Does Warne deserve the vitriol aimed at him?

[vonwright]

39 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

How can you class what are mainly free or nominal transfers as big-money signings when we are not privy to the wages, bonuses, or the agents fees being paid?

Please don't take this the wrong way, as I think you are an excellent poster, but you can sometimes be weirdly pedantic and binary about things like this. 

Surely it's reasonable to assume these players are on very good deals for League One? As in it's highly unlikely they are not?

[Blondest Goat]

Never ceases to amaze me how quick people are to completely dismiss a player's previous record and write them off based on their first few games in a rams shirt. 

[Sparkle]

As fans in this league we expect to win but we also expect to be entertained with good progressive football being played 

this season and last season we have won games but I see no progression and no real football being played and no intent to play any either - so entertainment is very restricted 

[FlyBritishMidland]

1 hour ago, vonwright said:

The bar he needs to clear isn't 'getting them all right'. That would be unreasonable. 

I think he's had too many misses and not enough hits. Even Nyambe (a hit) was the third right back he signed. Presumably because he realised his two previous signings weren't up to the job (they weren't helped by his complete u-turn on preferred formation after he'd spent all the money).

I guess we disagree as to whether big-money signings like Bradley, Ward, Elder, Washington are indeed 'bedding in', or if they represent bad business. Whether Fornah just needs time or will forever be lightweight and error prone. Personally I think they've been here long enough to form a reasonable view of their likely value, and the overall picture is poor. Good players often come in and make an immediate impact - because they are good players. At any rate, they tend to have a lot more impact than this. 

Just on the bold bit, I seem to remember that in August Warne saying he wanted another defender but the player in question was hanging on to see if any Championship offers came in.  When Nyambe signed on his short-term deal I assumed he was the player Warne was talking about.  Of course, I could be completely wrong, just my assumption.

[europia]

It's probably OK to not like Warne's media personality without insulting his management credentials. I'm not sure if another manager would be doing better with this squad and it's limitations. Of course it's possible, but not a certainty. Also, no one other than those close to the management and owner have an insight into the budget constraints. All factors for consideration. 

[Dcfcsr92]

3 hours ago, europia said:

It's probably OK to not like Warne's media personality without insulting his management credentials. I'm not sure if another manager would be doing better with this squad and it's limitations. Of course it's possible, but not a certainty. Also, no one other than those close to the management and owner have an insight into the budget constraints. All factors for consideration. 

You would of said that about clough before stevie mac.. its what coaches give you and currently i feel alot of coaches could do that we have good enough players to get out this league and a better manager would do that! I would push the boat out on a better coach then new players coming in🫤 we hve a acadamy dont always have to look at other teams 

[Archied]

21 hours ago, Bob The Badger said:

If you look at Warne's record, it's actually not that bad.

Last season we came within a kippers dick of making the playoffs after what was possibly the most turbulent time in the club's history.

And last night, we could have gone top, and yet half the board would be happy to see the guy fired.

Does anybody ever remember that level of vitriol and animosity toward a manager who didn't have us struggling? And struggling badly.

Other than possibly Dave Mackay for a short period and entirely other reasons, I cannot remember anything like it.

For some while, I just thought it was Derby fans being entitled, but after conversations with @Eatonram, it seems like we're pretty bad every game and winning in spite of ourselves rather than because of ourselves.

I have to admit that I rarely get to see Derby play these days, so I base a lot of my opinions either on highlights or on what I read. As such, I accept that 90% of posters on this forum are better informed than me.

So, does he deserve all this piling on, or should we be sticking by him?

 

Think rowett got similar 

[i-Ram]

Warne doesnt deserve or need online abuse, although I think calling him a PE Teacher or a Physio is fair game personally. This is a footy forum which should be an environment to let off a bit of steam, have a bit of banter, etc. If he is reading this site he needs to give his bobble hat a wobble.

I choose not to resort to name calling. Other than at my TV/iPad in my home. I had to apologise to the wife for my inapproriate language on Tuesday night when I screamed filthy abuse at him. I rarely listen to his post match comments, because they are pretty much rinse and repeat. But on Tuesday I wanted to hear him explain that abject performance. The bit that got my dander up was his comment regarding Reading holding on to the win. I can't recall his actual words but they were something like 'fair play to Reading, their game management at the end, defending their one goal advantage was very good. I wish we could do that'. I shouted something like well Paul that is your job, to organise some control in the last few minutes when we are trying to hold on to a lead, but when we are in the final minutes in such situations, we have full backs charging up the wings, with as much support as midfield can muster, to get the ball into the mixer, and win second balls. Something like that I said.

Anyhow. I am sure he is a very nice man. 

[Ian Buxton's Bat]

Agree 100% with @iRam that Warne, or any of the players do not deserve abuse. 

I think for any manager, the key thing is to try and make a team better than the sum parts - simple as.

Is Warne achieving that? In my opinion no.....but I hope he does achieve that.

If you are not making the team better than the sum parts then other aspects come into it, like ......Are you winning games? (We are) Are you playing an entertaining form of football? (In my opinion, we're not) and Where are you in the league? (In my opinion, doing OK but not great bearing in mind the squad).

So, when we lose a game against lesser teams, playing unattractive football and our league position suffers, it's no surprise that criticism comes in.

But.....Having listened to the BBC podcast with Warne and Karl Robinson and heard the latter's abuse/bullying of players, and having seen Deeney binned for slagging off players in public....after a 4 game ban for abusing officials, I'm pleased we've got a decent bloke in charge.

 

 

 

[YorkshireRam]

13 hours ago, Sparkle said:

As fans in this league we expect to win but we also expect to be entertained with good progressive football being played 

this season and last season we have won games but I see no progression and no real football being played and no intent to play any either - so entertainment is very restricted 

This is the kind of entitlement that needs to be extinguished. We're still rebuilding a squad that was decimated by administration, where's this expectation coming from, and isn't it just setting you up for disappointment? 

[RoyMac5]

Just now, YorkshireRam said:

This is the kind of entitlement that needs to be extinguished. We're still rebuilding a squad that was decimated by administration, where's this expectation coming from, and isn't it just setting you up for disappointment? 

David Clowes is where it's come from: "Paul's been given a budget...I think it's good enough to get us out of the league" 

https://twitter.com/BBCDerbySport/status/1674810025028591616

True, I suppose he didn't say it would be entertaining. 😄

[BaaLocks]

It's certainly not a good idea to point vitriol at our manager when there is still much to play for. That's just barmy. But we can be clear on what we think success looks like and what we would expect to happen if that success was not achieved. That's not vitriol either, that's expectation. For me, he has to get us up this season - if that doesn't happen then my expectation would be he is not our manager at the start of next season.

[Sparkle]

2 hours ago, YorkshireRam said:

This is the kind of entitlement that needs to be extinguished. We're still rebuilding a squad that was decimated by administration, where's this expectation coming from, and isn't it just setting you up for disappointment? 

The entitlement comes from being Derby County with probably the biggest playing budget in the league but all that said to be trying to play a entertaining brand of football is a preference of mine personally- clearly the manager wasn’t to interested in the three cups we went out of so weakly at home in front of hardly anyone wanting to watch what was served up because they knew the opponents would be trying harder?

[YorkshireRam]

51 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

The entitlement comes from being Derby County with probably the biggest playing budget in the league but all that said to be trying to play a entertaining brand of football is a preference of mine personally- clearly the manager wasn’t to interested in the three cups we went out of so weakly at home in front of hardly anyone wanting to watch what was served up because they knew the opponents would be trying harder?

What positive does that entitlement bring?

[Sparkle]

7 hours ago, YorkshireRam said:

What positive does that entitlement bring?

???

[Jimbo Ram]

23 hours ago, europia said:

It's probably OK to not like Warne's media personality without insulting his management credentials. I'm not sure if another manager would be doing better with this squad and it's limitations. Of course it's possible, but not a certainty. Also, no one other than those close to the management and owner have an insight into the budget constraints. All factors for consideration. 

Could possibly argue that results might not be better….but the football certainly could/would be.

[Comrade 86]

Funny old thread this. When we're debating whether someone deserves abuse for going about their work and nothing more, you know that some are going in two-footed. Lots of folk claim when quizzed that they hold themselves to the same standard, but I wonder whether their co-workers would agree.

Not a pop at the OP btw, as it's a valid question IMO.

[MickD]

On 24/01/2024 at 05:05, MadAmster said:

Derby has always had scapegoats when things go pear shaped. Currently it's Warne and Bird getting the stick with Hourihane a close 3rd. Collins has been let of the hook somewhat and Sibs appears to be taking his place in the firing line. While some of the comments are valid on a single game level, they why is never looked at. A player will have an off day yet when he does, he's suddenly bloody useless. I have ones I'm not fond of. Ward and Wilson are, IMO, good wingbacks. Unfortunately for them, they have been regularly played at full back. Doesn't suddenly mean they have become useless overnight, just that they have been used in the "wrong" way and that is not the player's fault. That brings me back to Sibs... Only long spell he's had in any one role was at left back last season and he did well. What would happen if he got a run at #10? We'll never know.

"What would happen if he got a run at #10? We'll never know."  Let's hope so.

[derbydaz22]

I think in a nutshell fans would put up with this anti football if we go up but it’s a poor watch and if we do manage to go up some how we will be in a relegation. Battle for sure next season. If we actually tried to play football and had a game plan that wasn’t get a million crosses in to one player in the box Warne would get more slack from everyone.

[BatRam]

Some derby fans seem to be abit entitled. Same as forest fans. Both clubs have a very good history. But both have been crap for years yet think we should win everything and outplay every single team. Aslong as warne gets us out this bloody league i couldnt care less.