Derby County Administration (with the slight possibility of Liquidation still there)

[sage]

12 minutes ago, atherstoneram said:

Did you recognise her from behind.

I'm not going to get involved in this juvenile bottom related banter 

But if you want to, crack on. 

[Icomeinpeace]

1 minute ago, sage said:

I'm not going to get involved in this juvenile bottom related banter 

But if you want to, crack on. 

Turns out it wasn't her .... must have been a bum steer

[Sparkle]

24 minutes ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said:

We could have a full away end if they can start gifting tickets too. 
 

I can’t wait for next Wednesday, it’s the clash of the naughty boys. 

Both teams could just stand there and not move - 0-0 to highlight a total farce 

then again - Derby county 45 - 45 Reading would leave us both with some serious leading goal scorers to sell ?

[Crewton]

1 hour ago, Charlotte Ram said:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/hmrc-as-a-preferential-creditor

there you go

It doesn't mean they won't support a CVA that will pay them more than is projected through liquidation, just that they have a higher ranking. So "must be paid in full" is a starting position.

[JoetheRam]

23 minutes ago, SamUltraRam said:

For what it's worth, there was a helicopter at Morley Hayes today. (genuinely)

Could it be the administrators, could it be Dell, could it be Superman

3 helicopters flew over Uttoxeter in formation earlier heading in the direction of Derby.

Could have been a consortium of Bamford, and them Bamfords from Stoke!

[vonwright]

24 minutes ago, TheresOnlyWanChope said:

Awful stuff. Could be the end of DCFC and Morris will be to blame. 
Really depressing time. ?

 

The more I read the angrier I get. It's one thing gambling with your own money, but this was gambling with the very existence of the club - in other words gambling with something which has been very important to generations of people with a fraction of the money that Mel has. It's not even like he's gone bankrupt in the process, just walked away with his overpriced stadium and list of people who are 'really' to blame. 

[Ghost of Clough]

27 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

"In the 2018/19 season it was reported that Reading’s wage bill was £40m, working out as 194 per cent of their turnover.

For the following campaign their accounts revealed total accumulated losses of £138m, while their most recent pre-tax loss was £93m over a three-year period.

Relegated from the Premier League in 2013, Reading have operated in the Championship for the past nine seasons."

6 to 9 points? But we'd get 4 for £4m?

It's based on the sliding scale

Less than £2m = 3 points
£2-4m = 4 points
£4-6m = 5 points
£6-8m = 6 points
£8-10m = 7 points
£10-12.5m = 8 points
£12.5-15m = 9 points
More than £15m = 12 points

[SamUltraRam]

8 minutes ago, Crewton said:

It doesn't mean they won't support a CVA that will pay them more than is projected through liquidation, just that they have a higher ranking. So "must be paid in full" is a starting position.

So if Mel, as a final gesture, paid off the HMRC before he put us into administration, we would be infinitely more sellable and he would have a much clearer conscience 

If he has put £200m into us over 7 years, that's £28m per year so it would just be another years expenditure to him ?

& even a cautious stock market investor could have made 5% pa on their funds - 5% of £500m = £25m per year

Edited September 21, 2021 by SamUltraRam

[Topram]

13 minutes ago, Icomeinpeace said:

Blimey the potential administrator comes with, shall we say "baggage"

https://the72.co.uk/250919/what-do-we-know-about-andrew-hosking-andrew-andronikou-and-quantuma-Derby-countys-likely-administrators/ 

Hired Samuelson for takeover talks now this guy for administration, he doesn’t learn does he 

[GenBr]

9 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

Have you actually done any research into exactly what level of football you'd be watching with a phoenix club?

Bury's new club have started off in the North West Counties Football League Division One North, from what I can gather (although it can get a bit confusing) to work their way back up they'd have to progress as follows:

North West Counties Football League Division One North (same level as Ripley Town FC)
North West Counties Football League Premier Division (same level as Heanor Town - who's reserves are, I think, in the league we'd be in!)
Northern Premier League West Division (same level as Belper, Ilkeston Town)
Northern Premier League Premier - (same level as Mickleover, Matlock)
National League North
National League
League Two
League One

7 promotions needed for them, 8 for us and there's no guarantee that they'd come easy

Now I've looked into it, the thought travelling Derby supporters going to to Matlock to sample one of those pies is looking, well, ambitious!

I don't want to see us completely disappear, because we'd lose all of our history and we'd have nothing in the way of assets, but if we did phoenix i think it would actually be kind of fun in those lower leagues. Playing teams like Ilkeston would be a good laugh at least

[Crewton]

29 minutes ago, SamUltraRam said:

So if Mel, as a final gesture, paid off the HMRC before he put us into administration, we would be infinitely more sellable and he would have a much clearer conscience 

If he has put £200m into us over 7 years, that's £28m per year so it would just be another years expenditure to him ?

& even a cautious stock market investor could have made 5% pa on their funds - 5% of £500m = £25m per year

Well, IF he's been putting in £1.5M per month since the pandemic began (say) that's £18M p.a out of that £25M p.a less tax. Then you're assuming he's still got £500M to invest - I've no idea if that's the case. It's probably not self-funding.

No doubt, if he did pay off HMRC, that would make the club more attractive, but would he want more for it as a result?

We don't know yet what else he's willing to do to sweeten any purchase for a Buyer - if he wants some redemption, he might be willing to make further sacrifices.

 

[Leeds Ram]

56 minutes ago, Coconut's Beard said:

Have you actually done any research into exactly what level of football you'd be watching with a phoenix club?

Bury's new club have started off in the North West Counties Football League Division One North, from what I can gather (although it can get a bit confusing) to work their way back up they'd have to progress as follows:

North West Counties Football League Division One North (same level as Ripley Town FC)
North West Counties Football League Premier Division (same level as Heanor Town - who's reserves are, I think, in the league we'd be in!)
Northern Premier League West Division (same level as Belper, Ilkeston Town)
Northern Premier League Premier - (same level as Mickleover, Matlock)
National League North
National League
League Two
League One

7 promotions needed for them, 8 for us and there's no guarantee that they'd come easy

Now I've looked into it, the thought travelling Derby supporters going to to Matlock to sample one of those pies is looking, well, ambitious!

In fairness I think if the worst ever did happen it would be more than manageable to get quickfire promotions into the National League. Look at AFC Wimbledon as just one example of a smaller club but one that shot through the divisions simply because they were well organised and were a bigger draw than anyone around them.  

[Icomeinpeace]

14 minutes ago, Crewton said:

Well, IF he's been putting in £1.5M per month since the pandemic began (say) that's £18M p.a out of that £25M p.a less tax. Then you're assuming he's still got £500M to invest - I've no idea if that's the case. It's probably not self-funding.

No doubt, if he did pay off HMRC, that would make the club more attractive, but would he want more for it as a result?

We don't know yet what else he's willing to do to sweeten any purchase for a Buyer - if he wants some redemption, he might be willing to make further sacrifices.

 

I believe I've read elsewhere that Mel's other business interests have been doing well so although he may have spent 200m and have 300 to fall back on from that he's actually been making money elsewhere... the timing of his decision is "odd"  

[Woodley Ram]

1 hour ago, JoetheRam said:

3 helicopters flew over Uttoxeter in formation earlier heading in the direction of Derby.

Could have been a consortium of Bamford, and them Bamfords from Stoke!

3 helicopters you say, that would be the adminstrators junior staff bring the pens, paper and calculators in 

[SamUltraRam]

25 minutes ago, Icomeinpeace said:

I believe I've read elsewhere that Mel's other business interests have been doing well so although he may have spent 200m and have 300 to fall back on from that he's actually been making money elsewhere... the timing of his decision is "odd"  

Agreed.

Let's say he bought Derby when his worth was £500m - & yes, I know this wasn't necessarily fluid wealth but it had value somewhere.

Mel claims to have invested £200m over his 7 year tenure. Let's say that was £60m to buy the club plus 7 years x £20m per year.

So, he would have wealth of £440m after buying us and as I said earlier, even a cautious investor could have made 5%pa on that and a more adventurous investor could comfortably have got 10% pa returns  - Mel could not be described as a cautious investor as was proven with his 'startup' company funding of King Promotions & also by the way he has gambled with our clubs future.

So by my estimates , just his investment growth alone should have covered his expenditure on DCFC & he would still have maintained his personal wealth at about the level that it started at.

I know that taxes would have eaten into his growth returns but we all know that the wealthy are adept at 'controlling' the amount of tax that they pay. 

FFP was the problem that we had - we didn't expect it to be bankruptcy

Plus Mel Morris can now add a football stadium to his portfolio

Edited September 21, 2021 by SamUltraRam

[observer]

1 hour ago, JoetheRam said:

3 helicopters flew over Uttoxeter in formation earlier heading in the direction of Derby.

Could have been a consortium of Bamford, and them Bamfords from Stoke!

the irony of an even richer local businessman coming in that could genuinely afford to compete in the prem would be funny!!!
dont know if I would like that yellow on kits though haha

 

[uttoxram75]

1 hour ago, JoetheRam said:

3 helicopters flew over Uttoxeter in formation earlier heading in the direction of Derby.

Could have been a consortium of Bamford, and them Bamfords from Stoke!

Yep, saw them as well. Could be the administrators flying in ?

[Ram-Alf]

27 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

In fairness I think if the worst ever did happen it would be more than manageable to get quickfire promotions into the National League. Look at AFC Wimbledon as just one example of a smaller club but one that shot through the divisions simply because they were well organised and were a bigger draw than anyone around them.  

But then again....tongue in cheek.

F.C. United of Manchester...founded 2005 mid table in the Northern Premier League

[CornwallRam]

5 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

Yep, saw them as well. Could be the administrators flying in ?

It's this year's I'm a Celebrity. It involves parachuting famous people into Derby County and slowly torturing them with increasingly unpleasant situations. 

[SamUltraRam]

3 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

But then again....tongue in cheek.

F.C. United of Manchester...founded 2005 mid table in the Northern Premier League

Glasgow Rangers somehow managed to remain in the Scottish league system rather than the Highland League or whatever