Long Keogh piece in the Guardian

[Anag Ram]

13 hours ago, Rev said:

If Keogh was knocked out in the accident, how did he know exactly which building his teammates were hiding behind, and limp up to join them?

Was he knocked out or just asleep pished? Suspect he woke with a start and did a ‘runner’ ‘cept his legs wouldn’t work.

[Raich Carter]

13 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

£2.3 million, If the incident didn't happen then yes this is what he'd have been paid, As the incident did happen, We lost the services of a good Captain and centre half, DCFC lost on all accounts, So it is quite as bad as people think.

If Keogh hadn't have acted irresponsibly then you're right, it wouldn't have happened.

My point was financially we lost nothing. 

[Pearl Ram]

Never mind, not getting into this one.

Edited October 3, 2021 by Pearl Ram

[angieram]

48 minutes ago, DCFC27 said:

Court of law proved this not to be the case.

For the umpteenth time, it wasn't a court of law. It was the EFL Players Related Dispute Commission,  where Keogh referred it after his appeal to the EFL had originally failed.

If he had taken it to an independent industrial tribunal, that would have failed too. 

 

[Mucker1884]

51 minutes ago, DCFC27 said:

Court of law proved this not to be the case.

Not sure a court of law was involved in anything other than the drink/drive related charges to TL & MB.  Don't think Keogh was anywhere near a court of law, nor the club, in this instance.   

[PistoldPete]

18 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

£2.3 million, If the incident didn't happen then yes this is what he'd have been paid, As the incident did happen, We lost the services of a good Captain and centre half, DCFC lost on all accounts, So it is quite as bad as people think.

I think the point being made is that the decison not to pay him didn't cost us because if we had paid him, he would have been paid for doing nothing which is how things have turned out anyway.  If he had returned to fitness within the remaining term of his contract, he would not have got in the team ahead of Davies,  Clarke or Wisdom. 

[Archie]

Obviously spent no time at all with Lawrence that night ?

Lying get. 

[PistoldPete]

54 minutes ago, DCFC27 said:

Court of law proved this not to be the case.

It wasnt a Court of Law, nor even a proper employment tribunal. It was a kangaroo court set up by the EFL and the Players union.

[Ram-Alf]

11 minutes ago, angieram said:

For the umpteenth time, it wasn't a court of law. It was the EFL Players Related Dispute Commission,  where Keogh referred it after his appeal to the EFL had originally failed.

If he had taken it to an independent industrial tribunal, that would have failed too. 

 

As to my response to Anon...who and what legal qualifications has this "DISPUTE COMMISSION" have?

Edited October 3, 2021 by Unlucky Alf

[PistoldPete]

3 minutes ago, Archie said:

Obviously spent no time at all with Lawrence that night ?

Lying get. 

Is that what Keogh told the Judge? He didn't spend the evening with Tom Lawrence? Maybe try the Prince Andrew approach he was at Pizza hut, and not up to any naughty business.  

[PistoldPete]

13 minutes ago, angieram said:

For the umpteenth time, it wasn't a court of law. It was the EFL Players Related Dispute Commission,  where Keogh referred it after his appeal to the EFL had originally failed.

If he had taken it to an independent industrial tribunal, that would have failed too. 

 

Exactly. An indpendent employment tribunal would have assessed the case on the basis of whether dismissal was within the range of appropriate punishments for someone who is a professional footballer and club captain to get drunk, get into a car (and allegedly not wearing a seat belt?)with another drunk person driving and then  get yourself injured and unable to perform your employed duties for over a year. 

I am in no doubt what an indpendent tribunal would have decided.  The fact that Lawrence and Bennett escaped the punishment of dismissal (possibly for commercial reasons) is irrelevant, the club was within its rights to terminate any or all of their contracts.     

[Stockport Ram]

The handful of you who have known me from the DET days of the COYR's site will know that I have nothing but contempt for him for what he has done as a footballer at our great club.  Nigel's hand was forced by the circumstances and timing of Shackell's departure, and whatever good TSOG did for the club post Jewell has to be tempered with his two most expensive signings - Sammon and Keogh.  Buying an almost ever present in a Coventry defence finishing 18th and 23rd in the previous two seasons (when he dabbled with the captaincy) smacked of desperation.

 

Long before Zamoragate (which had been happening for two seasons, so was entirely predictable), even in the first season, his propensity for totally avoidable errors, invariably as a result of over belief in his own ability combined with simple brain fade, have been a constant thread throughout his DCFC career. True, he has made some exceptional goal saving tackles and clearances, (even a broken clock is right twice a day), but more often than not as a direct result of his chronic lack of positioning.  His younger partners have regularly saved him - Tomori in 18/19 being the most blatantly obvious.

 

My biggest frustration is that he played with a lack of intelligence and acceptance of responsibility for his errors, and simply not learning from them.   We all make mistakes, but life is about learning from them and his were made over and over again. Often a yard behind or in front of his back line, making those surging runs with pretty much zero end product (at the right end, anyway), defensive half clearance headers back towards the penalty D, backing off too far then challenging often two footedly and jumping so smart strikers simply shot low to avoid him, there are too many to mention.   His desire to "get there at all costs" often blinkered him from seeing others better positioned to make the challenge and left his man free. 

No one could ever doubt his intensity or passion or commitment to the cause, and by all accounts managers fellow players have remarked on his leadership qualities, but leadership ultimately only works when you add more value than you take away.  He could have been a decent player for us, if only he'd thought more about his game on the pitch....But that isn't who Richard Keogh is.

 

The article mentions mental health struggles, and I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. I hope he remains well in this respect.

 

I'd venture to say that both Mel and Keogh share one trait - an ultimate belief in their own ability. It works well when you are that good, but not always. There is one common thread from 2012 to joinergate,  and thank goodness he's gone.

[Crewton]

1 hour ago, Raich Carter said:

My point was financially we lost nothing.

Except we had to sign another player to replace him, and would have had to do so even if we hadn't sacked him. So I could easily argue that Keogh cost us between £0.75m -1.50m over the remainder of his contract in additional wages alone. 

[Reggie Greenwood]

3 hours ago, DCFC27 said:

Edited October 3, 2021 by Reggie Greenwood
Repeating what others had already replied

[GboroRam]

2 hours ago, Stockport Ram said:

The article mentions mental health struggles, and I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy. I hope he remains well in this respect.

Unfortunately the rest of the article puts enough doubt in my mind to not necessarily believe that is true either. 

[Ramarena]

4 hours ago, DCFC27 said:

Court of law proved this not to be the case.

[Ramarena]

In the week that the club had to make a number of local people redundant, we need to spare a thought for poor Richard Keogh.

Poor guy goes to the pub after a club event, didn’t really drink anything, probably made a couple of huge donations to charity, also probably saved some drowning puppies and helped an old lady cross the road!

He then wakes up injured in a crashed car, through absolutely no fault of his own!

Then the club outrageously sacks him.……..Awful!

He’s the real victim here!

[Ram-Alf]

1 minute ago, Ramarena said:

In the week that the club had to make a number of local people redundant, we need to spare a thought for poor Richard Keogh.

Poor guy goes to the pub after a club event, didn’t really drink anything, probably made a couple of huge donations to charity, also probably saved some drowning puppies and helped an old lady cross the road!

He then wakes up injured in a crashed car, through absolutely no fault of his own!

Then the club outrageously sacks him.……..Awful!

He’s the real victim here!

Not having that at all, The old Lady is the victim, She was perfectly happy crossing the road on her own, But when Keogh saw there was an opportunity to show how caring he can be he produced to guide the old Lady to the other side of the road, Almost 100yards from where she would normally cross...another case of poor positioning.

[1of4]

21 hours ago, Jayram said:

No, our captain got himself injured during stupid drunken behaviour and then our former banker of an owner tried to circumvent employment law thereby incurring a multi million debt along with all the other debts we are now stuck with. 

How was employment laws circumvented. If Keogh had been injured while fulfilling  the terms of his contract, then he would have expected to receive his wages. But he in all intents and purpose sustained an injury that was self inflicted, I funnily enough injured myself while playing football. I was informed by my employer that I wasn't eligible for company sick pay, as it was deemed a self inflicted injury, has per the terms of my contract of employment.

[ram59]

In reality,Keogh has been given a nice little bonus out of all this. I believe he signed a contract for a new club, before his Derby contact would have expired.