Derby County v Exeter City Tuesday 25 October

[RoyMac5]

9 minutes ago, IlsonDerby said:

I disagree. The crowd starts off on side and up for it and as long as the team show something they’ll stick with them. 

Chicken and egg as in if the manager had set up the players better then there might have been more for the crowd.

[Mr Tibbs]

52 minutes ago, IlsonDerby said:

The expectant comment is interesting. 

 

Id argue that they’re giving us nothing to sing about. When the manager is coming out swinging after the match you know that even he doesn’t think the effort was there. 

 

Before the game it was flat. We started brightly and it was still flat. Think the home crowd in general has just changed mentality. Plenty of backing on Friday night despite not having much to shout about. 

Hope for better at the weekend, when we've all had a lie in.

[Ram-Alf]

I moved seats from North Stand Lower to South West Upper because of the sun glaring in my eyes, Now it will be where I sit for the rest of the season.

Wow you get to see the game a damn site better.

The Officials, And I'm going to be as kind as possible...they Stunk, Truely woeful, But that's because I don't like em.

That 1st half...what did Warne call it...Abhorrent...the Cambridge dictionary says...morally very bad, I thought it was worse than that, So best leave it at that, 2nd half an improvement, Just a bit, But an improvement.

Now to get to the Crux of our problems, And I've read from page 25 onwards, I get posters feelings, Your either a Rosenior fan or accepting Warne has a big job on his hands.

I like Rosenior, I didn't like his football, Good, Bag and Ugly(said this before in a previous post)Rosenior said...I think it was after the Fleetwood game that this is the way we're going to play no if's buts or maybes, No plan "B" it's his way and his players not going to change.

Warne comes in and is given a squad of talented players that do not fit into his style of play, He has to shoehorn those players into a style that he believes is best suited for this division, It's like playing "Ker-Plunk", You're hoping to play a player where it suits him and not play him where it doesn't, Unfortunately when you pull the stick out the players fall down.

I'm not going to analyse the players as we've been through that ringer already, David Clowes has gone with what he believes is the best bet to get out of this division, The man who pays the piper gets to call the tune, I don't like the tune that's being played...ATM, But I'm a patient fella as I do have a lot of time, So time aint a problem for me.

I don't like this division one little bit, But it's where we are, Walking back to the bus station after the game, Listening to the fans perspective of the game and Managers are the same on here...all opinion based on what they see, We all see things differently.

COYRs 

 

[TomBustler1884]

There is a huge amount of overreaction going on in our fanbase.

We have a very unbalanced squad made up of youngsters and veterans. We can't recruit properly due to the ongoing conditions related to administration.

Internally the club is being slowly rebuilt after mass redundancies and resignations.

We have a management team asking players to buy into a new style and commit themselves to aggressive, pressing and demanding football. Some of them may not have the fitness or mentality needed. It will take until at least Christmas to work out which players those are, and possibly longer to move them out and replace them. We also don't have a squad big enough to drop them.

Last night was dreadful. But to be honest, it was clear from before kick off how much this meant to Exeter. Their fans were loud and going for it before the players came out and if that excitement was mirrored by the players, it was always going to be difficult.

We're not going to be consistent at the moment, our squad options are minimal and, as Warne said last night, it's a lovely group of lads who are way too nice for League 1 football. Hourihane I don't think can do this style of football and Bird is better suited to Championship/PL football. He isn't a L1 player.

The basic thing Warne will be demanding is intensity, pace and aggression. Some will do it, some won't.

Lastly, I don't know where the expectation of promotion came from? If it happens, great, but realistically, a top 10 finish should be seen as successful bearing in mind everything that has happened in the last few years. 

[LazloW]

After more reflection about the match…

The ‘positives’

We kept a clean sheet and I can’t remember them creating many clear cut chances.

Wildsmith, Cashin, Roberts and Forsyth all played well. Dobbin was lively when he came on. Smith did OK at right back when out of position.

The back four seemed more positive than the back five and, overall, the second half was better (albeit I agree with Warne that it was still too frantic as a result of the sloppy first half).

Unlike Rowettball, at least we were trying to be positive and get the ball forward and attack; not sitting back, 10 men behind the ball and looking to hit teams on the break. It rarely worked, but at least there is positive intent.

Warne’s post match interview was good. 

The negatives

If you haven’t got the players to play your preferred style or formation then adapt your style and formation! A good manager shouldn’t need to come in and have to wait for January to basically rip up a new squad and start again. We haven’t the time or money for that anyway, so Warne needs to find a way of using the players we have.  
I don’t think a back 5 with NML at right wing back and Barkuizen or Roberts at left wing back is going to work. 

Similarly, bypassing the midfield with endless balls down the channels in hope of hitting of hitting a player rather than expectation isn’t a long term prospect for success. The bright spots of yesterday’s game where when our wingers ran at defenders and got the ball in. More of getting the ball to their feet and less hoofing it please.

We have good footballers playing in midfield, but if you don’t use them they’re wasted. I find it funny that I keep hearing we need a load of bruisers there to play for Warne; maybe so, but if that is the case it again highlights a potential managerial weakness. Play to our strengths (although in fairness I have always said we’ll need a few more players to bring the squad up to full strength- and that might mean different types of player too - but that’s a long term issue; use the players you have now to the best of their ability).  

Found the Chester for McGoldrick sub very odd. Could go like for like with Stearman but instead moves Sibley to left wing back. Completely foreign position for him. To then drag him off at half time was just a waste of a sub.  If you want to bring Didzy (?) on then do so, but change the system to accommodate, don’t shoehorn things in that will never work.  Again, I get that we’re still short of players and have pretty much had people out of position from day 1. However, Knight playing right back was out of necessity; I don’t think the same can be said for Warne, who could at least limit the square pegs approach if he wanted to.

Officials were appalling again.  Not blaming them for the result. Just an observation. 

Took ages to get out of Pride Park last night so endured more of Radio Derby than normal. The new chap is OK, but my God Ed Dawes is still king of the wrist slashers.  If his post match questions and observations are anything to go by I don’t know how anybody could listen to his commentary. Somehow, even when i probably agree with what he says in principle, he still manages to wind me up.  

 

[angieram]

On last night's match specifically,  I would have liked Warne to have taken more responsibility in his RamsTV interview for the poor first half performance. He set them up wrongly and had to change it at half time. We were playing badly way before Chester's injury.

He didn't play Sibley in his preferred position as someone stated, he  should have been part of a midfield three, where he can run at defences. I'd have started McGoldrick alongside Osula,  get some control of the ball early.

After half time we used a back four for the first time since Warne's arrival and despite Smith playing completely out of position we immediately looked more comfortable and better able to find other players. However, by this time options were limited and Mendez-Laing was the main threat, as usual, better when he was able to play further forward. Dobbin looks bright and can beat a man, but we didn't really get the right sort of balls into the box from either wing.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but am starting to feel a bit sorry for both Bird and Hourihane. No good saying they aren't playing well when we seem determined to bypass midfield in our approach play.

Whilst not calling them out as suspicious exactly, Warne did cast doubt on both Chester and Barkhuizen's injuries, by saying that Chester "felt" his calf, said Barks' hamstring was "surprising". The inference was definitely there. He also took a swipe at Sibley and Dobbin, and stated that we have no right back at the club, which must have filled Oduruh with confidence, for sure! 

It seems to me that he thinks he has a bit of a problem getting the players onside with what he's trying to do. What is he trying to do, by the way? I've still no idea! 

Fozzy's comment after the match was telling. Run more. Is that it? There's no wonder they are confused, so am I.

 

[Big Trav]

I don’t think the players have or are buying into Paul Warne and his football. Most of them came specifically for Rosenior remember and there was a big uproar when he didn’t get the job. Some of those players need to leave and you can see which ones they are…

[Mr. P]

13 minutes ago, angieram said:

On last night's match specifically,  I would have liked Warne to have taken more responsibility in his RamsTV interview for the poor first half performance. He set them up wrongly and had to change it at half time. We were playing badly way before Chester's injury.

 

 

Thought he did in a way.

 

[Dcfcsr92]

7 hours ago, Jourdan said:

I think most managers would try to see if their style works in a new job and then adjust accordingly.

In an ideal world, he would have had a pre season to do that, but he arrived a fifth into the season. So can he be blamed for trying to make his mark? I am not sure it’s fair at this stage. 15 games in, I could see your point.

Will he make changes? Will he adjust? Time will tell.

If he is as switched on as his interviews suggest, we should see evidence of what he has learnt about his players and how suitable his style is in the next 5-10 games.

By the end of the year, it will be much clearer whether Warne, the players, the club are a good fit.

At the same time, the fans have to be open to a different way. Many are not, so Warne is essentially fighting a losing battle with much of the fanbase.

It takes time to bring in your own style it doesnt happen over night, but at the same time football is all about winning we dont look like scoring which is becoming big problem 

[Curtains]

3 minutes ago, Dcfcsr92 said:

It takes time to bring in your own style it doesnt happen over night, but at the same time football is all about winning we dont look like scoring which is becoming big problem 

It takes time if the system is not fitting the players .

4-4-2 or 4-3-3 should be used not this stupid 3-5-2

[Curtains]

12 minutes ago, Mr. P said:

Thought he did in a way.

 

Sorry but you need to accept  some responsibility with the system you are employing.

How much better we were with 4 at the back 

[RoyMac5]

36 minutes ago, TomBustler1884 said:

The basic thing Warne will be demanding is intensity, pace and aggression. Some will do it, some won't.

So the players have to adapt and if they can't, not won't but can't... Doesn't Warne have to adapt until he can change the squad?

[Curtains]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

So the players have to adapt and if they can't, not won't but can't... Doesn't Warne have to adapt until he can change the squad?

Of course he does .

He did 2nd half last night to his credit .

In reality he’s won 2 lost 2 drawn 1 .

He needs time to sort it out but it’s worrying he persists with 3 at the back and last night put Sibley at left wing back to maintain the 3 after Chester was injured .

Why ! 

[Tamworthram]

43 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Sorry but you need to accept  some responsibility with the system you are employing.

How much better we were with 4 at the back 

But he did accept some responsibility. What is your point?

[Mr Tibbs]

58 minutes ago, angieram said:

I can't believe I'm saying this, but am starting to feel a bit sorry for both Bird and Hourihane. No good saying they aren't playing well when we seem determined to bypass midfield in our approach play.

Agree with most of your post Angie but feel this is a becoming a bit of a myth. How many times does the ball have to go across the back 5 or 4 before Bird and Hourihane show for it? Before they show an ounce of interest and bravery to move the ball up the pitch. I'm not quite sure what PW is trying to do at times but I can't imagine he's told these pair to not show for the ball, not give a wing back an option on the inside, support the forward players when they win a knock down.... they were just invisible. There was no bypassing, if anything there wasn't enough hoofing. 

The only player I'd start to feel sorry for is Cashin, as he is left all the responsibility to get the ball moving forward. Bird and Hourihane have been putting in performances like this before Warne arrived, it's not something we didn't see under LR. Pretty sure there's a few old threads knocking about saying just as much.

We obviously want Max to do well and he'll get more leeway than others, being one of our own, but he's got to start bringing something to the table, consistently. 

 

[IlsonDerby]

1 hour ago, Andicis said:

Bit different when judging luck with a striker being sent off for an off the ball incident and strikers just missing chances in my opinion.

How? Neither are in control of the manager. Rosenior bought in the best available 9 at this level and it took 10 games for him to get going. Unfortunately Rosenior never got to benefit from that. 
 

Don’t get me wrong Rosenior had his faults but to put your eggs in a basket of someone the complete opposite to him with no transfer window near was madness.

[IlsonDerby]

1 hour ago, Mr Tibbs said:

Before the game it was flat. We started brightly and it was still flat. Think the home crowd in general has just changed mentality. Plenty of backing on Friday night despite not having much to shout about. 

Hope for better at the weekend, when we've all had a lie in.

I think we drowned out their big following at the start of the game, we started sharply but for the second game running after 5 minutes we seemed to lose the edge. 

[RoyMac5]

42 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Of course he does .

He did 2nd half last night to his credit .

In reality he’s won 2 lost 2 drawn 1 .

He needs time to sort it out but it’s worrying he persists with 3 at the back and last night put Sibley at left wing back to maintain the 3 after Chester was injured .

Why ! 

He wasn't proactive though, just reactive. Why Smith at RB? That unbalanced midfield even more.

[duncanjwitham]

6 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

But he did accept some responsibility. What is your point?

(Paraphrasing...) "I accept responsibility that the players didn't run enough and didn't tackle enough" is not accepting responsibility, it's pretending to accept responsibility while lumping all the blame on the players.

[RoyMac5]

1 hour ago, Big Trav said:

I don’t think the players have or are buying into Paul Warne and his football. Most of them came specifically for Rosenior remember and there was a big uproar when he didn’t get the job. Some of those players need to leave and you can see which ones they are…

Nope to be honest I can't, atm it looks like all of them bar Cashin and Wildsmith!