Long Keogh piece in the Guardian

[seths-cap]

4 minutes ago, rusgb said:

Whilst I often disagree with some comments on here, the general view is normally shared. This is completely different for me. I am on the side of Keogh more than the club. 

He is a young (in all real world comparisons) footballer who has grown up in the football vacuum. You only need look at Rooney to see the poor decisions people in the vacuum can make. I believe the Club have a huge responsibility to nurture and shield these players. I look at this situation and I can only blame the club. It was a team event, these players are worth a lot of money the Club should have looked after them better, it's that simple. 

I employ a small team, if I organised a pi$$ up and some had driven I would be certain to make sure nobody drove home! Whilst they are valuable to be they are not multimillion pound footballers. 

I personally think sacking Keogh was disgraceful, whatever you feel about his ability as a footballer that's irrelevant. Imagine this was your workplace, switch the names and see how you would feel. He deserves his payout. For Lawrence to be retained and now be captain must make Keogh feel sick. 

Just to be clear, I am a Derby fan, love the club, but feel strongly that the Club was disgraceful in this case. 

Morning Richard

[Crewton]

The only other thing I'm going to say is that if his team captain (and "good friend") didn't know that, at that time, Tom Lawrence had a drink problem related to his mental health issues, then I'm the Queen of Romania. 

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

This was Richard when he woke from his unconsciousness 

?

?

? (where there’s a blame, there’s a claim) 

[ramit]

i must say, Keogh surprises me there, didn't think he could sink much lower.

[Ram-Alf]

I'm in Derby General Hospital ward 51, After having heart surgery, Ther surgeon says i'm a lucky fella...as the amount of blood loss from my bleeding heart after reading this next production of Jackanory could have meant me having no heart at all for fallen football players.

1. He goes into the Joiners Arms with other Derby players...OK

2. He never saw Tom Lawrence...OK

3. He wasn't overly intoxicated after the death of his Nan...OK

4. He gets into a 4x4 as there were other players in the 4x4...OK

5. He didn't think Tom was Rat Arsed...OK

6. Ambulance personel tells him he's been in a RTA...OK

7. He was in incredible pain...OK

8. Derby sacked him for Gross misconduct...OK

9. He never thought of suicide...OK

So in just those 9 short observations...who was actually at fault Mr Keogh? Telling all and sundry might clear your conscience, But in essense it's all down to you...OK!

 

 

 

[Foreveram]

25 minutes ago, rusgb said:

Whilst I often disagree with some comments on here, the general view is normally shared. This is completely different for me. I am on the side of Keogh more than the club. 

He is a young (in all real world comparisons) footballer who has grown up in the football vacuum. You only need look at Rooney to see the poor decisions people in the vacuum can make. I believe the Club have a huge responsibility to nurture and shield these players. I look at this situation and I can only blame the club. It was a team event, these players are worth a lot of money the Club should have looked after them better, it's that simple. 

I employ a small team, if I organised a pi$$ up and some had driven I would be certain to make sure nobody drove home! Whilst they are valuable to be they are not multimillion pound footballers. 

I personally think sacking Keogh was disgraceful, whatever you feel about his ability as a footballer that's irrelevant. Imagine this was your workplace, switch the names and see how you would feel. He deserves his payout. For Lawrence to be retained and now be captain must make Keogh feel sick. 

Just to be clear, I am a Derby fan, love the club, but feel strongly that the Club was disgraceful in this case. 

How would you feel if one of your employees wanted two million pounds off you cos you didn’t look after them on a night out

[GboroRam]

Sounds like he's preparing for X factor with that sob story. 

[Kennington Ram]

Club should have been smarter than to leave itself vulnerable to being successfully sued by him, but this is a shoddy piece of journalism.

At no stage does the author question whether any of this is untrue.

Which most of it is! There are literally videos and photos from the night in competing papers that say otherwise.

I feel bad for his mental health issues, but i question whether the life coach is helping him to improve as a person if he is happy to front up to a national paper and lie to keep his career going.

For me, not welcome at the club again  while I'm a fan.

[Grumpy Git]

We should all give him a proper "welcome" on 11th Dec.

[sage]

2 hours ago, kevinhectoring said:

Well don’t forget this is Guardian readers you’re talking about 

Yeah if only it was in The Sun

[Mucker1884]

40 minutes ago, rusgb said:

Whilst I often disagree with some comments on here, the general view is normally shared. This is completely different for me. I am on the side of Keogh more than the club. 

He is a young (in all real world comparisons) footballer who has grown up in the football vacuum. You only need look at Rooney to see the poor decisions people in the vacuum can make. I believe the Club have a huge responsibility to nurture and shield these players. I look at this situation and I can only blame the club. It was a team event, these players are worth a lot of money the Club should have looked after them better, it's that simple. 

I employ a small team, if I organised a pi$$ up and some had driven I would be certain to make sure nobody drove home! Whilst they are valuable to be they are not multimillion pound footballers. 

I personally think sacking Keogh was disgraceful, whatever you feel about his ability as a footballer that's irrelevant. Imagine this was your workplace, switch the names and see how you would feel. He deserves his payout. For Lawrence to be retained and now be captain must make Keogh feel sick. 

Just to be clear, I am a Derby fan, love the club, but feel strongly that the Club was disgraceful in this case. 

I don't agree that employers should be responsible for for nurturing and shielding of their employees outside of the working environment/hours, which that evening was.

It was not a team event.  It was a social event... voluntary... outside of working hours... outside of working jurisdiction... the aftermath of a team event, which had already ended.  (The club of course, did not order all full grown adults to immediately go home, and go to bed, at 8pm!)

If you organised a works pi$$ up, that would have no relevance to this situation, as it was not a works pi$$ up.  See above.

?

[vivalafiga46]

Keogh is a disgrace.

Mel gets criticised for sacking only Keogh, but to be fair, Mel's hand was forced. Sacking all 3 made no sense for the club.

Losing the Keogh tribunal was the worst case scenario and the money was gone whichever way you look at it, either on Keogh's wages or a settlement. Sacking all three would have thrown away the large investment made in Lawrence and Bennett - transfer fees, academy development and wages - and any value they retained as an asset.

Keogh's self-inflicted injury finished him there and then as a 'top' Championship CB that could command the £25k/wk in his contract. Lawrence and Bennett retained a value and were still physically capable of performing in their roles. 

We could have gone down that season due to a shortage of CB's, and that entitled idiot would have kept on collecting his money. If we had sacked all 3, we would have also been short in attacking areas. 

If Keogh had any sense of duty to the club and the fans, he would have accepted the generous reduced terms offered and got his head down. He didn't, and the world saw his true colours. We lost a key member of the first XI and a top earner through their own conduct, yet retained the liability for their wages and were unable to replace the loss to the team. 

I'm glad Keogh was sacked. It makes me sick that the entitled so and so was rewarded for his disgraceful behavior. Its even more galling that he considers he has some kind of moral high ground.

I can't stand the sight of him anymore.

Mel's biggest mistake on this one is that had this happened at Middlesbrough, Gibson would have sued the breweries and car manufacturers for costing them promotion.

[May Contain Nuts]

33 minutes ago, Kennington Ram said:

Which most of it is! There are literally videos and photos from the night in competing papers that say otherwise.

Can you tell me what these vids show please, and how they directly contradict the story in the paper?

I've only seen the ones of Bennett vomitting and tbh I can't really remember the full details of that.

I'm not asking as a means of defending Keogh, quite the opposite

Edited October 2, 2021 by Coconut's Beard

[seths-cap]

You swerve to the left
You swerve to the right
A lift from a drunk lad
Will duck up your life

[StockholmRam]

Im no expert in employment law. However, if I was to go out drinking and put myself into a situation with my work colleagues where I ended up injured and unable to do my job for many months Im pretty sure id expect to lose my job. 

[Kennington Ram]

36 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

Can you tell me what these vids show please, and how they directly contradict the story in the paper?

I've only seen the ones of Bennett vomitting and tbh I can't really remember the full details of that.

I'm not asking as a means of defending Keogh, quite the opposite

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10017522/Derby-county-crash-shock-new-footage-players-slumped-chair-drink-drive-smash-arrest/

I mean, I suppose you cannot clearly see Keogh in this video (although The Sun says you can?), but you can see Lawrence is pissed and Bennett is passed out drunk. The Derby players appear to be together in a group.

Having been to the Joiners a fair few times, where is Keogh supposed to be then to be unaware of this?

 The journo should have done some homework.

[kevinhectoring]

3 hours ago, angieram said:

Who are actually more likely to empathise with the twenty people made redundant than an overpaid footballer? Your comment doesn't make sense.

No. More likely to sympathise with an emotionally traumatised young man than a billionaire   

[May Contain Nuts]

4 minutes ago, Kennington Ram said:

 

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10017522/Derby-county-crash-shock-new-footage-players-slumped-chair-drink-drive-smash-arrest/

I mean, I suppose you cannot clearly see Keogh in this video (although The Sun says you can?), but you can see Lawrence is pissed and Bennett is passed out drunk. The Derby players appear to be together in a group.

Having been to the Joiners a fair few times, where is Keogh supposed to be then to be unaware of this?

 The journo should have done some homework.

Unfortunately that isn't irrefutable evidence you could use to nail someone for lying, but thanks all the same ?

[Kennington Ram]

2 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

Unfortunately that isn't irrefutable evidence you could use to nail someone for lying, but thanks all the same ?

You are right, it isn't irrefutable, but it suggests Keogh's story is completely implausible, to the point where a decent hack should have done some work before printing it in a national. It's sort of their job?

[rammieib]

3 hours ago, DCFC27 said:

Another cost saving shower of **** from Morris. Honestly the man has made Derby look terrible for years. Keogh was a great servant of the club. He made a big mistake but, they all did and they all deserved the same punishment. 

Two could fulfil their contract, one couldn’t with injuries caused away from work in a reckless way.

Even in hindsight, it was the correct call from the club.