good enough team together 👍, As for convincing, A big crowd PP, Moor Farm with it's excellent facilities should be convincing enough if you're hungry enough 🤷‍♀️

[Leeds Ram]

16 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

I've read through your post and genuinely can't find one segment of it where it says anything remotely constructive or positive about Warne.

I've highlighted this part as basically you have said that in your opinion we won't make the playoffs this season (fair enough) but then that is s failure.

Not sure how you can qualify an event as being a failure without that event actually taking place.

Unless you are Nostradamus and please can you tell me this week's winning lottery numbers.

Anyhows it's pretty obvious what you think of Warne so I imagine next season unless we win the league by Xmas then you won't alter any from you standpoint.

I said in his own words that is a failure... which is a direct quote from his in-depth interview with sky sports news. Your whole point is basically picking up on an imprecision in my writing- I meant to say that if we don't make the top 6, which I don't think we will, then that, in his own words, is a failure.

I'm not sure what there is to be really that positive about during his tenure so far? At this level, even in our financially crippled state, you'd expect a club of our size and stature to be in the playoffs. We've generally beaten the teams in the league's bottom half, where our players and our budgets represent a massive gulf between us and the opposition, but against the top half, we've been lacking under Warne. Basically, whenever it's close to a fair fight we really struggle. His ability to affect games or react to tactical tweaks from the opposition has really been lacking and that is uncomfortable and concerning to see. 

There are mitigating circumstances for Warne. I didn't add these, as people have covered them before. This is not his squad, we do lack options in certain areas, and we don't really have players between the ages of 23-29, i.e., players coming into or at their peak. These have produced a set of circumstances where it'd be unreasonable to fire Warne besides simply the length of his contract. Warne is obviously going to be here next season, and if we improve with his batch of players, I'll be the first to be singing from the rooftops and will have no issue admitting I was wrong.

However, my gut tells me this job is simply too big for Warne. Maybe he is a Nathan Jones type of coach- very good in a small club where he can control everything and build a spirit from the tea boy upwards. This is harder to do at a bigger club, where expectations are naturally higher. His record at the championship level sucks, which was also a concern for me when we brought him in. I didn't understand the appointment then, and I don't much now. 

[Archied]

30 minutes ago, The Last Post said:

Now you know as well as me Gee that players follow the cash, Flints at Wednesday not sure whether loan or permanent, Guessing loan as Stoke will be paying some of the big wages he's on...which will be more than we can afford...even for a loan fee and wages that Stoke are helping with.

Archied who posts on here said he was told a deal was on the cards but he couldn't let the cat out of the bag as he'd be in deep shyte, Players are no different in the main to us, Leave your job, Have an interview at a couple of jobs, You've decided on the one job and someone comes in and ups their offer...simple

There's a limited market that we have to deal in...but enough for PW to put a decent fit/physical/good enough team together 👍, As for convincing, A big crowd PP, Moor Farm with it's excellent facilities should be convincing enough if you're hungry enough 🤷‍♀️

That was for the lad Atkinson at Bristol city but he played well in a cup game and got a run in the side, he’s out injured now I believe 

[Jourdan]

1 hour ago, Ambitious said:

If we don't finish in the play-off positions then he's had an absolute s****** in his first season in charge, let's be honest with ourselves here. He will have the opportunity at Derby next season with a full pre-season, allowing him to bring some of his own players into the club, so he will be able to properly put his own stamp on things. 

Next season he will have no excuses for not getting this team competing at the top end of the division and that will have to be the expectation. This season is a free hit, but missing out on the play-offs would be concerning considering how comfortable we were. Nine points in nine games for a Derby County side playing in the third division should be embarrassing to him as a coach and the players, honestly - essentially 20% of our season in relegation form AFTER going nearly going 20 unbeaten. 

If we don’t finish in the play-offs, we just go again next year.

Let go of the entitlement you are obviously carrying and show the league some respect. Promotion has to be earned, not given.

You make it sound like every club of our size and stature dominates the division and goes up at the first time of asking and there are countless examples of actually quite the opposite.

We were in the top six from November to April and we are only out of it on goal difference. We have been competing at the top end of the division, but we are not the only good side in the division and it is no disgrace to be where we are.

Ask the likes of Darren Moore, Kieran McKenna, Steven Schumacher, Michael Duff and Ian Evatt to compete under our restrictions and the response you’d get wouldn’t be a kind one.

Just because we have the best stadium, the best training facilities and the biggest crowds doesn’t mean we are in the best position to succeed.

We are competing against sides who yo-yo between the Championship (Barnsley and Peterborough) and sides who have spent several years coming together (Bolton, Plymouth, Wednesday and Ipswich).

We have no divine right to success in this league.

[Ram-Alf]

1 hour ago, Leeds Ram said:

I said in his own words that is a failure... which is a direct quote from his in-depth interview with sky sports news. Your whole point is basically picking up on an imprecision in my writing- I meant to say that if we don't make the top 6, which I don't think we will, then that, in his own words, is a failure.

 

Wasn't the wording Semi Failure?, Which is not quite failure 🤷‍♀️ 

[IslandExile]

2 hours ago, LeedsCityRam said:

I'm in real conflict about this question. Instinctively I do not like sacking managers & believe the longer they get (particularly at lower levels), the more likely they are to succeed. This is primarily due to being able to get their 'type' of players & culture into the club but this theory also assumes that they are competent in the first place. I wasn't a fan of Rowett or Pearson's style of football either but still believed that both needed more time to deliver their ideas (accept Rowett walked but the club atmosphere was toxic by that point anyway)

On the flip side, I don't necessarily want the kind of athletes at Derby that Warne will need to make his style work & I also worry about the implications for the Academy as @IslandExile has highlighted. I don't enjoy Warne's style of football & there does seem to be some glaring flaws in his ability given the amount of times he has been out-thought by opposition managers in the second half of games. I also do not believe he is getting the maximum from this squad - ideally we want a manager who is able to get his team to out-perform expectations, not the reverse.

That said, I struggle with agitating for the removal of a manager hired by David Clowes - it's all too easy to gloss over our debt to him & therefore I want to give his pick the benefit of the doubt whilst still reasonably pointing out where Warne is falling short currently. 

I don't therefore think I'd be happy if he went at this stage but there needs to be some serious consideration within the club early May as to the long term implications of sticking with Warne. Until then I will support his team to the hilt at games & criticise on here when warranted.

Really nice summary of exactly how I feel. Thanks.

[IlsonDerby]

22 hours ago, VulcanRam said:

I agree with this. When the football is unappealing on the eye, you can get away with it when you're winning. When you're not though, the Emperor's new clothes are shed and what you're left with is really quite depressing. 

Thing is, when we went on that unbeaten run some of the football was a lovely. A real mix between direct play (with intent rather than aimlessly lifting it up field) and passing through the lines. This was only possible because of the accurate direct balls which forced the opposition back creating space for us to play in. Turned into hoof merchants and I reckon I could currently beat most our players in a 40 yard sprint. 
 

Needed to be giving Thompson minutes to keep Hourihane fresh. Needed to be getting more of Dobbin and Osula/Springett on to give NML and Barkhuizen a rest to keep them fresh. If that meant some areas of the pitch were weakened in some games then so be it if it let us carry on the more intense press a bit longer into the season. 

[IlsonDerby]

24 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

If we don’t finish in the play-offs, we just go again next year.

Let go of the entitlement you are obviously carrying and show the league some respect. Promotion has to be earned, not given.

You make it sound like every club of our size and stature dominates the division and goes up at the first time of asking and there are countless examples of actually quite the opposite.

We were in the top six from November to April and we are only out of it on goal difference. We have been competing at the top end of the division, but we are not the only good side in the division and it is no disgrace to be where we are.

Ask the likes of Darren Moore, Kieran McKenna, Steven Schumacher, Michael Duff and Ian Evatt to compete under our restrictions and the response you’d get wouldn’t be a kind one.

Just because we have the best stadium, the best training facilities and the biggest crowds doesn’t mean we are in the best position to succeed.

We are competing against sides who yo-yo between the Championship (Barnsley and Peterborough) and sides who have spent several years coming together (Bolton, Plymouth, Wednesday and Ipswich).

We have no divine right to success in this league.

I don’t disagree with Ambitious. Whilst I never felt that we’d get close to autos once we were 7/8 points clear of 7th place I said to my pals that only relegation form would see us miss out on top 6. 
 

Do we trust a manager currently managing us through relegation form to start next season? For me it’s a tough decision Clowes will have to make. His last 10 matches have been awful and he needs to change our fortunes before the end of the season. I don’t mean this in an entitled way but in a serious way. Look at how often relegated teams struggle the following season because they can’t shake off the habit of losing. We are currently developing that relegation form/habit of losing. Without changing around 60% of the squad (which will have its own drawbacks in terms of hitting the ground running) we’ll be left with a squad used to losing. 

[IlsonDerby]

15 hours ago, David said:

Just out of interest, has anyone already officially moved into the Warne out camp and would genuinely be happy to see a corner flag tweet in the morning announcing his departure?

I wouldn’t actively want that or be calling for it but if it did happen I wouldn’t be surprised or wondering why he’s gone. Relegation form is relegation form. From being 4th and comfortably 7/8 points away from 7th down to 7th is a capitulation by any standards. 
 

I hope he manages to turn our end of season form around. Get the players in that allow us to play a mix of direct football and good passing football with decent ball players and a purposeful well drilled press as we demonstrated could be done during that big unbeaten run. I don’t hope he can do this because I like him, he’s a bit Alan partridge for me. I hope he can do this because he’s our manager on a FOUR!! Year deal and I don’t want to enter a cycle of paying extortionate money to terminate managers contracts again. 

[RodleyRam]

2 hours ago, Ambitious said:

If we don't finish in the play-off positions then he's had an absolute s****** in his first season in charge, let's be honest with ourselves here. He will have the opportunity at Derby next season with a full pre-season, allowing him to bring some of his own players into the club, so he will be able to properly put his own stamp on things. 

Next season he will have no excuses for not getting this team competing at the top end of the division and that will have to be the expectation. This season is a free hit, but missing out on the play-offs would be concerning considering how comfortable we were. Nine points in nine games for a Derby County side playing in the third division should be embarrassing to him as a coach and the players, honestly - essentially 20% of our season in relegation form AFTER going nearly going 20 unbeaten. 

I wonder if the fixtures had fallen differently and we had experienced less feast and famine, our perspectives on his overall performance would be a little more balanced. 

Like you, I'm not overly impressed but it's probably fair to look at the overall position once the season is done. It's easy to take strong point of view when things are going incredibly well or incredibly badly, when the net result of all that is that we are still in the hunt for the 2 final play off places. Most of us would have taken that at the start of the season.

In terms of my own general assessment, it's pointless but inevitable to draw direct comparisons and 'what ifs' with LR.

I really liked the direction LR was taking us, it felt like he wanted to build a football club on a sustainable foundation, embed best practice and consistency etc from the ground up. I liked the brand of football and felt results would have improved once fitness got better and we could increase the tempo etc. For me, that was exactly what I wanted and I was prepared to wait for the return.

In appointing PW and all the 'promotion guru' hyperbole that came with that, the timescales and expectations shifted. Regardless of the rhetoric from DC, it seemed like we were aiming for a quick promotion. The subsequent unbeaten run raised expectations. I think this meant that the massive dip in form from February felt a lot more painful and disappointing. As I say above, I think this will make any assessment right now imbalanced.

However, I'm going to wade into an assessment anyway! I can see some fundamental flaws in PW's approach to date.

The desire to play like a basketball team is great when you can net your 3 points but if you miss or they intercept you're exposed. The amount of times we've been caught on the break and persevered with the same headless chicken routine is concerning. 

February in any league is all about fitness, game management and grinding out results where necessary. The perseverance with chaos-ball with the age profile and unwillingness to rotate our squad has to be questioned.

The seeming inability to adapt or respond to the opposition and their tactics is also a little concerning.

PW sounds proud that we've used the fewest players and you could argue that we have a small squad, so it's inevitable. However, there are players who have had limited game time, Sibbo, Thompson, Rooney, Barks, Osula, Springett who could all have played more minutes without reducing the quality of the side too much and given other players a rest. The chickens have come home to roost on this in the last month as some of them look jaded to say the least.

I want him to be able to see these things and demonstrate he's doing something about it. The concern is that his solution to all of these issues is expecting the players to run about more.

All this said, I think we need to accept the circumstances and restraints on PW. Yes, I think he should be able to get this squad into the playoffs, and he still might.

However, if we don't make it, I don't think it's time to wield the axe. I genuinely think we have to give him next season and possibly until Christmas the following season to get the club where he wants it to be. Unless we are miles off challenging next season, I honestly don't think changing the manager is the right course of action.

He's a likeable guy and I want him to succeed.

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

46 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

If we don’t finish in the play-offs, we just go again next year.

Let go of the entitlement you are obviously carrying and show the league some respect. Promotion has to be earned, not given.

You make it sound like every club of our size and stature dominates the division and goes up at the first time of asking and there are countless examples of actually quite the opposite.

We were in the top six from November to April and we are only out of it on goal difference. We have been competing at the top end of the division, but we are not the only good side in the division and it is no disgrace to be where we are.

Ask the likes of Darren Moore, Kieran McKenna, Steven Schumacher, Michael Duff and Ian Evatt to compete under our restrictions and the response you’d get wouldn’t be a kind one.

Just because we have the best stadium, the best training facilities and the biggest crowds doesn’t mean we are in the best position to succeed.

We are competing against sides who yo-yo between the Championship (Barnsley and Peterborough) and sides who have spent several years coming together (Bolton, Plymouth, Wednesday and Ipswich).

We have no divine right to success in this league.

There's an argument to suggest having a totally different mind set as a player may see us do better than we are.  We're a team that shouldn't be in this division .  The various admin posts from different teams when they get a result against suggest that .  Rob Hindmarch gave a team talk along these lines when Derby were wobbling last time they were promoted from this league.  Humility gets you nowhere in this league but beat

[Oldben]

2 hours ago, Leeds Ram said:

I said in his own words that is a failure... which is a direct quote from his in-depth interview with sky sports news. Your whole point is basically picking up on an imprecision in my writing- I meant to say that if we don't make the top 6, which I don't think we will, then that, in his own words, is a failure.

I'm not sure what there is to be really that positive about during his tenure so far? At this level, even in our financially crippled state, you'd expect a club of our size and stature to be in the playoffs. We've generally beaten the teams in the league's bottom half, where our players and our budgets represent a massive gulf between us and the opposition, but against the top half, we've been lacking under Warne. Basically, whenever it's close to a fair fight we really struggle. His ability to affect games or react to tactical tweaks from the opposition has really been lacking and that is uncomfortable and concerning to see. 

There are mitigating circumstances for Warne. I didn't add these, as people have covered them before. This is not his squad, we do lack options in certain areas, and we don't really have players between the ages of 23-29, i.e., players coming into or at their peak. These have produced a set of circumstances where it'd be unreasonable to fire Warne besides simply the length of his contract. Warne is obviously going to be here next season, and if we improve with his batch of players, I'll be the first to be singing from the rooftops and will have no issue admitting I was wrong.

However, my gut tells me this job is simply too big for Warne. Maybe he is a Nathan Jones type of coach- very good in a small club where he can control everything and build a spirit from the tea boy upwards. This is harder to do at a bigger club, where expectations are naturally higher. His record at the championship level sucks, which was also a concern for me when we brought him in. I didn't understand the appointment then, and I don't much now. 

The issue is many fans still see the club as a big club, rather than a club trying to rebuild.

Doing the rebuild on free agents and loan players.

Not recognising that there are some teams of better quality than derby given the current situation.

If we want to get promoted we need a stronger team, given that we nearly went bankrupt, we have come along way.

I think given the club's issues, warne has done a brilliant job.

I don't see us promoted this season or next, I do see us promoted when we can buy some talent to improve the team.

How can warne get success for the club given the restrictions.

Next season several new teams enter the league, with teams that are reasonably decent at this level.

Derby had to bring in a lot of new players last season, just to be allowed to play in the league because the squad was too small.

This summer more talent will leave us.

[duncanjwitham]

3 hours ago, LeedsCityRam said:

I'm in real conflict about this question. Instinctively I do not like sacking managers & believe the longer they get (particularly at lower levels), the more likely they are to succeed. This is primarily due to being able to get their 'type' of players & culture into the club but this theory also assumes that they are competent in the first place. I wasn't a fan of Rowett or Pearson's style of football either but still believed that both needed more time to deliver their ideas (accept Rowett walked but the club atmosphere was toxic by that point anyway)

This is actually one of my biggest arguments against Warne (and likewise Pearson, Rowett and any other manager that needs to radically reshape the squad to achieve anything).  I think the only way we're ever going to have any kind of sustained success is by relying on the academy (and for a club like us, 'success' probably means getting into the Prem and staying there, I'm not talking about winning the league or anything).  We probably aren't ever going to be in a position where we can compete on money-terms, so we're going to have to develop our own players instead.  And that means taking the long-view about what kind of club you want to be, what kind of football you want to play etc.  There's no point having an academy full of technical midfielders and tricky wingers, if your first team manager is playing 352 and just run around a lot (or vice versa, of course).  You need the entire club pulling in the same direction, and that will never happen if you keep switching managerial styles, bearing in mind it takes like 5-10 years for a player to progress through the academy.

Mel Morris's "Derby Way" stuff was one of the few things he was right about, it's just a shame he seemed to have no clue how to make it actually happen.  We *should* be wanting to have half the team filled with academy players, and we should be actively trying to make that happen.

For clarity, I'm not saying a manager shouldn't be able to put his own spin on things, but you can't go lurching between Pearson, McClaren, Rowett, Lampard and expect any kind of consistency or long-term progress.  We should have some rough idea of how we want to play, and only appoint managers who are going to play something close to that style.  If we'd gone e.g. McClaren, Wassall, Lampard, Cocu, Rooney, Rosenior, we'd be in a much better position, as they all played roughly similar styles of football, in roughly similar formations.  And we wouldn't have had a guy paying £12m+ for Vydra and Anya, and then the next guy not really wanting to use either of them.

[Ambitious]

1 hour ago, Jourdan said:

If we don’t finish in the play-offs, we just go again next year.

Let go of the entitlement you are obviously carrying and show the league some respect. Promotion has to be earned, not given.

You make it sound like every club of our size and stature dominates the division and goes up at the first time of asking and there are countless examples of actually quite the opposite.

We were in the top six from November to April and we are only out of it on goal difference. We have been competing at the top end of the division, but we are not the only good side in the division and it is no disgrace to be where we are.

Ask the likes of Darren Moore, Kieran McKenna, Steven Schumacher, Michael Duff and Ian Evatt to compete under our restrictions and the response you’d get wouldn’t be a kind one.

Just because we have the best stadium, the best training facilities and the biggest crowds doesn’t mean we are in the best position to succeed.

We are competing against sides who yo-yo between the Championship (Barnsley and Peterborough) and sides who have spent several years coming together (Bolton, Plymouth, Wednesday and Ipswich).

We have no divine right to success in this league.

I wouldn’t say it’s a sense of entitlement, because I’ve seen how good this team is and how good they can be - this season. I’m not directing my frustration on the lack of quality within the squad, more so that as soon as the going got tough we have seemingly crumbled and the performance against Ipswich was as disjointed as I can remember seeing. 

Warne is a manager that I misjudged massively, in all honesty, because I assumed he would be a smart game manager and take a pragmatic approach. He does the complete opposite which is great when you’re winning, but just comes across as naive when you aren’t.

If we had been lower midtable and now looking to be in the playoffs come the end of the season, the view would be different (of course). However, from where we’ve been and how we’ve performed this season, anything other than a playoff finish would mean we’ve bottled it based on a run of games that has seen the likes of Burton and Cheltenham massively out perform us. Largely, in my opinion, not due to the quality of the team but the game management of the coaching staff. We absolutely battered Peterborough, the players on our team absolutely were superior footballers in every sense, yet we lacked any craft on the edge of the box and got caught with men over after our own corner to go 1-0 down.

Everyone will have their own standard and expectation, mine is built on what I’ve seen from us this season and what I’ve seen of the league this season. If I was being more honest with myself then I honestly have no idea how any decent manager could struggle to get this Derby team into the playoffs, honestly. I would be disappointed with anything other than a top 6 finish and really it would need to be looked at as to why we allowed a very comfortable position slip.

[May Contain Nuts]

1 hour ago, RodleyRam said:

I wonder if the fixtures had fallen differently and we had experienced less feast and famine, our perspectives on his overall performance would be a little more balanced. 

Like you, I'm not overly impressed but it's probably fair to look at the overall position once the season is done. It's easy to take strong point of view when things are going incredibly well or incredibly badly, when the net result of all that is that we are still in the hunt for the 2 final play off places. Most of us would have taken that at the start of the season.

In terms of my own general assessment, it's pointless but inevitable to draw direct comparisons and 'what ifs' with LR.

I really liked the direction LR was taking us, it felt like he wanted to build a football club on a sustainable foundation, embed best practice and consistency etc from the ground up. I liked the brand of football and felt results would have improved once fitness got better and we could increase the tempo etc. For me, that was exactly what I wanted and I was prepared to wait for the return.

In appointing PW and all the 'promotion guru' hyperbole that came with that, the timescales and expectations shifted. Regardless of the rhetoric from DC, it seemed like we were aiming for a quick promotion. The subsequent unbeaten run raised expectations. I think this meant that the massive dip in form from February felt a lot more painful and disappointing. As I say above, I think this will make any assessment right now imbalanced.

However, I'm going to wade into an assessment anyway! I can see some fundamental flaws in PW's approach to date.

The desire to play like a basketball team is great when you can net your 3 points but if you miss or they intercept you're exposed. The amount of times we've been caught on the break and persevered with the same headless chicken routine is concerning. 

February in any league is all about fitness, game management and grinding out results where necessary. The perseverance with chaos-ball with the age profile and unwillingness to rotate our squad has to be questioned.

The seeming inability to adapt or respond to the opposition and their tactics is also a little concerning.

PW sounds proud that we've used the fewest players and you could argue that we have a small squad, so it's inevitable. However, there are players who have had limited game time, Sibbo, Thompson, Rooney, Barks, Osula, Springett who could all have played more minutes without reducing the quality of the side too much and given other players a rest. The chickens have come home to roost on this in the last month as some of them look jaded to say the least.

I want him to be able to see these things and demonstrate he's doing something about it. The concern is that his solution to all of these issues is expecting the players to run about more.

All this said, I think we need to accept the circumstances and restraints on PW. Yes, I think he should be able to get this squad into the playoffs, and he still might.

However, if we don't make it, I don't think it's time to wield the axe. I genuinely think we have to give him next season and possibly until Christmas the following season to get the club where he wants it to be. Unless we are miles off challenging next season, I honestly don't think changing the manager is the right course of action.

He's a likeable guy and I want him to succeed.

Excellent post and not just because I agree with the entire thing.

It's easier to take the basis of what Rosenior was doing and add some extra pace / impetus to it than it is to gather together a bunch of athletes and then mould them into a team who play good football.

Lots of use of the use of the word concern/concerning too. It's not writing off the chance for Warne to improve but you'd have hoped that more of the concerns initially laid out about him would already have proven unfounded, or at least lessened to a considerable degree, but they're mostly still there, fully intact.

1 hour ago, RodleyRam said:

The concern is that his solution to all of these issues is expecting the players to run about more.

The annoying thing is that this was painfully obvious just listening to the Moment of Truth podcast where there was little answer to Rotherham's slump other than to shout at them to work harder and do the things they'd practised better. Yes they got round it eventually, but it wasn't really due to any new ideas, no tactical alterations or awakening (at least not from what I can remember) and there were admissions along the way of not really knowing what else to do.

The concerns were still poking their heads out even during our undefeated run, but any prescient warnings that we'd come unstuck once the quality of opposition broadly increased were met with disdain by certain folk who wished not to hear it.

We all hope that Warne is capable of improvement and will become a success here, not by turning us into Rotherham 2.0 but by learning and adapting with us as we go.