Ramarena Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 Obviously for fans to be at blame for this situation, they would need to have an in depth knowledge of the financials of the club in real time and the status of embargo’s, etc. No-one has that level of insider knowledge and it’s only if they had that knowledge and still made demands that you could blame them. I have no doubt that fans can be entitled, obnoxious, demanding, etc. But to point the finger of blame at them when they don’t have that knowledge to hand and the club tells them everything is fine is a bit silly! This thread smacks of casting aspersions at those that follow the club with the benefit of hindsight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 I think the ultimate blame has to lie with the concept of competetive sports - so that's ancient greece who really should be up in front of the EFL. Tamworthram, Jourdan and Tyler Durden 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hintonsboots Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 (edited) It all went wrong when SDSR lost his source. Edited July 25, 2021 by hintonsboots Ramos, RadioactiveWaste, Jourdan and 2 others 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rammy03 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 57 minutes ago, Jayram said: How old are you - you sound like a petulant 13 year old. The ultimate blame lies with a man who took over ownership of a debt free football club full of talented players and coaching staff and proceeded to hire and fire managers at will, splash out ludicrous amounts of cash on bang average players based on advice from a recruitment team that included his stepson and go for ‘Hollywood’ managerial appointments instead of someone who had solid experience of managing at this level. As for Mel running out of money believe me he’ll be ok - the £300 million plus still in his bank account should help keep the wolves from the door. On the other hand our football club is up to its eyeballs in debt because of him. I along with thousands of others have been putting my hand in my pocket for the best part of 40 years supporting this football club while trying to bring up a family and pay a mortgage. If I had Mel’s money I’d have spent it a damn sight more sensibly than he has so I’m not taking a lecture from the likes of you about it. The state Mel Morris has left this football club in is a disgrace. Not one single Derby County fan owes him anything other our contempt for the way he has wrecked our club. Brilliant post. Couldn't agree more David Graham Brown and S8TY 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Jayram said: How old are you - you sound like a petulant 13 year old. The ultimate blame lies with a man who took over ownership of a debt free football club Your post because the factually incorrect at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 8 hours ago, Tamworthram said: Surely even if we, as fans with no detailed knowledge of the clubs financial position, make irresponsible requests the blame still sits with the owner/board. It is their responsibility to ignore/turn down any such irresponsible requests (ideally with an explanation). In an ideal world, yes. Having an owner who is a fan can result in a precarious situation. Perhaps you and i would have been just as silly in his shoes, it's easy to get carried away and lose sight of correct procedure when you're loaded with cash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 15 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said: It has haunted me for years, every time I smoke a cigar I think about it What I want to know is - who signed off on the amortisation policy over a gin and tonic with Mel? Looks like the work of @Jimbo Ram to me. ariotofmyown, ramit, Jimbo Ram and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orphanram Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 I think the OP has conflated a wider issue with football since the EPL era and what is specifically happening at Derby.The bottom line for any business is that buck stops with the owner, CEO or whoever is the accountable custodian in preserving and growing its reputation, economic stability and responsibility to shareholders & stakeholders alike. If the CEO of any large business invested in stock at an overinflated price that didn’t result in improved performance and then further down the line fell foul to fiscal rules that were in place to protect against such misadventure then they would solely be accountable regardless of customer demands at any point. The expectation of football fans or indeed customers who receive goods or entertainment from any business are probably quite broad and segmented. If there is popular demand for something the role of any leader is to understand that and take a balanced approach that delivers the best possible outcome for all. San Fran Van Rams 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 2 hours ago, Pearl Ram said: I could be wrong but I think Charlotte’s a place and not a name. ? Nope, definitely a name. I went to school with a boy named Charlotte. Rev and Mucker1884 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworthram Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, ramit said: In an ideal world, yes. Having an owner who is a fan can result in a precarious situation. Perhaps you and i would have been just as silly in his shoes, it's easy to get carried away and lose sight of correct procedure when you're loaded with cash. Not just in an ideal world. There can be no doubt that the owner has more knowledge of the clubs financial position and has a responsibility to control it regardless of what the fans demand or ask. The fact that Mel is a fan doesn’t remove that responsibility or shift it to the fans. Edited July 25, 2021 by Tamworthram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Ram Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 8 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said: Nope, definitely a name. I went to school with a boy named Charlotte. Oh ! Funnily enough at my junior school there was a lad called Vivian. True story that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBRammette Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 At least this post seems to have united the forum so well done on that. "The ultimate blame lies with the supporters, demanding new players twice a year, demanding seat prices to be lower and demanding promotion to the premiership whatever the cost." I cannot remember fans "demanding" any of these things. I seem to recall fans were happy with our team when Mel took over, seat prices have never been lowered (well mine hasnt) and noone demands promotion to the premier league "whatever the cost". Some of these things would be nice but many on here enjoy the Championship as a competition, especially after our last time up there. And even if such things are demanded by fans, surely those running the club are the ones who have a statutory duty and are legally responsible for the company’s actions. When dealing with directors of companies at work, I dont refer to the customers instead. Even if demands were made - If a child demands they play on a railway track are you saying their adult guardian responsible guardian should not act responsibly and just let them? Ramarena and kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramarena Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Jourdan said: What I want to know is - who signed off on the amortisation policy over a gin and tonic with Mel? Looks like the work of @Jimbo Ram to me. I admit it………I just wanted MOAR!!!!!!!!! Jourdan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 8 hours ago, Tamworthram said: Not just in an ideal world. There can be no doubt that the owner has more knowledge of the clubs financial position and has a responsibility to control it regardless of what the fans demand or ask. The fact that Mel is a fan doesn’t remove that responsibility or shift it to the fans. i am not excusing Mel's actions, he has left us in deep trouble and his responsibility is by far the greatest, i am just saying many of us cheered him on and need to admit that to ourselves, if not others. The Scarlet Pimpernel, sheeponacid, jimtastic56 and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, ramit said: i am not excusing Mel's actions, he has left us in deep trouble and his responsibility is by far the greatest, i am just saying many of us cheered him on and need to admit that to ourselves, if not others. Yep, we hoped he knew what he was doing and that his actions would be for the good of the club. I think we'd not have been quite so deep in poo if the EFL hadn't gunned for us quite so hard after allowing us to spend, plus covid has really tipped things over the edge. But still atm the wages are being paid and we might be able to make signings. Plus we are still in the Championship. What is happening on the inside of the club isn't really clear for us to see (but then never really has). #COYR sheeponacid and ramit 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said: Yep, we hoped he knew what he was doing and that his actions would be for the good of the club. I think we'd not have been quite so deep in poo if the EFL hadn't gunned for us quite so hard after allowing us to spend, plus covid has really tipped things over the edge. But still atm the wages are being paid and we might be able to make signings. Plus we are still in the Championship. What is happening on the inside of the club isn't really clear for us to see (but then never really has). #COYR Roy why bring Covid into this at all? I don't see any other Championship clubs in the same position as we are currently in. It's poor mitigation for the economic mismanagement at the club. And blaming the EFL is just another way of diverting the attention away from how we managed to find ourselves in this mess. S8TY, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong and jimtastic56 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 Just now, Tyler Durden said: Roy why bring Covid into this at all? I don't see any other Championship clubs in the same position as we are currently in. It's poor mitigation for the economic mismanagement at the club. And blaming the EFL is just another way of diverting the attention away from how we managed to find ourselves in this mess. Because it's hitting us sooner. We had enough money to give Lampard what he wanted and even some to Cocu. It's all seemingly shuddered to a halt with the EFL hitting hard and covid stopping our income! Don't you think with our minimal wages we should be able to (mostly?) cover them were it not for the fact our income has been stopped by covid? We're not the only club that has happened to just that we were nearer the edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: Because it's hitting us sooner. We had enough money to give Lampard what he wanted and even some to Cocu. It's all seemingly shuddered to a halt with the EFL hitting hard and covid stopping our income! Don't you think with our minimal wages we should be able to (mostly?) cover them were it not for the fact our income has been stopped by covid? We're not the only club that has happened to just that we were nearer the edge. Why are we nearer to the edge than other clubs Roy? The root cause is still the same irrespective of the EFL or Covid. S8TY 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 Just now, Tyler Durden said: Why are we nearer to the edge than other clubs Roy? The root cause is still the same irrespective of the EFL or Covid. Except we were still functioning up to that point Tyler. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 1 hour ago, Ramarena said: Obviously for fans to be at blame for this situation, they would need to have an in depth knowledge of the financials of the club in real time and the status of embargo’s, etc. No-one has that level of insider knowledge and it’s only if they had that knowledge and still made demands that you could blame them. I have no doubt that fans can be entitled, obnoxious, demanding, etc. But to point the finger of blame at them when they don’t have that knowledge to hand and the club tells them everything is fine is a bit silly! This thread smacks of casting aspersions at those that follow the club with the benefit of hindsight. Even with the knowledge, what could the fans have done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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