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The Ukraine War


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On 26/03/2022 at 09:26, GboroRam said:

The visa process is so complicated it's really hard to get refugees in. I also read that Ukrainians found in the country with incorrect documentation face up to 4 years imprisonment. 

You'd almost believe it was designed to keep refugees out. 

Well, that’s what they voted for at the referendum.

Oh! They didn’t mean those people!

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12 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

people=people

Do you understand why this attitude isn't feasible when applied as an immigration policy? If we refuse to make any value judgements then our policy is simply anyone is allowed in for any reason whenever they feel like it.

Also people=people is an utterly worthless platitude. In emergency situations women and children are usually prioritised for obvious reasons. They are less likely to be able to look after and provide for themselves.

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52 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

people=people

In fairness, there is a legal and moral distinction between these two groups. Refugees have a right to seek asylum, economic migrants don't. There is a moral difference between having to flee for your life and simply deciding you want greater economic and cultural benefits somewhere else. In all realms of life, we apply context to decide upon worthiness or fairness but if someone mentions this with immigration they're slammed as an idiot racist. 

I don't approve of our current immigration or refugee policy and believe it should be more open. The government makes it far too hard for people to apply, settle, and live here. Indeed, some of the judgements against those seeking asylum are pretty abominable. However, the people=people claim doesn't apply to any other realm of life. It necessarily ignores issues of communal change and access to resources that can become problematic in neglected areas and small towns. It also ignores the countries that have seen a massive brain drain, people can make more money in bad jobs than in respectable jobs in their home countries leading to a shortage in labour which is harming those countries that need to grow the most. 

Edited by Leeds Ram
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My wife works with a Ukrainian woman, who's relayed the following.

Her brother is fighting in the Ukrainian army as a conscript, according to her the Russians are leaving tempting bundles of supplies in surrounded areas, such as nappies, food, medicine and wound dressings.

While booby trapping such goodies with explosive devices, naturally.

Obviously I can't verify such claims, I'm just posting it here without comment.

 

 

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18 hours ago, Rev said:

My wife works with a Ukrainian woman, who's relayed the following.

Her brother is fighting in the Ukrainian army as a conscript, according to her the Russians are leaving tempting bundles of supplies in surrounded areas, such as nappies, food, medicine and wound dressings.

While booby trapping such goodies with explosive devices, naturally.

Obviously I can't verify such claims, I'm just posting it here without comment.

Judging by the appalling scenes from Bucha, witnessed after the Russians left, those claims seem disturbingly plausible. 

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The truth of it is that Boris Johnson literally could not do a walkabout in any city in the UK today - such is the feeling against him. Never mind stab vests, the point that needs considering is that the Prime Minister of this country is more free to walk the streets of a war zone than he is of the country he is supposed to be representing.

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