Is Warne living on borrowed time?

[S8TY]

I like Warne but the big worry is we need radical change in how we play , like keeping the ball on the floor a bit more and some movement

I can't think of many if any managers that change there own ideals and adopt a different strategy and basically tear up there own methods which have brought them success but this is exactly what he needs to do

He is a Derby County manager in League1 with all of the pressure that goes with that and has or did have better players than what he's been used to, therefore he needed to bring with him his passion and desire to win but also be flexible enough to use the better players he has at his disposal, we are not a Rotherham punching above our weight we are a bigger club with higher expectations and i hope he changes his philosophy of how he wants us to play....but I personally have my doubts now 

[Barney1991]

1 hour ago, Malty said:

Warne got relegated with Rotherham and then promoted. So he’s gone from failure to success in the past.

He’s inherited a squad with no depth, a threadbare team and a dreadful youth team.
 

They needed  a total rebuild and it will take time.

I don’t like his tactics at home. He hasn’t proven to me that he has any kind of coherent plan B, home or  away.

However, I don’t want him out. I want us to give him time to sort it out and that could be at least a year from now. But if that’s what it needs it is what it is.

I don’t think anyone out there would do the job better.

Unfortunately we are saddled with him. So we just have to make the most of it and try and cheer the team on as much as we can.

Doesn't help with the rebuild that we are getting turned down by players left right and centre for other league one clubs who we have been linked too. Had players available and either do not have to brain to go for them or they went elsewhere and some players in mind are harris, regan poole, lloyd jones. Even camara on loan from ipswich would have been a shout. Out f the players we have got we have signed the likes of washington and curtis nelson so would i trust warne with 2 years worth of rebuilding? No i wouldn't 

The playing style is totally devoid of any sort of entertainment football wise that we don't even use the midfield. Even a sunday league team can move into space to receive the ball yet we don't even do that. ALso when will he get it into his head hourihane is not a defensive midfielder is beyond me. He couldn't tackle a sunday lunch never mind a tackle on the pitch. Stick him further forward and drop bird back and play thompson instead of smith and have 2 legs to get forward. When hourihane finally got forward against burton he scored like he did last season. 

[eddielewis]

We need footballing continuity but that shouldn't rest solely on the manager as it seems to be under Paul Warne. When Clowes saved the club I thought as although he's devout fan he's a total novice when comes to running a football club (do not take it as dig at him) and it would be sensible to recruit Chief exec/General Manager first before recruiting a Head Coach. Follow a similar modern method to Brentford/Brighton even Luton where they set the stall of a philosophy/style of play from under 16's to all the way to the seniors and signing of players and your just letting the Head Coach... coach and if that coach isn't doing well find another who matches the system. That's how the aforementioned teams have managed to press on even though their influential managers might have gone.

It's just seems weird and disjointed to me at least how you recruit a Head of Recruitment after the Manager only to let Paul Warne have total free reign over the signings over this summer who have no real re-sale value to them. If you look at Mark Thomas at Oxford it seems there was a focus to claim lads who just were let go from big clubs who over maybe after 1-2 seasons you could sell them on. 

Also i'm intrigued meaning as we should be and are determined to keep the Youth cat 1 are we going to change the philosophy of the playing style of the youth to match the 1st team. Over the years the Under 18s/21s have played 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 with a real focus of steady possession build up play and that's resulted in us having so many youth players doing well in the 1st team. You would expect that in 2/3 years time the youth talent should have recovered from the decimation of admin but it would be all for nothing if a youth player is talented for the 1st team and they can't fit in because the system or their role they are asked is so alien to them. Both Bird and Cashin are early examples of this.

It's still early days this season but it not only looks disjointed on the pitch but also off it. 

 

[hughesy 1984]

Apart from Ward, all players brought in by Warne don’t seem to be at the required standard. 

Signing players like Washington, who has always been bang average at best. Then wondering why we look poor in attack. 
 

Strikes as no ambition, as he’s used to at Rotherham 

Fozzy has been a great servant to the club, but surely shouldn’t be starting LWB at his age ? 

The type of football we are playing is terrible to watch. Also unsure of what we are trying to actually do ? 

Also signing old non mobile players then saying in interviews we need pace? 

can’t see Warne lasting long if we continue to play as we are. 

Darren Moore was at last nights game. Would take him for Warne in a heartbeat. As he understands the expectations of the club 

[jimtastic56]

1 hour ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

I posted the original thread up as a bit of tongue in cheek, not so funny, humor.

I didn't share the optimism of many, I felt we had more than enough in our squad to make the playoffs, at least, last season.  I blamed Warne for tinkering with the team, taking Barkhuizen out when he was in a good run of scoring form and failing to strengthen in January, amongst other things.  January was the biggest alarm bell for me, after going on about January being like Christmas shopping only to get White from Spurs and Springett from his mates at Norwich.  I wondered if we had a manager who struggled in transfer windows, tries to be too clever, poor in his initial meetings with players or is too picky?

This transfer window has shown similar.  A penny for our new recruitment fellas thoughts.  I imagine he has presented a dossier of players to Warne only to be hit with words like wrong Ethos, Commitment & Attitude.

Now, I expected Warne to be gone by next season, I believed he would be found out eventually, but I honestly didn't expect things to be this bad this quick.  As Warne keeps trying to allude to, something has happened, there is something we the fans aren't aware of, that Warne is desperate to get off his chest, but isn't allowed to.  His little hints aren't helping him or us to be fair.

If and when Warne goes, honestly this will be the one that hurts the most.  I know we are desperate for stability, to have a manager like Eddie Howe or Shaun Dyche that stays with us for years and takes us to the top.  I was hoping Warne would be that man, but it is very obvious that won't be the case.

This is the biggest point from all of this, next season is ABSOLUTELY MASSIVE for this club.  We will be almost with a clean slate, restrictions lifted and finances in order, if we were to be promoted this season, with a clean P&S sheet and improved revenue, the sky is the limited.

Clowes will be very well aware of that and as much as sacking him now is gonna hurt, if he doesn't do it now, it could end up setting the club back years.

 

 

 

Sorry to disagree but I don’t think that the “Sky is the limit”, for DCFC without a Billionaire owner . Mike Ashley spent £100 mill to get Newcastle up and they had 50k crowds , then they struggled for years. The Arabs came in and took them to the top 4 level. Luton won’t last 5 minutes without investment . It could be mid table stability in the Championship for years to come.

[Addingham Ram]

34 minutes ago, Barney1991 said:

Doesn't help with the rebuild that we are getting turned down by players left right and centre for other league one clubs who we have been linked too. Had players available and either do not have to brain to go for them or they went elsewhere and some players in mind are harris, regan poole, lloyd jones. Even camara on loan from ipswich would have been a shout. Out f the players we have got we have signed the likes of washington and curtis nelson so would i trust warne with 2 years worth of rebuilding? No i wouldn't 

The playing style is totally devoid of any sort of entertainment football wise that we don't even use the midfield. Even a sunday league team can move into space to receive the ball yet we don't even do that. ALso when will he get it into his head hourihane is not a defensive midfielder is beyond me. He couldn't tackle a sunday lunch never mind a tackle on the pitch. Stick him further forward and drop bird back and play thompson instead of smith and have 2 legs to get forward. When hourihane finally got forward against burton he scored like he did last season. 

There is a conundrum here.

You are right, we seemed to completely bypass the midfield last night. Everything went down the wings, then into the forwards (or should I correct that to onto their No.5's head!).

So putting Hourihane further up the pitch simply means he would be totally bypassed by our game plan. Perhaps Warne playing Hourihane as a DM is the only way he can get him on the ball.

What frustrated me most last night, was the number of times Hourihane dropped back to take the ball off one of our 3 CBs, from no more than about 5 yards, only to smack it upfield. It looked like he was playing as an additional CB at times when we had the ball.

it's no wonder we were being completely overrun everywhere on the pitch. The way we set up was just bizarre!

[Ram-Alf]

1 hour ago, Gerry Daly said:

No it doesn’t take time. Or at least it doesn’t take loads of time. He has been here a year. Arthur Cox inherited at least as bad a situation playing staff wise. In my opinion we were much weaker in 1984 than we were when Warne was appointed. Within one season Cox had us motoring. And in 4 seasons we finished 5th in the old first division. From a slightly higher start point Jim Smith made rapid progress. With very little money so did George Burley. This chump has made no progress whatsoever in fact we have deteriorated. Clowes has seen the same stuff I have seen so he knows what can be done and what reasonable progress looks like and what timeframes it can be expected

PW is hunting in what I can only describe as a very small availability market, Someone with character, Honesty, Doesn't tell lies and is good at what PW is looking for...on the pitch...and more, A poster alluded on a thread that if he thought Waghorn was of...shall we say "bad character" how many has he crossed off his list because he's heard this and that...Waghorn was a fluke as he came he saw he conquered and was given a years contract.

This last week PW hasn't done anything of note to convince myself he can turn this run of 3 home defeats around, And in all honesty...I don't think the players are on board with 3 poor home performances.   

[Steve How Hard?]

7 hours ago, Steve Buckley’s Dog said:

We thought we had the League 1 Guardiola 

Turns out we got Phil Brown in disguise 

 Bradley and Nelson at the back

He’s going to get the sack

Paul Warne’s brand of football hurts my eyes

 

I have been singing that this morning. Unfortunately gallows humour has not lifted my spirit.
 

I have of late, but wherefore I know not, lost all my mirth.

We've got the League Mike Bassett 

He hasn't got a feckin clue

The footballs really lame

We struggle to win a game

Derby's gonna end up in League 2

[Malagaram]

3 hours ago, littleover ram said:

Emma Hayes said she was insulted to be linked with then League One Wimbledon as she was managing Chelsea at the Woman’s Champions League level. What makes you think we could attract an international level manager?  

Bu we are Derby

[Brammie Steve]

This season is right up the creek!

Three losses in less than two weeks

And even Paul Warne

Is sounding forlorn 

And blaming the team when he speaks!

 

The Rams are now acting so tame

No longer enjoying the game

What used to be fun

Is just tip and run

And hope someone else gets the blame

 

EFL dropped us in League one

Unfairly when all’s said and done

“We’ll quickly get out!”

You heard us all shout

We Will to league two

Me owd son
 

My rose coloured glasses have slipped

The lenses are frosted and chipped

The frames are distorted

And cannot be sorted

My confidence level has dipped!

 

COYR come on you Rams

Stop playing like frightened young lambs

We won’t get downhearted 

We’ve only just started

We’ve often got over such jams!

 

[Carl Sagan]

If I were Clowes I would be sounding out Chris Wilder, to see if manager and club can rehabilitate each other to mutual benefit. With a modest salary but big promotion bonuses. He's the best candidate out there in terms of ability and a sort of continuity with Warne ball, in terms of the high-pressing high-energy game. And if someone else snaps him up first, I would be gutted.

I very much like Warne as a man, but am losing faith in him as a football manager. From the catastrophic failure not making the playoffs on...

Obviously the issue is that DC, without any vast wealth, bought a League One football club for the price of a Premier League/Championship yo-yo club. Without him we wouldn't have a club. The only way not to lose even more of his small fortune is to take us into the Championship and sell us someone with deeper pockets. But, with three years left on that contract, it seems unlikely he can afford to pay Warne and the others off. But can he afford not to? I'm consoled that it's often darkest before the dawn, as things look pretty dark right now. 

[duncanjwitham]

Just now, Carl Sagan said:

If I were Clowes I would be sounding out Chris Wilder, to see if manager and club can rehabilitate each other to mutual benefit. With a modest salary but big promotion bonuses. He's the best candidate out there in terms of ability and a sort of continuity with Warne ball, in terms of the high-pressing high-energy game. And if someone else snaps him up first, I would be gutted.

That’s all well and good, but we don’t look remotely capable of playing that style of football with this squad. If we’re getting a new manager in, it’s going to have to be someone that can work with what we have, not what some people wish we have.

[eddielewis]

8 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

That’s all well and good, but we don’t look remotely capable of playing that style of football with this squad. If we’re getting a new manager in, it’s going to have to be someone that can work with what we have, not what some people wish we have.

To add also with Wilder you could argue that his time in management has been and gone with his time at Sheff Utd. He managed his boyhood team taking them up from League 1 to the Prem. He fitted ethos and culture of Sheff Utd. He looked lost at Boro and at Watford. Does he have it in him to do the whole thing again. I doubt it. We're kind of facing the same predicament with Warne. Is his success at Rotherham down to fact he knew how the club operated having played there most his career and is it transferable here? It doesn't look like it so far.

How I see it if Warne doesn't last Clowes needs to figure out what style of football the fans want (could argue that most fans are used to and want 4-2-3-1/4-3-3 and play football on deck), how we recruit, and how can we stick to the plans if the manager needs to be changed because at the moment it just seems he gave the keys to shop to Warne on the basis of history of 3 promotions from league 1.

[SamUltraRam]

On the Rotherham forum, they are talking about the Warne situation

Here are a few of the comments :

"Having lived in Derby for the last 15 years, I decided to watch this on Rams TV.

It was really dire stuff and there were times when I thought I was watching Rotherham again in the Warne era. They play exactly like we did under Warne. That probably comes as little surprise but it genuinely had Warne written all over it. Even their goal reminded me of us. Basically came from a long throw which was allowed to bounce, defence failed to clear it and Waghorn swept it in. Following that it was just balls lumped into the box. Very little craft, in fact very little anything.

I wish PW well but he's got work to do to turn this around."

..................................................

"There are patterns developing. The burn out at the end of the season cos players knacked, signing unfit players, no plan b on pitch, not being able to string two passes together, not being able to sign players he wants."

..................................................

"Derby were 'nailed on' for promotion up until late March last year and capitulated towards the end of the season and never even made the play-offs! For many of us, that came of no surprise, but for the Derby fans it was a shock to the system that now is rearing it's ugly head!"

[Ghost of Clough]

Just spoke to a friend of the girlfriend of one of the players. They tell a story if broken promises and bemusement of those promises not being met. Sounds like the dressing room (or at least some members of it) doesn't trust Warne anymore.

[hintonsboots]

9 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Just spoke to a friend of the girlfriend of one of the players. They tell a story if broken promises and bemusement of those promises not being met. Sounds like the dressing room (or at least some members of it) doesn't trust Warne anymore.

Any information on what the promises are/ were ?

[IslandExile]

3 minutes ago, hintonsboots said:

Any information on what the promises are/ were ?

Coffee cup?

[hintonsboots]

6 minutes ago, IslandExile said:

Coffee cup?

What else as Clooney would say .

[sage]

6 hours ago, Gerry Daly said:

No it doesn’t take time. Or at least it doesn’t take loads of time. He has been here a year. Arthur Cox inherited at least as bad a situation playing staff wise. In my opinion we were much weaker in 1984 than we were when Warne was appointed. Within one season Cox had us motoring. And in 4 seasons we finished 5th in the old first division. From a slightly higher start point Jim Smith made rapid progress. With very little money so did George Burley. This chump has made no progress whatsoever in fact we have deteriorated. Clowes has seen the same stuff I have seen so he knows what can be done and what reasonable progress looks like and what timeframes it can be expected

Cox inherited a much smaller squad. 

Blades Buckley Devine Burns Garner Powell Robertson Davison Wilson. 

9 players, 4 of which were facing their last season

 

[Ghost of Clough]

10 minutes ago, hintonsboots said:

Any information on what the promises are/ were ?

Without being too specific and singling the player out, it is game time and/or the position they're being played.