Derby County Administration (with the slight possibility of Liquidation still there)

[Rampage]

7 minutes ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

It's the hope I've had.

I've slated Mel, especially when admin was announced, but I honestly think he had run out of options.

The EFL were strangling him, they were making sure buyers were put off at every stage and again, Mel was running out of options.

He knew a buyer was very keen, they wanted it cheaper, the EFL were going to impose penalties anyway so Mel thought to hell with it, let's go admin!

To this day the EFL still haven't provided any update to additional points deductions, the absolute cretins.

If true that he may write off up to £100 million to help the situation why are we so anti. Might be nonsense. Could be enough to attract a buyer with plenty of cash. Let us see how it works out. If we do get taken over by someone with real cash, keep our players and Rooney then possibly a cloud with a silver lining.

[CBRammette]

3 hours ago, KBB said:

Whoever takes the club over had better be prepared for demands to splash the cash on new signings in January.

Don't think that will happen? As utterly mindless as it sounds from the journey we took to admin there will always be an element who will expect, almost demand, significant signings every transfer window.

Mike Ashley or whoever will really have to send a clear message to an element of our support. The days of chucking money are long long gone. Think we will see the Butterfield and johnson double deal days again? Not a chance in hell.

Thank goodness for that. But we will be under some sort of efl business plan anyway. If Wayne is still here he seems to have a bit of a nose for a quality bargain player anyway

[rammieib]

Everyone us obsessed with Ashley simply because we know who he is. All the others are relative unknowns so we can't talk about them as easily.

[DesertRam]

When you are owned by one of the richest men in the country, then the fans

assume you are going to do a Man City. It doesn't happen and hey presto - you're

the bad guy, for not spending 100 mil in the first 6 months!

If we can just get a goal scorer in January I'll be over the moon, and a couple of

new players  +  Beilik  and CKR  it'd be like paradise ?

[Oldben]

Some thoughts on an efl appeal.

Before raising a voice against Mel Morris it's probably wise to consider that an appeal against the efls decision to deduct 12 points for an efl fair play conduct breach.

Mel took advice from an auditor, the auditor gave Mel a means to present the accounts which at the time wasn't illegal under efl rules on financial accounting.

The efl have overturned that claiming that the auditors were wrong.

I think that I'm right in saying that at an appeal its likely Derby will need to show that Mel Morris Derby did not set about deliberately "breaching its duty of utmost good faith to the EFL by deliberately concealing information".

Then they will claim in the same way Wigan did that financial hardship caused by covid should play a part in the efl decision.

[RammingStone66]

11 hours ago, KBB said:

Whoever takes the club over had better be prepared for demands to splash the cash on new signings in January.

Don't think that will happen? As utterly mindless as it sounds from the journey we took to admin there will always be an element who will expect, almost demand, significant signings every transfer window.

Mike Ashley or whoever will really have to send a clear message to an element of our support. The days of chucking money are long long gone. Think we will see the Butterfield and johnson double deal days again? Not a chance in hell.

Even with new owners the Transfer embargo is for 2 years so we can't splash any cash for quite a while and I assume the embargo would also restrict the amount of wages we can pay for a while too. Can't imagine the EFL would be happy with us trying to give a big name free agent like Jack Wilshire or someone 35k a week or something silly, all of a sudden  

Maybe an owner comes in pays off every creditor in one go and the EFL drop the embargo and be kind to us.........then Gibson tries to sue us for another imagined slight ?

[Ghost of Clough]

1 hour ago, Oldben said:

Some thoughts on an efl appeal.

Before raising a voice against Mel Morris it's probably wise to consider that an appeal against the efls decision to deduct 12 points for an efl fair play conduct breach.

Mel took advice from an auditor, the auditor gave Mel a means to present the accounts which at the time wasn't illegal under efl rules on financial accounting.

The efl have overturned that claiming that the auditors were wrong.

I think that I'm right in saying that at an appeal its likely Derby will need to show that Mel Morris Derby did not set about deliberately "breaching its duty of utmost good faith to the EFL by deliberately concealing information".

Then they will claim in the same way Wigan did that financial hardship caused by covid should play a part in the efl decision.

The appeal is against administration, not P&S. Any successful appeal can only be on the grounds of Covid, or more accurately, the club not going into admin if it wasn't for Covid.

7 minutes ago, RammingStone66 said:

Even with new owners the Transfer embargo is for 2 years so we can't splash any cash for quite a while and I assume the embargo would also restrict the amount of wages we can pay for a while too. Can't imagine the EFL would be happy with us trying to give a big name free agent like Jack Wilshire or someone 35k a week or something silly, all of a sudden  

Maybe an owner comes in pays off every creditor in one go and the EFL drop the embargo and be kind to us.........then Gibson tries to sue us for another imagined slight ?

From what @angieram said (or my memory recalls her saying), it's a case of agreeing a business plan with the EFL or it's an embargo for 2 years.

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

8 hours ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

It's the hope I've had.

I've slated Mel, especially when admin was announced, but I honestly think he had run out of options.

The EFL were strangling him, they were making sure buyers were put off at every stage and again, Mel was running out of options.

He knew a buyer was very keen, they wanted it cheaper, the EFL were going to impose penalties anyway so Mel thought to hell with it, let's go admin!

To this day the EFL still haven't provided any update to additional points deductions, the absolute cretins.

Remember the statement for entering admin that we all castigated the club and Mel for? We said Mel was trying to absolve himself of any responsibility and just blaming everything on Covid. With what’s come to light now that statement was obviously scripted with the intention of giving a admins a reason to appeal to the points deduction for entering admin.

Wether intentional or not, the way he has separated the ground and training ground from the club is beneficial to us for deducting the debts. As long as he sells them back to the club and a good price like is being mentioned, then we’ll be left in a good place.

[angieram]

22 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

The appeal is against administration, not P&S. Any successful appeal can only be on the grounds of Covid, or more accurately, the club not going into admin if it wasn't for Covid.

From what @angieram said (or my memory recalls her saying), it's a case of agreeing a business plan with the EFL or it's an embargo for 2 years.

I think the business plan and embargo sit side by side. But hopefully a softer embargo than we are under now.

[PistoldPete]

2 hours ago, Oldben said:

Some thoughts on an efl appeal.

Before raising a voice against Mel Morris it's probably wise to consider that an appeal against the efls decision to deduct 12 points for an efl fair play conduct breach.

Mel took advice from an auditor, the auditor gave Mel a means to present the accounts which at the time wasn't illegal under efl rules on financial accounting.

The efl have overturned that claiming that the auditors were wrong.

I think that I'm right in saying that at an appeal its likely Derby will need to show that Mel Morris Derby did not set about deliberately "breaching its duty of utmost good faith to the EFL by deliberately concealing information".

Then they will claim in the same way Wigan did that financial hardship caused by covid should play a part in the efl decision.

It has already been decided at a independent commission that Derby did not deliberately try to hide anything in their accounts. 
 

in fact the commission noted that Derby’s approach had been approved by its CEO who is an accountant , the clubs auditors and even the commission itself which had an accountant on it found nothing wrong with the accounts themselves. 
 

in fact the only people who found fault were a panel of lawyers ,  none of them accountants and a university boffin with no actual business experience.

[PistoldPete]

44 minutes ago, angieram said:

I think the business plan and embargo sit side by side. But hopefully a softer embargo than we are under now.

I wouldn’t hAve a problem with embargo per se a one in one  out transfer embargo etc but softer than present . 

 

 

[PistoldPete]

47 minutes ago, QuitYourJibbaJivin said:

Remember the statement for entering admin that we all castigated the club and Mel for? We said Mel was trying to absolve himself of any responsibility and just blaming everything on Covid. With what’s come to light now that statement was obviously scripted with the intention of giving a admins a reason to appeal to the points deduction for entering admin.

Wether intentional or not, the way he has separated the ground and training ground from the club is beneficial to us for deducting the debts. As long as he sells them back to the club and a good price like is being mentioned, then we’ll be left in a good place.

I thought on mel’s stTement at the time it was obvious the reasons why it was scripted that way… not Mel just making excuses. 
 

both Mel and the administrators have cited COVID and there are good reasons for that, not least because it’s true.

[PistoldPete]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

The appeal is against administration, not P&S. Any successful appeal can only be on the grounds of Covid, or more accurately, the club not going into admin if it wasn't for Covid.

From what @angieram said (or my memory recalls her saying), it's a case of agreeing a business plan with the EFL or it's an embargo for 2 years.

Administrators have said they are aiming to reduce current and future penalties. Any future penalties would be for P & s and I think it’s a fair point in mitigation that we didn’t knowingly break p & s

[Rampage]

12 hours ago, KBB said:

Whoever takes the club over had better be prepared for demands to splash the cash on new signings in January.

Don't think that will happen? As utterly mindless as it sounds from the journey we took to admin there will always be an element who will expect, almost demand, significant signings every transfer window.

Mike Ashley or whoever will really have to send a clear message to an element of our support. The days of chucking money are long long gone. Think we will see the Butterfield and johnson double deal days again? Not a chance in hell.

We will need some players to at least cover for injuries.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

It's the hope I've had.

I've slated Mel, especially when admin was announced, but I honestly think he had run out of options.

The EFL were strangling him, they were making sure buyers were put off at every stage and again, Mel was running out of options.

He knew a buyer was very keen, they wanted it cheaper, the EFL were going to impose penalties anyway so Mel thought to hell with it, let's go admin!

To this day the EFL still haven't provided any update to additional points deductions, the absolute cretins.

That is exactly my hopeful take on Mel's actions. and intent.  I am hoping that he now knows that he should have been much more prudent with the finances but that liquidation is not an option he can allow to happen for his own  sake and the sake of the whole fanbase. I do hope we're right.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Guest

[cosmic]

14 hours ago, Rampage said:

I have a feeling that when the dust settles, Mel will be seen to have done the best for the Rams that he could have done and found to have been let down by some people. We will see.

Is that why you've not changed your avatar? Think you're the only fan left who would say "Mel..what a guy" without any shred of sarcasm.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, PistoldPete said:

  2 hours ago, QuitYourJibbaJivin said:

Remember the statement for entering admin that we all castigated the club and Mel for? We said Mel was trying to absolve himself of any responsibility and just blaming everything on Covid. With what’s come to light now that statement was obviously scripted with the intention of giving a admins a reason to appeal to the points deduction for entering admin.

Wether intentional or not, the way he has separated the ground and training ground from the club is beneficial to us for deducting the debts. As long as he sells them back to the club and a good price like is being mentioned, then we’ll be left in a good place.

I agree with this with the exception of the last sentence. Whatever the final outcome, the club will not be left in a good place. All we can hope for from Mel now is that he fully contributes in limiting any further damage. If he had run the club prudently over the past seven years, the massive debts accumulated over that time would have been avoided, with or without Covid19.

The £20m revenue loss due to Covid19 may have been the sole factor in pushing the club over the cliff to administration. However, we were driven to the cliff edge by paying inflated transfer fees and wages for players not good enough to deliver promotion, together with compensation of around £35m to employees of the club whose contracts were terminated at Mel's whim. How we could do with that £35m now.

[i-Ram]

24 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

I agree with this with the exception of the last sentence. Whatever the final outcome, the club will not be left in a good place. All we can hope for from Mel now is that he fully contributes in limiting any further damage. If he had run the club prudently over the past seven years, the massive debts accumulated over that time would have been avoided, with or without Covid19.

The £20m revenue loss due to Covid19 may have been the sole factor in pushing the club over the cliff to administration. However, we were driven to the cliff edge by paying inflated transfer fees and wages for players not good enough to deliver promotion, together with compensation of around £35m to employees of the club whose contracts were terminated at Mel's whim. How we could do with that £35m now.

Not dismissing your claim (in bold) but what is your source/breakdown to support that statement?

[QuitYourJibbaJivin]

29 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

I agree with this with the exception of the last sentence. Whatever the final outcome, the club will not be left in a good place. All we can hope for from Mel now is that he fully contributes in limiting any further damage. If he had run the club prudently over the past seven years, the massive debts accumulated over that time would have been avoided, with or without Covid19.

The £20m revenue loss due to Covid19 may have been the sole factor in pushing the club over the cliff to administration. However, we were driven to the cliff edge by paying inflated transfer fees and wages for players not good enough to deliver promotion, together with compensation of around £35m to employees of the club whose contracts were terminated at Mel's whim. How we could do with that £35m now.

IF come January we have new owners, the debt is cleared, the club, ground and training ground are whole and the P&S issues are dealt with, that would be the best place the club has been in for years IMO

[Beetle]

These numbers are crazy. I have no idea why anyone would want to take any club on.

Leicester, probably the nearest example to us in the PL, have been really successful and have lost nearly £90m in two years.

What will football do when the owners decide enough us enough?