Derby County Administration (with the slight possibility of Liquidation still there)

[GenBr]

44 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

If we were reborn, but managed to keep the ground, would be interesting to see where we restarted. In this case, with still a decent attendance, we'd be way richer than the teams at the lowest level and able to fund a much stronger team. Perhaps we may start around Conference North level?

Was it Doncaster who had to get rid of their stadium cos it kept sending them into administration? We probably couldnt afford pride park if we go too far down the pyramid (although we dont own it anyway)

[alexxxxx]

7 hours ago, Ambitious said:

You only have to look at fans of other clubs that are absolutely loving it. I guess chairmen are no different, despite how we perceive them.

Boro and Wycombe serve to benefit if we die as a club, perhaps they want some of our players on the cheap?

It’s a cut throat business. Gibson isn’t going after Mel anymore, he’s gunning for the club. Same with Wycombe. 

Yea reading some other clubs forums and people really hate us, as fans. Seen some boro fans are calling us all deluded cos one person on here said sky would be upset that we wouldn't be in the championship anymore. 

So much for fans solidarity. Fans calling other clubs to get points deductions or be relegated or calling other teams cheats should be careful what they wish for.

[JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta]

12 hours ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

On a more serious note, could this from Boro or the Wycombe legal position have been triggers for the administration?

"It was Septembre, the season had started well, discussions were ongoing to clear up the last of the EFL issues for -9 points and a situation where the club would be trading a lot more sustainably was emerging. And out of the blue the administration button is pressed because Mel was board of his toy and it cost him too much to run."

If there is anything of substance to the legal claims (bearing in mind the EFL disciplinry process is the agreed mechanism for FFP enformcment), then I could see that being a trigger.

Then claim against Mel, not the club.

[GenBr]

8 minutes ago, alexxxxx said:

Yea reading some other clubs forums and people really hate us, as fans. Seen some boro fans are calling us all deluded cos one person on here said sky would be upset that we wouldn't be in the championship anymore. 

So much for fans solidarity. Fans calling other clubs to get points deductions or be relegated or calling other teams cheats should be careful what they wish for.

Yeh i've been reading some other forums as well and a lot of them seem to genuinely want to see our club cease to exist. Not something id wish on anyone, but i guess not everybody will have the same level of empathy.

Shef Wed fans are probably the best i've seen online. Mostly positive towards us even after last season. 

[Crewton]

8 hours ago, GadFly said:

Why would anybody want to do that? 

Please explain your thought process.

Pretty much as Ambitious said. It benefits other clubs if we go out of business, particularly Wycombe, who might be the beneficiary of an extra promotion place this season, or even believe they can lobby to take our place. Many will fancy picking our squad and Academy clean free of charge. Gibson will be able to get an erection again without the little blue pill. Did you ever hear of one football club coming to the aid of another? Anyone who talks about "the football family" is on the same page as those who believe in unicorns. 

 

[Gaspode]

36 minutes ago, alexxxxx said:

Yea reading some other clubs forums and people really hate us, as fans. Seen some boro fans are calling us all deluded cos one person on here said sky would be upset that we wouldn't be in the championship anymore. 

So much for fans solidarity. Fans calling other clubs to get points deductions or be relegated or calling other teams cheats should be careful what they wish for.

I'm impressed that there's a Boro fan that can spell deluded......bunch of in-breds.....

[curb]

53 minutes ago, GenBr said:

I don't know how old you are or the state of your health, but you only have to get to level 4 for league football - it wouldnt take that long. Wimbledon started at tier 9 and it took them 9 seasons to get back to league football. Derby would have significantly more support and more funds - i'd expect them to knock a couple of years off that.

Ah, but this is Derby. It’s never that simple ?

[NottsRam77]

9 hours ago, G-Ram said:

I'm not saying that but surely now were out of it the projdcted cashlow forecast must look better. Surely administration is when there is no way out or hope going forward 

 

Sorry yes totally agree

lost in translation and all that ?

[BramcoteRam84]

51 minutes ago, ollycutts1982 said:

I think we’d struggle to afford the ground if we were non league. The revenue streams just wouldn’t be there to generate the income needed. Should that happen we’d be ground sharing with Notts County/Chesterfield or somewhere of that ilk. 
 

Let’s hope it doesn’t come to that and league 1 is our lowest ebb. 

30000+ fans don’t just disappear. Granted we wouldn’t get 20K + gates but we’d have a core 10-15k at least and there will be odd games where we’d sell 25-30k. A lot would depend on the terms on which we get the ground. 

If we did have to ground share with Notts/Chesterfield- we’d sell out those grounds regularly - huge advantage over the other teams. 

It’s in no ones interest for Derby to be in division 10 and win every single game (could happen), so I think there would be a negotiation with the National League about what division to start in, I wouldn’t be surprised if we ended up in the conference, but more likely conference north (div 6), or worst case (div 7). 
 

If we became a Phoenix club we’d be back in the championship in 10 years. If we end up in League 2, 5 years, League 1, anything between 1 and 3 years IMO. If Luton can get back we can - we’ve only spent 5 season in 3rd division in our history. 

[PistoldPete]

9 hours ago, curb said:

For anyone thinking about whether it would be possible to form a ‘Phoenix’ club, Bury AFC formed last season, but the season got suspended due to COVID.
This season, After 10 games they are second in the North West Counties League First Division North, which is at level 10 in the football pyramid.

These are the current non-league clubs in Derbyshire, level 10 would be around the level of Heanor and Borrowash Vics.

It would be good fun for a bit, but they wouldn’t see league football in my lifetime.

Level 5 

Chesterfield National League

Level 6 

Alfreton Town National League North

Level 7 

Buxton NPL (Northern Premier League) Premier Division

Matlock Town NPL Premier Division

Mickleover FC NPL Premier Division

Level 8

Belper Town NPL Division One East

Glossop North End NPL Division One

Gresley NPL Division One East

Level 9 

Ilkeston Town MFL (Midland Football League) Premier Division

Long Eaton United MFL Premier Division

South Normanton Athletic MFL Premier Division

Staveley Miners Welfare NCEL (Northern Counties East League) Premier Division

Level 10

Belper United EMCL (East Midlands Counties League)

FC Bolsover NCEL (Northern Counties East League) Division One

Borrowash Victoria EMCL

Dronfield Town NCEL Division One

Graham Street Prims EMCL

Heanor Town EMCL

New Mills NWCL (North West Counties League) Division One South

Shirebrook Town NCEL Division One

The original Bury is still in existence as a dormant club. So AFC bury has no legitimacy as a Phoenix club.

That’s why they have started at such a low level.

if the worst were to happen to Derby I don’t see a reset starting anywhere near that level .

 

 

[RoyMac5]

5 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

If we became a Phoenix club we’d be back in the championship in 10 years. If we end up in League 2, 5 years, League 1, anything between 1 and 3 years IMO. If Luton can get back we can - we’ve only spent 5 season in 3rd division in our history. 

Lol. Can we stop this talk of phoenix clubs, you only have to look at Ipswich and Sunderland to see how easy it is to climb back up the ladder ?  Lets fight to keep the club we already have! #COYR

[Stive Pesley]

16 hours ago, Woodley Ram said:

wasnt that what Mel was saying, that he expects a buyer to come forward as they know they will get it cheaper in administration?

Yes but my point was that administration either ends with a CVA and Derby County continue to exist with a new owner, or it ends without a CVA and Derby County ceases to exist, and we start again with a phoenix club

Ending without a CVA is considerably cheaper for a buyer...

 

16 hours ago, Woodley Ram said:

Remember Reading will be joing us very soon at the bottom and it wouldnt suprise me if a couple more come our way.

I hope there are more - not because I wish this on any other team, but because the more EFL teams it happens to, the more it exposes what a joke the EFL and it's so called financial fair play rules are

[Woodley Ram]

1 hour ago, TooFarInToTurnRed said:

The EFL will have to tread really carefully how they treat us in these difficult times as I suspect that when clubs start publishing accounts for 20/21 over the coming months many may have breached the P&S loss limit due to COVID. If they then “relax” the rules to stop half the teams having embargoes and point deducted due to “unprecedented circumstances” but not for us then they are opening themselves up to a huge claim.

 

I think that’s going to happen, Stoke have already started the ball rolling on that with a massive loss due to COVID.   I think the factor will be if those clubs have to bring in the men in suits, if they don’t they might get away with it 

[David Graham Brown]

2 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Lol. Can we stop this talk of phoenix clubs, you only have to look at Ipswich and Sunderland to see how easy it is to climb back up the ladder ?  Lets fight to keep the club we already have! #COYR

It’s more like Phoenix nights at the moment.

[SamUltraRam]

16 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

If we became a Phoenix club we’d be back in the championship in 10 years. If we end up in League 2, 5 years, League 1, anything between 1 and 3 years IMO. If Luton can get back we can - we’ve only spent 5 season in 3rd division in our history. 

But in 10 years, the Championship, or at least Leagues 1 & 2 will contain lots of Premiership owned feeder clubs/ B teams by then - unless something is done by the authorities

We could be the first of many professional clubs who cannot continue independently. The other option is the previously discussed Premier League 2 which could be a closed shop which we cannot get in to. 

We must survive as Derby County !!

I'm sure the fans of Sunderland, Sheff Wed, Portsmouth, Bolton, Ipswich & Charlton all believe their clubs should be at Championship or even Premiership level

Edited September 23, 2021 by SamUltraRam

[Sidd10]

8 minutes ago, BramcoteRam84 said:

30000+ fans don’t just disappear. Granted we wouldn’t get 20K + gates but we’d have a core 10-15k at least and there will be odd games where we’d sell 25-30k. A lot would depend on the terms on which we get the ground. 

If we did have to ground share with Notts/Chesterfield- we’d sell out those grounds regularly - huge advantage over the other teams. 

It’s in no ones interest for Derby to be in division 10 and win every single game (could happen), so I think there would be a negotiation with the National League about what division to start in, I wouldn’t be surprised if we ended up in the conference, but more likely conference north (div 6), or worst case (div 7). 
 

If we became a Phoenix club we’d be back in the championship in 10 years. If we end up in League 2, 5 years, League 1, anything between 1 and 3 years IMO. If Luton can get back we can - we’ve only spent 5 season in 3rd division in our history. 

Agree with all this. Even if the worst happens, we'll have a rough few years but we'll be back.

I'm also a bit surprised (actually I'm probably not) that Derby City Council have come out to support Mel as Business City Ambassador.

The lack of 20k+ fans on a match day every 2 weeks will be the end of a lot of small businesses and pubs etc. And have a huge impact on the entire city of Derby.

This isn't just about our club, it's about the entire city & community.

Mel should hang his head in shame. What an ambassador for the city! 

[PistoldPete]

It isn’t just about City of Derby , we are Derby county after all. It affects the whole community outside of Derby as well .

[SamUltraRam]

7 minutes ago, Sidd10 said:

Agree with all this. Even if the worst happens, we'll have a rough few years but we'll be back.

I'm also a bit surprised (actually I'm probably not) that Derby City Council have come out to support Mel as Business City Ambassador.

The lack of 20k+ fans on a match day every 2 weeks will be the end of a lot of small businesses and pubs etc. And have a huge impact on the entire city of Derby.

This isn't just about our club, it's about the entire city & community.

Mel should hang his head in shame. What an ambassador for the city! 

What will Derby have left without the football club. The city has already lost the Assembly Rooms and the Council completely under utilises the Velodrome.

I'm afraid Rollerworld will be the cities biggest attraction ?

 

Edited September 23, 2021 by SamUltraRam

[Sidd10]

1 minute ago, SamUltraRam said:

What will Derby have left without the football club. The city has already lost the Assembly Rooms and the Council completely under utilises the Velodrome.

 

Exactly this. 

[StarterForTen]

9 minutes ago, Woodley Ram said:

I think that’s going to happen, Stoke have already started the ball rolling on that with a massive loss due to COVID.   I think the factor will be if those clubs have to bring in the men in suits, if they don’t they might get away with it 

From what I've read, what Stoke have done is a massive amortisation dump - throwing a huge (£80m?) player value write down into one year and claiming it as a COVID-related (and therefore outside of P&S limits) revaluation. That will then allow them to record reduced amortisation losses in later years - and higher profits if players are sold - leaving them with more head room for the sir seasonal P&S returns.

Is that really OK?