The Administration Thread

[B4ev6is]

9 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

There are many views and worries that have been quite rightly expressed on this thread but where do we actually stand as we move to the precipice, which will decide the future of the national and global institution that is Derby County Football Club?

Who is responsible for the peril that DCFC finds itself in? Everyone seems agreed that the blame lies at the door of Mel Morris and he alone. His actions have brought the club to the brink of liquidation. The owners of Middlesbrough and Wycombe seem to agree with that also.

In the last 30 years six English clubs were liquidated; Bury, Chester, Rushden & Diamonds, Macclesfield, Aldershot and Maidstone.

Many others avoided liquidation after entering administration in the past 40 years;  Bradford City (twice), Charlton, Middlesbrough, Tranmere, Newport, Walsall, Northampton, Hartlepool, Barnet, Exeter, Gillingham, Exeter, Millwall, Bournemouth (twice), Crystal Palace (twice), Portsmouth (three times), Hull, QPR, Halifax (twice), Bradford City, Notts County (twice), Barnsley, Leicester, Port Vale), ((three times), York, Ipswich, Wimbledon, Oldham, Darlington (twice), Wrexham, Cambridge, Rotherham (twice), Crawley, Boston, Leeds, Luton, Rotherham, Southampton, Stockport, Plymouth, Coventry, Aldershot, Bolton and Wigan.

What did all of these teams that exited administration have in common that allowed their survival and continued membership of the Football League? The answer is that they all had the full support of the other member clubs of the EFL, including Derby County. Those member clubs collectively recognised that the penalties imposed by the EFL were sufficient. There was no need for any of those clubs to seek a double jeopardy penalty by seeking extra compensation for their own perceived losses.

Why are we the only club that has ever been treated differently? Because the egomaniac that is Steve Gibson feels undermined by the egomaniac that is Mel Morris and also the previously unknown American owner of Wycombe wishes to get himself noticed and the EFL does not have a clue as how to resolve the dispute between its members internally, despite the fact that we seem to have the sympathy and support of the other 69 member clubs of the EFL.

Are the EFL really prepared to allow our club to go to the wall in this ridiculous situation of their own making? It is time they took a reality check and attempted to put their house in order. Parliament and the national media seems to be wholly against them. Does the EFL really want to fall on its own sword?

 

 

 

 

One last big push could be force to drop the matter I think they will have seen 10k Derby fans marching to pp and if rumours going around that we are going to do it again but this time at there head office.

[kevinhectoring]

8 hours ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

So is it the case that the admins could have done this process months ago or has it only slowly become clear that this is the only way forward?

Q assumed Gibbo would deal within sensible parameters. They misunderstood his motives, which are total annihilation of Mm’s footballing dream at maximum expense. Maximum expense to MM and to each Derby fan. He is a horrible little man 

[kevinhectoring]

8 hours ago, DCFC1388 said:

Needs to be if the outcome takes 14-18 days after. The hearing will need to be done by about the 8th to give us time for the outcome and a few days for the PB to be named

I think there also needs to be time for an appeal, no? I hope that is taken into account in the 14 - 18 days. If it is it’s impressive. 
 

This match against Boro (maybe over 2 legs?) makes the playoff final look like a pre season friendly. I’m convinced we will win and I don’t like to think what follows if we lose. That’s one for onechop 

[Van der MoodHoover]

36 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said:

Q assumed Gibbo would deal within sensible parameters. They misunderstood his motives, which are total annihilation of Mm’s footballing dream at maximum expense. Maximum expense to MM and to each Derby fan. He is a horrible little man 

So the latter then, which if correct should stop the vilification of quantuma. 

Although that awful open letter from MFC (Gibson) seems to be trying to spray shizzle in their direction as well. 

[PistoldPete]

1 minute ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

So the latter then, which if correct should stop the vilification of quantuma. 

Although that awful open letter from MFC (Gibson) seems to be trying to spray shizzle in their direction as well. 

Yes the stuff he was coming up with on the Boro fans forum was saying much the same.. saying Derby have been doing dodgy things even after Mel has left. .. presumably blaming quantuma for something .. like not paying him is £45 million or something. And claiming we were being sold on the cheap. He is deluded , and even the EFL has said the debts even without Boro and Wycombe are at the top end of the valuation of the club. So who is going to pay more now? 
 

and parry seems also to have been critical of quantuma in his email to one of our fans. Not sure what he thinks they’ve done wrong. 
 

to be honest I don’t see anymore that q could have done. There isn’t any money to pay bOro or Wycombe. If they don’t realise that and don’t go away then q will have to apply to the insolvency Court to squash the claims.

In the meantime we will continue to have a cash flow crisis so keep it up Rams fans try and fill the stadium again for next weekend home game.

[kevinhectoring]

8 hours ago, B4ev6is said:

One last big push could be force to drop the matter I think they will have seen 10k Derby fans marching to pp and if rumours going around that we are going to do it again but this time at there head office.

This prediction about settlement could be spot on. But we really want Rams fans to stay in Derby 

Edited January 31, 2022 by kevinhectoring

[BaaLocks]

First they came for Maidstone
And I did not speak out
Because I was not an Maidstone fan
Then they came for Newport
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Newport fan
Then they came for Bury
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Bury fan
Then they came for Derby
And they did not speak out
Because they were not Derby fans
Then they came for your club
And there was no one left
To speak out for you

All poetry, and stolen stanzas, aside the key point is not to make this about 'Derby vs EFL' or 'Derby vs Boro' or 'Fans vs Mel' and that is - without contradicting myself - where the EFL have completely missed the point here. This is about the governance of how football clubs are run, how the lure of the Premier League is completely irresistible to many and to how the polarization of the game is increasingly moving it away from being a community based sport to a franchise run system akin to what we see in NFL etc. British football is more than that and it should be our key point that this is not so much about saving one club - all that does is kick the can down the road - but more about saving the game for the communities that it exists within.

[RoyMac5]

57 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

...and parry seems also to have been critical of quantuma in his email to one of our fans. Not sure what he thinks they’ve done wrong. 
to be honest I don’t see anymore that q could have done. There isn’t any money to pay bOro or Wycombe. If they don’t realise that and don’t go away then q will have to apply to the insolvency Court to squash the claims.

In the meantime we will continue to have a cash flow crisis so keep it up Rams fans try and fill the stadium again for next weekend home game.

They could have sold more of our players on the cheap - made us really suffer! (Fingers crossed Wayne's been told the truth about no more players out)

The EFL and Boro/WW have deflected as much of the poo from themselves to others as they possibly could - Q perhaps weren't expecting such 'against statute' behaviour from the EFL, the governing body! Divides the anger of the fans.

[vonwright]

9 hours ago, Brailsford Ram said:

What did all of these teams that exited administration have in common that allowed their survival and continued membership of the Football League? The answer is that they all had the full support of the other member clubs of the EFL, including Derby County. Those member clubs collectively recognised that the penalties imposed by the EFL were sufficient. There was no need for any of those clubs to seek a double jeopardy penalty by seeking extra compensation for their own perceived losses.

This is a really important point. Clearly I blame Morris for us being in administration, and the scale of our (real) debts. But it's infuriating hearing the EFL trying to both legitimise and minimise the Boro and Wycombe claims ('They must be heard!' 'They might be football debts and payable in full!' 'You can't move forward until these are dealt with!' but also 'These claims aren't the real problem!')

Well the administrators, whose job it is to sell the club, think they are a problem. Would-be buyers clearly think they are a problem. And common sense says they would be a problem. Who spends £30m or £40m on a sticker business when you might be told you need to be tens of millions more somewhere down the line?

The EFL is also suggesting there's no deal with HMRC, and that's supposedly the administrators' fault. How can there be when we don't know if these claimants are creditors at all, or football creditors, or unsecured creditors, or how much they are supposedly due?

You'd think the EFL would be more worried about the precedent of clubs effectively suing each other for damages on top of the EFL's own agreed penalties for P and S breaches that happened years ago under owners who are no longer around. Is that where we want to be? 

As I've said before, i don't think this is a story with just one villain.

[RoyMac5]

Behind a paywall.

[DCFC1388]

2 hours ago, kevinhectoring said:

I think there also needs to be time for an appeal, no? I hope that is taken into account in the 14 - 18 days. If it is it’s impressive. 
 

This match against Boro (maybe over 2 legs?) makes the playoff final look like a pre season friendly. I’m convinced we will win and I don’t like to think what follows if we lose. That’s one for onechop 

I could be wrong but I dont think an appeal is allowed.

[winktheram]

12 hours ago, KBB said:

The next push on twitter and in the media needs to be to try and sell out every single home game for the rest of the season.

If we average every ticket price to just £10 as a  very low estimate, then 30,000 fans at £10 a pop is already £300k to the club plus any food and drink and judging the lines for half time there was a hungry and thirsty crowd.

The fans could yet play a key role in the short term.

Let's sell those tickets. Let's pack the ground and eat those pies.

Much love.

You need to take 19k season ticket money off that, already paid for and spent by the club mate. Your point is a good one though. Fill the stadium every game we can muddle through till the end of the season in admin. Which hopefully won't be the case anyway (admin wise) 

[Pikeyram]

Does anybody know who pays for the arbitration process?

Would like to think its all parties pay equally and the losers then take the final hit??

Knowing our luck we will be footing the bill....

[IslandExile]

1 minute ago, Pikeyram said:

Does anybody know who pays for the arbitration process?

Would like to think its all parties pay equally and the losers then take the final hit??

Knowing our luck we will be footing the bill....

I'll pay for it if it gets everything sorted out quicker.

How much will it be? How much???!!! OK, forget my last statement....I'm willing to wait a bit longer.

[Guest]

Encouraging article in the DET this morning about fans from right across the football family offering their support because they have seen the fight that the united front of our management, team and supporters is putting up to get us through our crisis.

In Middlesbrough, Wycombe and the corridors of the EFL we might be seen as the pariahs of English football but elsewhere we are seen for the moment by all decent football fans as everyone's second favourite team. Power To The People.

Come On You Rams, the battle is there to be won.

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/Derby-man-utd-leeds-villa-6574134

[Tamworthram]

10 minutes ago, winktheram said:

You need to take 19k season ticket money off that, already paid for and spent by the club mate. Your point is a good one though. Fill the stadium every game we can muddle through till the end of the season in admin. Which hopefully won't be the case anyway (admin wise) 

A valid point but have we really sold 19,000 season ticket? Still an amazing show of support and loyalty but I thought it was several thousand below that this season. 

[Ian Buxton's Bat]

Obviously we don't know exactly what is going on because of the paucity of decent information.

However, as a previous poster said, this is now probably about egos as much as anything.

Yesterday I spent around £120 on trains, food and drink for my family on top of the season ticket costs and I guess a lot of other people do the same. The amount spent in the local community per game on top of tickets must be huge. (25,000 spending £40 is a million)

Both Mel and Mr Steve Stephen-Stevie have got Queen's honours that could be removed, Mel's for 'services to business' and Steve's for 'services to the economy, sport and the community'. Surely deliberately taking actions that could result in a club being liquidated and catastrophically affecting a local economy and community undermines their legitimacy to hold those titles?

Perhaps Dame Margaret could suggest that they may perhaps lose their inferior honours if they don't see sense and find a way forward. Failing that then maybe a UK Govt petition would allow all MP's to consider it.

I know that threatening to take away someone's title seems petty but the previous poster may be onto something. Going away quietly with an OBE intact may be a choice an egotist would make.

[angieram]

23 minutes ago, winktheram said:

You need to take 19k season ticket money off that, already paid for and spent by the club mate. Your point is a good one though. Fill the stadium every game we can muddle through till the end of the season in admin. Which hopefully won't be the case anyway (admin wise) 

The season ticket money is ring-fenced and released as the games are played. It was in the financial statement of affairs. So every match played releases some of that money.

[StarterForTen]

15 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

In Middlesbrough, Wycombe and the corridors of the EFL we might be seen as the pariahs of English football but elsewhere we are seen for the moment by all decent football fans as everyone's second favourite team. Power To The People.

A terrorist in one person's eyes, is a freedom fighter in another's.

And the difference between either? Whoever wins gets to write the history!

[RadioactiveWaste]

6 minutes ago, StarterForTen said:

A terrorist in one person's eyes, is a freedom fighter in another's.

And the difference between either? Whoever wins gets to write the history!

A very good reason to not settle with Boro and Wycombe.

Let the arbitration go through its process.