Keogh Sacked

[Turnstile]

5 hours ago, Broderick said:

Horrible way for a club legend to leave ?. I'd almost rather him go to forest or something than this. 

Club legend my arse.Just one of footballs many frauds.True colours come to mind.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Turnstile

[Kinder]

8 minutes ago, angieram said:

I have felt too emotional about the whole situation to offer my view up to now.

My heart is broken for a good captain and warrior for DCFC. To be sacked from the club you have given 100% to on the pitch over seven gruelling seasons must be humiliating and make you feel dreadful.

However, my head now questions how much of Keogh's passion for Derby is real. The least favourable offer he turned down from the club, if accurate, of £3,000 per week, is more than the prime minister's salary and only slightly less than the chief police constable of Derbyshire who has responsibility for a huge budget and staff team  who do a tremendously difficult job every day at work.

He was also being offered free state of the art rehabilitation facilities, could start to work on his coaching badges if he wished and presumably would also be free to supplement his income with appearances on Sky ("like you say") or other options if that is his choice. Most importantly in all this he was being offered an opportunity to retain his status as a good servant of the club and the adoration and support of the fans.

He has chosen to reject all this for what? More money. Not much of a swap in my opinion.

His action will now by actively costing the club too as they will have been taking expensive legal advice and will have to continue to do so over the appeal and possible tribunal.

People are wondering why no official statement from Derby. I wonder whether the 'statement' we are reading is actually the dismissal letter to Keogh as the wording in it, including the 14 days' appeal time, reads like a letter from HR. 

I don't know if I am being overly supportive of my club, but the whole way this story has broken makes me think it has come from Keogh's side. He clearly feels very aggrieved about the way he is being treated.

I also think this will have been going back and forward for some time, that this is just the latest play from the club and that they might have been hoping for a response from Keogh that would have allowed him a successful appeal, rather than a messy, public and prolonged visit to an industrial tribunal.

All this is huge speculation on my part, for which I hold my hands up. It is coloured by my huge love for our club, rather than for any individual player, no matter how good a servant he has been to DCFC.

What I do know is that while Keogh still has my sympathy, he's lost my respect. 

 

 

Really good post Angie.  I feel very sad about the whole saga as well.  I don’t know enough about what really happened / is happening to side with club or Keogh, but it’s another unfortunate situation of our dirty linen being aired in public.  I just want it to be about football - preferably good football.

[RedSox]

WIthout wanting to come across as too melodramatic, who knows how much damage this is doing to our attempts to secure additional investment?  The knock-on effects of this issue could impact a lot more than just the spirit in the dressing room........ 

[Dimmu]

22 minutes ago, angieram said:

People are wondering why no official statement from Derby. I wonder whether the 'statement' we are reading is actually the dismissal letter to Keogh as the wording in it, including the 14 days' appeal time, reads like a letter from HR. 

I'd be very surprised if that's not the case. Also, it's nicely timed as appeal period is ending during the next international break so the forum can be in full meltdown mode continously.

[RamNut]

17 minutes ago, angieram said:

What I do know is that while Keogh still has my sympathy, he's lost my respect. 

Perhaps your assumption about the source of info is wrong. Didn’t the statement end with the usual “Derby county will be making no further comment” etc which they have said about three times now?

keogh could perhaps legitimately argue that he didn’t know that Lawrence  was over the limit, and therefore wasn’t Doing anything stupid or reckless by accepting a lift. The same argument would apply to the fourth player who has - for some reason - had his identity protected, but is clearly visible on the video of the players in the pub. Keogh could argue that he did nothing wrong. If i was in his shoes I wouldn’t want to immediately agree to a draconian pay cut if I believed myself to be an innocent victim. Particularly when the main culprits got a smack on the wrist. 

 

 

[ThePrisoner]

Wonder if he’s been blindly led up a stray path by his agent?

“£3,000 a week and state of the set facilities for your rehab?! Nah Richie boy, we can get you more than that.”

[RamNut]

4 minutes ago, ThePrisoner said:

Wonder if he’s been blindly led up a stray path by his agent?

“£3,000 a week and state of the set facilities for your rehab?! Nah Richie boy, we can get you more than that.”

I think it was in Stuart webb’s Book - a statement of incredulity that Derby County directors believed that they shouldn’t have to pay a player if they were injured. Any negotiated reduction in salary in this case would have to be by agreement. A 80-90% pay cut doesn’t seem a very reasonable final offer. The pfa will be fully behind keogh. 

[Ghost of Clough]

Just now, RamNut said:

I think it was in Stuart webb’s Book - a statement of incredulity that Derby County directors believed that they shouldn’t have to pay a player if they were injured. Any negotiated reduction in salary in this case would have to be by agreement. A 80-90% pay cut doesn’t seem a very reasonable final offer. The pfa will be fully behind keogh. 

I think it depends what his new role would have been and if the offer was in line with others doing the same/similar role within the club.

I imagine it'll be an out of court settlement - probably something like £500k 

[TramRam]

35 minutes ago, angieram said:

I have felt too emotional about the whole situation to offer my view up to now.

My heart is broken for a good captain and warrior for DCFC. To be sacked from the club you have given 100% to on the pitch over seven gruelling seasons must be humiliating and make you feel dreadful.

 

 

 

Don't be broken hearted young Lady, There's far more strife in this world to be concerned about than feeling pain for someone who's actions has cost himself his career.

I drink in a well known boozer in town, The actions of some of the Derby players in the 80s and 90s would make you think again, Wine, Women, Drugs, Fighting and yes driving home when drunk.

I know very little about RK, What I do know is when Nigel Pearson was here, It was RK and another who went running to MM to tell him that the regime Pearson was putting in place the players didn't like, Soon after Pearson is sacked.

Pro footballers have a very privaliged position and with this comes responsability. Believe me when I say it's not all doom and gloom in the changing room.

Saturday will be the start of another chapter in the Derby County saga.

[Sparkle]

10 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I think it depends what his new role would have been and if the offer was in line with others doing the same/similar role within the club.

I imagine it'll be an out of court settlement - probably something like £500k 

I very much doubt it - if he has broken the agreed rules the employer can dismiss him and certainly dismiss him for not being fit for work due to an out of hours incident with no chance of being available in the near future - I believe another poster said the maximum payout at a tribunal would be £50,000 if the employer did something wrong in its process unless there is a sexual discrimination element which there clearly isn’t 

[angieram]

22 minutes ago, RamNut said:

Perhaps your assumption about the source of info is wrong. Didn’t the statement end with the usual “Derby county will be making no further comment” etc which they have said about three times now?

keogh could perhaps legitimately argue that he didn’t know that Lawrence  was over the limit, and therefore wasn’t Doing anything stupid or reckless by accepting a lift. The same argument would apply to the fourth player who has - for some reason - had his identity protected, but is clearly visible on the video of the players in the pub. Keogh could argue that he did nothing wrong. If i was in his shoes I wouldn’t want to immediately agree to a draconian pay cut if I believed myself to be an innocent victim. Particularly when the main culprits got a smack on the wrist. 

 

 

Yes, of course, there are lots of different takes on what the situation might be at the moment. How I posted is how I feel right now based on what I've read or heard. If things come out later that make me recognise I've got it wrong, I will of course feel differently. 

I haven't factored in the treatment of the other players into my thoughts as for me, the cases are very different. The fact that Keogh can't do the job he is paid to do is a huge consideration for me personally (a reflection of my role as a manager over many years.) 

If Keogh feels an innocent victim, as you say, his course of action is surely against the players he feels are responsible, not the club. 

[ThePrisoner]

19 minutes ago, RamNut said:

I think it was in Stuart webb’s Book - a statement of incredulity that Derby County directors believed that they shouldn’t have to pay a player if they were injured. Any negotiated reduction in salary in this case would have to be by agreement. A 80-90% pay cut doesn’t seem a very reasonable final offer. The pfa will be fully behind keogh. 

Granted an injury on the pitch would be covered by insurance. An injury was daft decision making outside of work, I think that pay cut is very fair.

I'd like £3,000 a week if Keogh doesn't want it.

[CornwallRam]

2 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

Keogh is perfectly entitled to appeal within his employment rights as per any other individual so it's not down to Keogh if the matter drags on as you phrase it.

If the appeal is unsuccessful then Keogh will also be perfectly entitled to either take the club to an industrial tribunal as he has been at the company i.e. Derby for more than 2 years or even sue the club if he saw fit which will also mean that the matter drags on even further which again he is perfectly entitled to do as per any other individual.

If Morris thought that Keogh would just walk away after being dismissed then he is extremely naive so he must have known that his actions would then form a cloud over the club for a great length of time afterwards

 

It'll never go to tribunal. Those are for normal employees, not millionaires. If Keogh fights it, it'll be through the civil courts.

[RoyMac5]

41 minutes ago, RamNut said:

keogh could perhaps legitimately argue that he didn’t know that Lawrence  was over the limit, and therefore wasn’t Doing anything stupid or reckless by accepting a lift. 

Maybe. Perhaps he was so 'full of his own thoughts' he couldn't tell or put his seatbelt on? Same as he didn't notice Mason 'I've had more than 3' Chunder Bennett shouldn't have been driving either?

Just poor show from the Captain and the injury was his own fault.

Edited November 1, 2019 by RoyMac5

[Ghost of Clough]

17 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

I very much doubt it - if he has broken the agreed rules the employer can dismiss him and certainly dismiss him for not being fit for work due to an out of hours incident with no chance of being available in the near future - I believe another poster said the maximum payout at a tribunal would be £50,000 if the employer did something wrong in its process unless there is a sexual discrimination element which there clearly isn’t 

The cap you refer to is for unfair dismissal (?). I doubt that's the route Keogh will go down.

[Tamworthram]

1 hour ago, Turnstile said:

Club legend my arse.Just one of footballs many frauds.True colours come to mind.

I wouldn't describe him as a club legend but not a fraudster either. What exactly has he done? Played football and been paid loads of money for doing it. Who can blame him? That's not fraud in my book. 

[Wolfie]

Did Cocu say owt last night about it?.

Haven't been able to catch up with the press conference.

[ramit]

“As we have said from the outset, the club will not tolerate any of its players or staff behaving in a manner which puts themselves, their colleagues, and members of the general public at risk of injury or worse, or which brings the club into disrepute.”

How did Keogh put his colleagues and members of the general public at risk of injury or worse?

[cheron85]

Two new thoughts this morning

1) Guess who's still on the website in the squad list?

2) We officially have zero 'recognised' CBs in the squad by the end of this season

(assuming Evans and Bielik are CMs and Wisdom is a RB by trade)

[Ghost of Clough]

5 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

Two new thoughts this morning

1) Guess who's still on the website in the squad list?

2) We officially have zero 'recognised' CBs in the squad by the end of this season

(assuming Evans and Bielik are CMs and Wisdom is a RB by trade)

It's a very slim squad next summer:
Roos, Mitchell, Bogle, Wisdom, Evans, Malone, Lowe, Bielik, Shinnie, Bird, Holmes, Rooney, Lawrence, Jozefzoon, Waghorn, Marriott, (and academy players)