RamsTrust

[RamsfanJim]

It has been suggested to me that I should use this forum to receive views on the Trust and things we can do better. Over the last 20 years I have seen plenty of negative comments about the Trust, but few constructive suggestions on how we can improve and gain more members.

We are the only recognised Supporters Trust for Derby County, so it is important that we are as representative as possible. We will never all agree, but we do seek to represent supporters the best we can.

I promise I will read all responses, but cannot guarantee always being able to respond as I already get 100s of messages / emails every day.

Jim Wheeler.

[WestLondonRam]

4 minutes ago, RamsfanJim said:

It has been suggested to me that I should use this forum to receive views on the Trust and things we can do better. Over the last 20 years I have seen plenty of negative comments about the Trust, but few constructive suggestions on how we can improve and gain more members.

We are the only recognised Supporters Trust for Derby County, so it is important that we are as representative as possible. We will never all agree, but we do seek to represent supporters the best we can.

I promise I will read all responses, but cannot guarantee always being able to respond as I already get 100s of messages / emails every day.

Jim Wheeler.

Hi Jim, 

I do think it's best you listen to all supporters as the handling with Mel Morris was poor. I'm sorry if that offends but I didn't agree with RAMS trust being the only opinion or supporters view which mattered. Derby is all of our football club not just RAMS trust and I believe you guys should of been on here before representing us. 

With that in the past and things moving forward, Maybe a MOD from here could be on the Rams Trust or we could have a section for questions which we feel needs to be relayed/ Answered. As the RAMS trust is the voice of the Fans. Should RAMS trust be the only recognised supporters trust as you have not been very active in the fan groups before the dreaded Silence of the Rams? Surely a representative from here, the West Stand, East Stand, North and South stands so there is a voice from a range of angles?

 

Kind regards 

[RamsfanJim]

1 minute ago, WestLondonRam said:

Hi Jim, 

I do think it's best you listen to all supporters as the handling with Mel Morris was poor. I'm sorry if that offends but I didn't agree with RAMS trust being the only opinion or supporters view which mattered. Derby is all of our football club not just RAMS trust and I believe you guys should of been on here before representing us. 

With that in the past and things moving forward, Maybe a MOD from here could be on the Rams Trust or we could have a section for questions which we feel needs to be relayed/ Answered. As the RAMS trust is the voice of the Fans. Should RAMS trust be the only recognised supporters trust as you have not been very active in the fan groups before the dreaded Silence of the Rams? Surely a representative from here, the West Stand, East Stand, North and South stands so there is a voice from a range of angles?

 

Kind regards 

Thanks for the response. 'Handling' Mel Morris was not possible - he ran the club and did not need to consult anyone. We always attended meetings to put forward fans views and concerns, but had no way to ensure he took any of that on board. We were not the only ones whose voice mattered - all supporters groups were represented equally in those meetings and had the same opportunity to (try to) influence the club. 

We have always received communication from supporters (via email, twitter, facebook etc. as well as our own mailing lists), and have read forums but intentionally avoided commenting as that is not what these forums should be for. 

Anyone is welcome to join and stand for the Trust Board, they are elected by members. We would welcome the opportunity to engage with a Mod if we can find a suitable format - although the same issue applies trying to represent a forum of widely disparate views. Someone will always complain.

We don't claim to be THE voice of the fans, we are A voice for the fans, and THE voice for our members (although even then there are differing views).

We have been active behind the scenes (meetings with the club, maintaining a media presence, contributing to campaigns with the FSA and in football reviews including meetings with MPs and parliamentary consultation), but it has been lower profile while the club appeared stable - and then a year of lockdown with no meetings. We have had to become more prominent in the past 6 months - for obvious reasons.

Jim.

[Sidd10]

5 minutes ago, WestLondonRam said:

Hi Jim, 

I do think it's best you listen to all supporters as the handling with Mel Morris was poor. I'm sorry if that offends but I didn't agree with RAMS trust being the only opinion or supporters view which mattered. Derby is all of our football club not just RAMS trust and I believe you guys should of been on here before representing us. 

With that in the past and things moving forward, Maybe a MOD from here could be on the Rams Trust or we could have a section for questions which we feel needs to be relayed/ Answered. As the RAMS trust is the voice of the Fans. Should RAMS trust be the only recognised supporters trust as you have not been very active in the fan groups before the dreaded Silence of the Rams? Surely a representative from here, the West Stand, East Stand, North and South stands so there is a voice from a range of angles?

 

Kind regards 

I agree with the above, I found it astounding you could issue statements on behalf of all Derby fans - whenever i read anything re. Morris coming from RamTrust I found myself thinking 'I don't think that'.

Or at least I wouldn't be putting it myself like that. I don't think that is exclusive to RT btw, i've seen a few things from this new B&WT group and think similar. I understand both groups (and others) are doing what they think is right for the club/fans. Just seems strange to decide you reflect all fans opinions and speak on behalf of all.

 

[sage]

19 minutes ago, WestLondonRam said:

Hi Jim, 

I do think it's best you listen to all supporters as the handling with Mel Morris was poor. I'm sorry if that offends but I didn't agree with RAMS trust being the only opinion or supporters view which mattered. Derby is all of our football club not just RAMS trust and I believe you guys should of been on here before representing us. 

With that in the past and things moving forward, Maybe a MOD from here could be on the Rams Trust or we could have a section for questions which we feel needs to be relayed/ Answered. As the RAMS trust is the voice of the Fans. Should RAMS trust be the only recognised supporters trust as you have not been very active in the fan groups before the dreaded Silence of the Rams? Surely a representative from here, the West Stand, East Stand, North and South stands so there is a voice from a range of angles?

 

Kind regards 

 

5 minutes ago, RamsfanJim said:

Thanks for the response. 'Handling' Mel Morris was not possible - he ran the club and did not need to consult anyone. We always attended meetings to put forward fans views and concerns, but had no way to ensure he took any of that on board. We were not the only ones whose voice mattered - all supporters groups were represented equally in those meetings and had the same opportunity to (try to) influence the club. 

We have always received communication from supporters (via email, twitter, facebook etc. as well as our own mailing lists), and have read forums but intentionally avoided commenting as that is not what these forums should be for. 

Anyone is welcome to join and stand for the Trust Board, they are elected by members. We would welcome the opportunity to engage with a Mod if we can find a suitable format - although the same issue applies trying to represent a forum of widely disparate views. Someone will always complain.

We don't claim to be THE voice of the fans, we are A voice for the fans, and THE voice for our members (although even then there are differing views).

We have been active behind the scenes (meetings with the club, maintaining a media presence, contributing to campaigns with the FSA and in football reviews including meetings with MPs and parliamentary consultation), but it has been lower profile while the club appeared stable - and then a year of lockdown with no meetings. We have had to become more prominent in the past 6 months - for obvious reasons.

Jim.

One of our MODs has recently joined the Rans Trust. I won't say who as it is up to them, not sure if they would want to be as as the 'DCFC Fans Rep' on RamsTrust. 

Even if we as posters may individually have doubts about/issues with RamsTrust, i hope we can engage with Jim and RT in terms of moving forward rather than settling scores. 

If people don't like the way RamsTrust is being run or that it doesn't represent them, they could try joining instead of mardying from the sidelines. That isn't aimed at anyone, just a general thought.   

[WestLondonRam]

There lays the problem Jim. 

You are a voice for your members, I have never seen an open Membership for the RAMS trust it seems a very closed door. A MOD from here can control the unruly members and sift the rubbish questions. I think through the media in that situation the RAMS trust voice seemed very distant from us the Fans and felt kind of alienating. I don't know the answer to that but I think most Fans felt we didn't know how bad things were with the club or even that we had a voice or a bunch of yes men... 

I'm sure it must be hard to be able to reach everyone but maybe a live stream from the meetings or at least knowing who we can ask when something like the NDA's happen again. 

I hope that nothing like this happens again but even for the purpose of the forum maybe to point us in the right direction to be able to read the notes or see the fielded questions and answers to the RAMS trust questions may help in future. I understand you was under NDA last meeting but previous and the next meetings being posted by RAMS trust to keep us informed?

Kind regards

[OoooMarkWright]

24 minutes ago, WestLondonRam said:

Hi Jim, 

I do think it's best you listen to all supporters as the handling with Mel Morris was poor. I'm sorry if that offends but I didn't agree with RAMS trust being the only opinion or supporters view which mattered. Derby is all of our football club not just RAMS trust and I believe you guys should of been on here before representing us. 

With that in the past and things moving forward, Maybe a MOD from here could be on the Rams Trust or we could have a section for questions which we feel needs to be relayed/ Answered. As the RAMS trust is the voice of the Fans. Should RAMS trust be the only recognised supporters trust as you have not been very active in the fan groups before the dreaded Silence of the Rams? Surely a representative from here, the West Stand, East Stand, North and South stands so there is a voice from a range of angles?

 

Kind regards 

I don’t think anyone handled the Morris situation well, including reps from this forum. It was a mess unfortunately, mostly caused by Morris and those at the club.

RamsTrust seem to be unfairly lambasted for putting things forward to the club and being wholly representative of all fans opinions. You’ll never get 30,000 plus all having the same view. The point that others have of ‘I don’t think that so why are they saying that to the club’ winds me up. 
I do think that RamsTrust should have a wider presence on social media and here. Showcasing the work that they are doing so there presence is larger. Many don’t have a clue what they do, me included. The 1884 group, Rams Protest Group etc all were more active. Considering this forum is viewed by many, things like this are a good start. 

[Ram-Alf]

How much influence do Rams Trust have/hope to have, Under MM very little to non, New owners could be in situ within a couple of months, They'll have their own board of directors, CEO, Secretary, Chairman/Woman ect ect, What is Rams Trust here for, How many members are there in Rams Trust, What have you been doing for the last 5/6 years, DCFC have been put into Admin where were you, Rams Trust come along every now and then with a brief letter/comment through our pretty poor local newspaper the DET.

One of your Senior members tweeted a comment about the colour of Italians...how does that sit with yourself.

 

[BaaLocks]

Anyone can join Ramstrust, anyone can stand for any position in Ramstrust - it is anything but a closed shop. And I kind of agree with @sage on this one, it sometimes feels like fans expect to be asked to approve everything they do but it seems there are very few who actually want to do the work needed to write up the statements, engage with the club and fans. If you don't like how Ramstrust, or any other supporter body, operates then join and help it be what you want it to be. If you don't, you've kind of snookered yourself. But the point remains, even if many don't feel it is the case, RT never can claim to be more than the voice of their members. And I don't think the club or anyone who takes a moment to think about it could see it any other way.

[WestLondonRam]

2 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

Anyone can join Ramstrust, anyone can stand for any position in Ramstrust - it is anything but a closed shop. And I kind of agree with @sage on this one, it sometimes feels like fans expect to be asked to approve everything they do but it seems there are very few who actually want to do the work needed to write up the statements, engage with the club and fans. If you don't like how Ramstrust, or any other supporter body, operates then join and help it be what you want it to be. If you don't, you've kind of snookered yourself. But the point remains, even if many don't feel it is the case, RT never can claim to be more than the voice of their members. And I don't think the club or anyone who takes a moment to think about it could see it any other way.

sorry I disagree. 

As Unlucky Alf says where have RT been for 5/6 years? We didn't ask them to field questions but maybe point us in the correct direction instead of saying anyone can Join Ramstrust. I don't expect anyone to speak for me and I am more than capable of putting my point across if need be but where? 

I don't think anyone can say they haven't represented it's Members it just doesn't represent the supporters as a whole from what I saw. Perhaps taking a member from all fan groups, I.e. Here, 1884, protest group, stands representative will help to reach the wider audience and represent more fans as a whole. 

To be fair to Jim in roads look to be already taking shape by having our Mods on there. The other thing I would like to see is a Live stream or written stream of notes from the meetings, If that already happens can you point out where we can find them? 

[angieram]

46 minutes ago, RamsfanJim said:

It has been suggested to me that I should use this forum to receive views on the Trust and things we can do better. Over the last 20 years I have seen plenty of negative comments about the Trust, but few constructive suggestions on how we can improve and gain more members.

We are the only recognised Supporters Trust for Derby County, so it is important that we are as representative as possible. We will never all agree, but we do seek to represent supporters the best we can.

I promise I will read all responses, but cannot guarantee always being able to respond as I already get 100s of messages / emails every day.

Jim Wheeler.

Hello Jim, I am the Moderator that is being referred to in the thread. There are also a few DCFC fans members who have joined recently and who may wish to say who they are - or not!

I have been posting your public updates on a thread, as well as the link showing how to join,  @WestLondonRam so not sure how you missed that. It was very simple to join, sets you back the princely sum of £2.

I asked @David if I could post Rams Trust updates and he warned me at the time I would get some flack for it. He was right! 

It's early days for me, but I will repeat what I said in the other thread,  that I have found Rams Trust welcoming, and far from being a closed shop, is actively encouraging more fans to get involved. 

I think people get a bit too concerned about Rams Trust being the only official supporters Trust. That is a fact, it has a constitution,  it is registered with the Football Supporters Association, it has clear aims and objectives. For this reason it is understandable that they are often approached through official channels. However, Derby County themselves have always recognised that there are a number of ways that supporters views need to be heard and their Suppirters Charter recognises this and includes a range of representatives, both official groups and a few key individuals. 

[WestLondonRam]

5 minutes ago, angieram said:

Hello Jim, I am the Moderator that is being referred to in the thread. There are also a few DCFC fans members who have joined recently and who may wish to say who they are - or not!

I have been posting your public updates on a thread, as well as the link showing how to join,  @WestLondonRam so not sure how you missed that. It was very simple to join, sets you back the princely sum of £2.

I asked @David if I could post Rams Trust updates and he warned me at the time I would get some flack for it. He was right! 

It's early days for me, but I will repeat what I said in the other thread,  that I have found Rams Trust welcoming, and far from being a closed shop, is actively encouraging more fans to get involved. 

I think people get a bit too concerned about Rams Trust being the only official supporters Trust. That is a fact, it has a constitution,  it is registered with the Football Supporters Association, it has clear aims and objectives. For this reason it is understandable that they are often approached through official channels. However, Derby County themselves have always recognised that there are a number of ways that supporters views need to be heard and their Suppirters Charter recognises this and includes a range of representatives, both official groups and a few key individuals. 

Must of missed it Angie? 

But Glad it's you doing it and I would be happy to part with £2 pound to help Derby supporters groups. As you know when all this first happened I said my piece and have not got involved anymore as felt I have got it off my chest. Now this has been brought into the light then I have cleared my chest again. 

[Rammeister]

Disappointed.

I thought the ‘RamsTrust’ headline meant we were now on the 30th day and you were going to reveal, that you’d all managed to cobble together £50 million or so and were putting an offer in for the club on behalf of us fans.

What have you all been doing these past few weeks, if not that?

[Mostyn6]

Hi Jim, I find it hard to be constructive regarding the Rams Trust, as simply it feels like a secret society. I don’t know what RT does, I don’t know RT’s objectives/purposes (if any) . It’s fair to say that over the internet period, I’ve been all over all forums, message boards and groups, but still know nothing about Ramstrust. 
 

However, I did feel slightly narked at RT speaking on behalf of 50000 ppl who know nothing about Ramstrust. I don’t know who appointed Ramstrust as the only legitimate supporters trust, and the only one I recognise is Punjabi Rams. 
 

Perhaps you should think on that. 

[Ellafella]

1 hour ago, RamsfanJim said:

It has been suggested to me that I should use this forum to receive views on the Trust and things we can do better. Over the last 20 years I have seen plenty of negative comments about the Trust, but few constructive suggestions on how we can improve and gain more members.

We are the only recognised Supporters Trust for Derby County, so it is important that we are as representative as possible. We will never all agree, but we do seek to represent supporters the best we can.

I promise I will read all responses, but cannot guarantee always being able to respond as I already get 100s of messages / emails every day.

Jim Wheeler.

@RamsfanJim: do you have an e-mail address or can I discuss something with you via dm on this board?

[WestLondonRam]

1 minute ago, Ellafella said:

@RamsfanJim: do you have an e-mail address or can I discuss something with you via dm on this board?

Ella he's not a doctor mate ?

[Yani P]

I think the biggest issue with RT is it seems to have been around forever but has achieved what exactly? Certainly not its objective of getting a seat at the table that's for sure..look at some of the names on their 'Board'..they are the same names that have been there since Day 1 superglued to their seats..

As soon as they had the option to explore potential fan ownership they swiftly put out a statement to say they couldn't do it..did they consult Derby fans? Did they reach out to potential investors? 

It just feels that they have zero ambition apart from  wanting to be the official Trust..

[CBRammette]

35 minutes ago, angieram said:

Hello Jim, I am the Moderator that is being referred to in the thread. There are also a few DCFC fans members who have joined recently and who may wish to say who they are - or not!

I have been posting your public updates on a thread, as well as the link showing how to join,  @WestLondonRam so not sure how you missed that. It was very simple to join, sets you back the princely sum of £2.

I asked @David if I could post Rams Trust updates and he warned me at the time I would get some flack for it. He was right! 

It's early days for me, but I will repeat what I said in the other thread,  that I have found Rams Trust welcoming, and far from being a closed shop, is actively encouraging more fans to get involved. 

I think people get a bit too concerned about Rams Trust being the only official supporters Trust. That is a fact, it has a constitution,  it is registered with the Football Supporters Association, it has clear aims and objectives. For this reason it is understandable that they are often approached through official channels. However, Derby County themselves have always recognised that there are a number of ways that supporters views need to be heard and their Suppirters Charter recognises this and includes a range of representatives, both official groups and a few key individuals. 

Thanks Angie. I joined RamsTrust too. Couldnt have been easier and at £2 less than a coffee. It is shown easily on their website how to join and you did indeed provide details. Generally in any not for profit body where people volunteer for roles they always get loads of stick and people moaning but others never stand up to be counted or offer themselves for roles. I bet Jim is really pleased he reached out on here to communicate with forum members!!

[WestLondonRam]

1 minute ago, CBRammette said:

Thanks Angie. I joined RamsTrust too. Couldnt have been easier and at £2 less than a coffee. It is shown easily on their website how to join and you did indeed provide details. Generally in any not for profit body where people volunteer for roles they always get loads of stick and people moaning but others never stand up to be counted or offer themselves for roles. I bet Jim is really pleased he reached out on here to communicate with forum members!!

He asked a question we gave the answer. What do you want us to do? 

[OoooMarkWright]

8 minutes ago, Yani P said:

I think the biggest issue with RT is it seems to have been around forever but has achieved what exactly? Certainly not its objective of getting a seat at the table that's for sure..look at some of the names on their 'Board'..they are the same names that have been there since Day 1 superglued to their seats..

As soon as they had the option to explore potential fan ownership they swiftly put out a statement to say they couldn't do it..did they consult Derby fans? Did they reach out to potential investors? 

It just feels that they have zero ambition apart from  wanting to be the official Trust..

Is it realistic to expect them to be a board member? Also, is that there objective? I’m not sure it is. I, and others were in agreement that RamsTrust should move on quickly in regards to discussing being a board member so the administration process moved on more swiftly. They can’t win with some fans.