Boro Sack Wilder

[DerbyRam!]

Guys guys, you're worrying me.

 

Dont forget if Middlesbrough fail to get into the top 6 this season, they will sue us, as it's our fault...nothing to do with poor results 

[Boycie]

52 minutes ago, DerbyRam! said:

Guys guys, you're worrying me.

 

Dont forget if Middlesbrough fail to get into the top 6 this season, they will sue us, as it's our fault...nothing to do with poor results 

Mel Morris got a gypsy to put a curse on the payment he sent Gibbon.

[angieram]

Middlesbrough's accounts are out, Gibson pouring money into the club, as per.

If you follow the thread right down to the bottom, Maguire is speculating they received £2.7 million from Mel Morris. That was an amount after year end, of course. 

Oh, and they owe the taxman, too! 

 

[angieram]

An additional thought on all this, Middlesbrough are surely in the same position as us here, because if Steve Gibson ever decides to walk away, they are just as insolvent as we were? 

[Loughborough Ram]

On a slightly separate point, Chris Wilder was at our game on Saturday with Chris(?) Morgan, the centre half who played for Sheff Utd a few years back. I passed them outside the main entrance.

[vonwright]

1 hour ago, angieram said:

An additional thought on all this, Middlesbrough are surely in the same position as us here, because if Steve Gibson ever decides to walk away, they are just as insolvent as we were? 

Yeah it all feels a bit familiar. I wonder if a potential buyer might see their "external" debts as a bit more manageable (ie their HMRC bill is a fair bit lower). But any sale would require Gibson to write off a nine-figure sum (just like Morris) and the underlying economics seem to be that building a decent-but-not-promotion-worthy Championship team means losing £20m a year.

[ariotofmyown]

2 hours ago, angieram said:

If you follow the thread right down to the bottom, Maguire is speculating they received £2.7 million from Mel Morris. That was an amount after year end, of course. 

Is this a future way of getting round FFP? A private individual has given money to a football club based on pretty much nothing.

Say Clowes had a very rich mate. His mate could give Derby 100 million. Because if his mate had given this money to team x previously, then they could have beaten team y, who finished 1 point above us in the playoffs, meaning we would have gone up!

Derby weren't told to pay this money to Boro by any authority. A private citizen was basically blackmailed into paying it.

Edited December 6, 2022 by ariotofmyown

[TigerTedd]

5 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

Is this a future way of getting round FFP? A private individual has given money to a football club based on pretty much nothing.

Say Clowes had a very rich mate. His mate could give Derby 100 million. Because if his mate had given this money to team x previously, then they could have beaten team y, who finished 1 point above us in the playoffs, meaning we would have gone up!

Derby weren't told to pay this money to Boro by any authority. A private citizen was basically blackmailed into paying it.

That’s a fair point. Should it really be part of their accounts? Or a private payment to Gibson?

[Tamworthram]

3 hours ago, angieram said:

Middlesbrough's accounts are out, Gibson pouring money into the club, as per.

If you follow the thread right down to the bottom, Maguire is speculating they received £2.7 million from Mel Morris. That was an amount after year end, of course. 

Oh, and they owe the taxman, too! 

 

To be fair, there is a massive difference between having taxation as a liability in your accounts (hardly uncommon) and exiting administration without paying all of your tax bill. 

[Crewton]

Should they be spending £10M on new players when they effectively owe HMRC £8M and the EFL £6M (which I assume is a Covid loan to pay admin costs including taxes)?

[Ram-Alf]

1 hour ago, TigerTedd said:

That’s a fair point. Should it really be part of their accounts? Or a private payment to Gibson?

Spoke to my Daughter concerning this...she works for HMRC and maybe CBRammette can qualify this.

The £2.7m is in the accounts but not in this years accounts for tax, They have gone down as "notes" as it looks like it was to late a payment to go in this years accounts, so in essense the £2.7m will show in next years accounts and if Boro are sold the new owner knows there's £2.7m to go to the new owners company.

Yes it should be in their accounts as it was Boro(though Gibson)that was taking DCFC to court and ended by a private payment by a 3rd party.

[ariotofmyown]

2 hours ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Spoke to my Daughter concerning this...she works for HMRC and maybe CBRammette can qualify this.

The £2.7m is in the accounts but not in this years accounts for tax, They have gone down as "notes" as it looks like it was to late a payment to go in this years accounts, so in essense the £2.7m will show in next years accounts and if Boro are sold the new owner knows there's £2.7m to go to the new owners company.

Yes it should be in their accounts as it was Boro(though Gibson)that was taking DCFC to court and ended by a private payment by a 3rd party.

My stupid scenario still stands though. Derby could threaten to take Clowes' rich friend to court, but he settles with a 100m payment. Nice way of getting round FFP potentially?

[Ramarena]

5 hours ago, Loughborough Ram said:

On a slightly separate point, Chris Wilder was at our game on Saturday with Chris(?) Morgan, the centre half who played for Sheff Utd a few years back. I passed them outside the main entrance.

I believe Morgan is an agent now, he was coaching but gave it up after getting leaving Port Vale.

[Ramarena]

6 hours ago, angieram said:

An additional thought on all this, Middlesbrough are surely in the same position as us here, because if Steve Gibson ever decides to walk away, they are just as insolvent as we were? 

Clearly you are mistaken Angie. They are divine and beyond reproach!

[Foreveram]

1 hour ago, ariotofmyown said:

My stupid scenario still stands though. Derby could threaten to take Clowes' rich friend to court, but he settles with a 100m payment. Nice way of getting round FFP potentially?

I think “ getting round FPP” was where our troubles began.

[Reggie Greenwood]

2 hours ago, Foreveram said:

I think “ getting round FPP” was where our troubles began.

I’m pretty sure all clubs are “getting round FFP” in one way or another Boro being a prime example 

[i-Ram]

6 hours ago, Crewton said:

Should they be spending £10M on new players when they effectively owe HMRC £8M and the EFL £6M (which I assume is a Covid loan to pay admin costs including taxes)?

Yes, if they pay HMRC and the EFL the monies when they fall due.

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

Paid them pretty much what you get for a playoff including a final then.  Or Morris did.    

[Carl Sagan]

It makes me sick. I hope lots of very bad things happen to Steve Gibson because he would deserve all of that. Never forget, never forgive. He prevented us having any hope of staying in the Championship and tried to drive us out of existence.

[G STAR RAM]

Wrote to the EFL recently and asked, in the interest of transparency, if they would publish the P&S results for all EFL clubs.

Request denied. 

Followed this up with a request for details of all Covid related exemptions and allowances used by all EFL clubs in arriving at their P&S results.

Request denied.