winktheram Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 6 hours ago, kevinhectoring said: The rules don’t encourage or discourage disputes between clubs They simply regulate whether those disputes are or are not subject to arbitration. As to whether the EFL itself encourages club to club disputes, there’s every reason to think it’s the last thing they would do How does this then sit with the rules 3.5 and 4.4. David has highlighted. Is it one or the other. Clubs can't claim against each other or yes they can through arbitration. I am struggling to understand the contradiction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 50 minutes ago, CornwallRam said: Is it just me that's slightly concerned about the non-Derby MPs showing an interest? I have a feeling that the EFL and football governance in general is on the 'hit list' for a lot of politicians. What better way to gain almost universal support for a complete overhaul than a big club failing completely? Especially when that big club isn't from London and doesn't have the international clout of the Manchesters or Liverpool. I am slightly worried that it would suit a lot of agendas if Derby County died. I don't think it would help the EFL - but they do want to make an example of us for trying to get around FFP and Mel daring to criticise them. I suspect that they want to be able to point to Derby County in League 2 to say look what happens if you step out of line. I actually think the success of the team in making survival a possibility is potentially counter productive and making the EFL find reasons to harden the punishments and add conditions to emerging from administration. If we meekly went down, accepted the business plan, embargo and points decuction for next season, then all the EFL and parasite club stuff would vanish. Andrew Brigden, NWLeics, lots of Derby fans in his constituency. He's been involved in all the stuff with local MPs. Dordogne-Ram, FlyBritishMidland, Zag zig and 6 others 6 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yani P Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 One of the things that gets me when trawling around other fan forums is this sense that somehow if we stay up this season we would have avoided punishment! I know we are dealing with some knuckle draggers that only want to see us finished, but it is a very strange view..they seem to ignore Administration, a 21 point penalty, a threadbare squad and endless embargo conditions. Dean (hick) Saunders, Crewton, Indyram and 7 others 9 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePrisoner Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 Just now, angieram said: Andrew Brigden, NWLeics, lots of Derby fans in his constituency. He's been involved in all the stuff with local MPs. Yep, I'm currently in NW Leics though I don't like to admit it! Considering how close of our larger towns are to the border, it's good anyone is being involved. David Graham Brown, FlyBritishMidland and Indyram 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 Just had a thought. For us to be liquidated the following would need to happen (I think) 1) a creditor lodge a wining up petition to the court 2) the court issue a winding up order, after considering the financial situation of the club Would a court issue a winding up order due to the presence of two so far unvalued claims for compensation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 4 minutes ago, davenportram said: Just had a thought. For us to be liquidated the following would need to happen (I think) 1) a creditor lodge a wining up petition to the court 2) the court issue a winding up order, after considering the financial situation of the club Would a court issue a winding up order due to the presence of two so far unvalued claims for compensation? Can you persue a winding up order against a company in Administration? Surely only the administrators can apply for one, once all avenues are exhausted? jimtastic56 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 4 minutes ago, davenportram said: Just had a thought. For us to be liquidated the following would need to happen (I think) 1) a creditor lodge a wining up petition to the court 2) the court issue a winding up order, after considering the financial situation of the club Would a court issue a winding up order due to the presence of two so far unvalued claims for compensation? Or we just run out of cash, can't pay player wages and EFL say hehehe, now we can have our revenge. jimtastic56 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 Can anyone see a resolution to this and if so what do you think it will be ?. I am beginning to have my doubts ?? jimtastic56 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crewton Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 15 minutes ago, Yani P said: One of the things that gets me when trawling around other fan forums is this sense that somehow if we stay up this season we would have avoided punishment! I know we are dealing with some knuckle draggers that only want to see us finished, but it is a very strange view..they seem to ignore Administration, a 21 point penalty, a threadbare squad and endless embargo conditions. Yes, I've noticed a few opinions on this basis on the Boro forums, commenting that the EFL sanctions aren't severe enough for what Derby have done. They are, of course, completely oblivious of the fact that the EFL rushed through additional, detailed embargo sanctions which (surprise, surprise) immediately applied to Derby, including the one that prevents the club from extending the contracts of academy/youth players to protect their value as an asset and which gives other clubs the opportunity to snap up a bargain at Derby's expense. Their bile-driven group-think doesn't even recognise that, in the year 2022, even a club in Administration can't force its players to sign for another club. You'd think Gibbo's gripe about Waghorn and Clarke would have taught them that at least?! Indy, David Graham Brown and jimtastic56 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 35 minutes ago, i-Ram said: Go on, I’ll bite. I will say yes. Wasn't really a fishing expedition. @Ghost of Cloughappears very knowledgeable on the finances and P&S, and I greatly respect his/her opinion on these matters. I certainly think it looks like we were treated leniently, however I have no idea what factors are taken into consideration. I guess the total overspend over the period of MMs reign was going to bite us on the arse at some point in time and does make me wonder if my protestations about our treatment have been misguided at times. i-Ram 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwram1973 Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 39 minutes ago, angieram said: Andrew Brigden, NWLeics, lots of Derby fans in his constituency. He's been involved in all the stuff with local MPs. I'm one of them ? angieram and RoyMac5 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1967RAMS Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 (edited) 37 minutes ago, davenportram said: Just had a thought. For us to be liquidated the following would need to happen (I think) 1) a creditor lodge a wining up petition to the court 2) the court issue a winding up order, after considering the financial situation of the club Would a court issue a winding up order due to the presence of two so far unvalued claims for compensation? Not the case. The admins will file to liquidate us if all avenues out of this mess are exhausted and we have no monetary means to keep operating. Normally a winding up order is issued by a creditor so that the assets can be sold and they can recoup some of the monies owed. In our instance, we have zero assets. The ground is owned by MM, the players can’t be sold as assets, their contracts will be cancelled and become free agents. Edited February 10, 2022 by 1967RAMS Add details jimtastic56 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 5 minutes ago, 1967RAMS said: Not the case. The admins will file to liquidate us if all avenues out of this mess are exhausted and we have no monetary means to keep operating Or the EFL take away our league membership because we can’t fulfil our fixtures, which would mean no takeover could happen. jimtastic56 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1967RAMS Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 5 minutes ago, curb said: Or the EFL take away our league membership because we can’t fulfil our fixtures, which would mean no takeover could happen. That won’t actually liquidate us although as we both know, in practice it will mean the start of the liquidation process ( unless premier league are willing to take us ?? ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 2 hours ago, rsmini said: Nice veiled threat there for the EFL David Graham Brown, r_wilcockson, The Scarlet Pimpernel and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IslandExile Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 It's all gone a bit quiet since Mel's statement, eh? That in, then? jimtastic56 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexxxxx Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 (edited) 46 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Wasn't really a fishing expedition. @Ghost of Cloughappears very knowledgeable on the finances and P&S, and I greatly respect his/her opinion on these matters. I certainly think it looks like we were treated leniently, however I have no idea what factors are taken into consideration. I guess the total overspend over the period of MMs reign was going to bite us on the arse at some point in time and does make me wonder if my protestations about our treatment have been misguided at times. The agreed decision was brokered on the understanding derby would withdraw their administration points deduction on the basis of covid. It must also have considered that the length of time it took to charge derby for the first year and how that impacted derbys activities in the subsequent years. Personally think they need to do away with the agreed decision. Too much space for inconsistent approaches. Edited February 10, 2022 by alexxxxx Indy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4ev6is Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 4 minutes ago, alexxxxx said: The agreed decision was brokered on the understanding derby would withdraw their administration points deduction on the basis of covid. It must also have considered that the length of time it took to charge derby for the first year and how that impacted derbys activities in the subsequent years. Personally think they need to do away with the agreed decision. Too much space for inconsistent approaches. It is not over mate not be a long shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 6 minutes ago, alexxxxx said: The agreed decision was brokered on the understanding derby would withdraw their administration points deduction on the basis of covid. It must also have considered that the length of time it took to charge derby for the first year and how that impacted derbys activities in the subsequent years. Personally think they need to do away with the agreed decision. Too much space for inconsistent approaches. Just seems another area where the EFL leave themselves open to attack for not applying their own rules. jimtastic56 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete Posted February 10, 2022 Share Posted February 10, 2022 59 minutes ago, 1967RAMS said: Not the case. The admins will file to liquidate us if all avenues out of this mess are exhausted and we have no monetary means to keep operating. Normally a winding up order is issued by a creditor so that the assets can be sold and they can recoup some of the monies owed. In our instance, we have zero assets. The ground is owned by MM, the players can’t be sold as assets, their contracts will be cancelled and become free agents. I think player registrations pass to the EFL who then try and sel them. Not sure. Anyway this is unthinkable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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