Matchday Thread - Fleetwood Town v Derby County (20/08 15:00)

[Carl Sagan]

4 hours ago, chadlad said:

Having watched the highlights it looks like we had a lot of half chances to score but nothing really clear cut. Even the Knight header was quite a difficult opportunity.

The best chance was McGoldrick’s near the end from a few yards out which he really should have buried.

 

2 hours ago, Ellafella said:

It’s not the quality of the shooter; more about the quality of the scoring opportunity. We are getting shots in but they are not very obvious chances ie we aren’t obtaining control in the opposing third. 

Agree with both of these. When you watch the highlights across the division other teams are making obvious scoring opportunities (and scoring) whereas we're making half chances (and not). Clearly this performance was better than and much more forward-thinking than Shrewsbury (though Fleetwood are probably a worse team). So that's a positive. Yet again, Sibley appears our most forward-thinking, dangerous, creative player using his skill and football brain to try to unpick a packed defence, yet LR only uses him for a few minutes each match. And it's much harder to impact a game coming on than playing from the beginning.

[RoyMac5]

2 minutes ago, S8TY said:

...Some ( not you ) are reacting like we have made a poor start....lets look again after 10 games and see how we are doing as I have faith that our play and dominance will result in more wins than losses 

Can we not comment until 10 games in then?

Or can we re-assess after 10 games?

[angieram]

29 minutes ago, S8TY said:

good points but are you saying that this "mould" as you call it will continue for the season??

because of a couple of games where we've missed chances?

We are creating and dominating and the goals will come 100% that is for sure

The time to worry is when we are not dominating and creating...judging by the reactions to our start to the season I can only imagine the massive meltdown by some on here if we dont dominate and create , if we'd been outplayed and somehow scraped  a 1-0 would fans be happy ? because that wouldn't be sustainable ...dominating possesion and creating chances as City show brings rewards so a bit of patience and we'll be fine 

Some ( not you ) are reacting like we have made a poor start....lets look again after 10 games and see how we are doing as I have faith that our play and dominance will result in more wins than losses 

No, but we are starting to snatch at chances - never a good sign. There's a fair amount of vocals from some of our fans in attendance already. 

[Ramarena]

I can understand some of the concern, we’ve created a lot of chances in the last two games and scored none of them.

On the other hand it’s somewhat understandable…….. confidence for the attacking players who stayed with us must be absolutely shot after two years of struggle on and off the pitch.

Factor in the new attacking players who came to us on free’s because their former clubs didn’t want them due to different struggles (look at their records in the last two seasons……especially Collins) and it’s clear that confidence will be a major issue that LR has to rebuild.

From what I can see, the only attackers that look to believe in themselves when shooting are NML and Sibley. Both need to start the next game and hope their belief runs off on the others and confidence grows.

The good news is we’ve created a good number of chances and the trend is more chances being created…….not less, so the chance creation side of things is being addressed.

Hopefully it’s the piecing together of a jigsaw and the final piece is the confidence for attackers!

[S8TY]

10 minutes ago, angieram said:

No, but we are starting to snatch at chances - never a good sign. There's a fair amount of vocals from some of our fans in attendance already. 

I do know ....but as i've said we are creating and dominating its a long season we'll be up there for sure

[S8TY]

39 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Can we not comment until 10 games in then?

Or can we re-assess after 10 games?

yes we are all free to comment but some are extreme...calling for a change of manager !!

We are all frustrated at not taking our chances but not creating them or dominating games would be far more concerning

[Crewton]

43 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

Yet again, Sibley appears our most forward-thinking, dangerous, creative player using his skill and football brain to try to unpick a packed defence, yet LR only uses him for a few minutes each match. And it's much harder to impact a game coming on than playing from the beginning.

He's had an hour each game v Mansfield and Barnsley, and a half-hour plus stoppage time in each of the other games, so it's not "a few minutes each match". I'd also take issue with your last statement there, because I think he's had a bigger impact in his sub appearances than when he's started (though I don't think he's played badly in those games either) BUT he hasn't scored in 4 hours of football either. So there isn't allot of evidence that your opinion is more valid than Rosenior's right now. He's contributing well off the bench in particular, but he has the same problem as the rest of the team - converting chances and half-chances that come his way.

BTW - if his 'football brain' was as refined as you seem to be suggesting, he'd be spending more time annoying the opposition and less time being annoyed by them and reacting to provocations.

Edited August 21, 2022 by Crewton

[angieram]

Just a small point about yesterday. Their flag bearers marched their flag across the home end accompanied by flares, which they held aloft.

How does that reconcile with stadium bans on flares? 

[S8TY]

44 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Can we not comment until 10 games in then?

Or can we re-assess after 10 games?

I thought we were poor and very underwhelming in first 10 games under Jim Smith and fans made it known then , we were not playing teams off the park like we have done this season away from home ( except for Charlton second half which i thought was poor ) but over analysing it sometimes can cause more problems ...Hourihanes comments say it all really, the team know we are not taking our chances but we will and when we score first other teams will open up more to get back into the game and thats where we'll end up winning by 2 or 3 

[Tyler Durden]

57 minutes ago, S8TY said:

Some ( not you ) are reacting like we have made a poor start....lets look again after 10 games and see how we are doing as I have faith that our play and dominance will result in more wins than losses 

Does that mean no one is allowed to comment on games unless the post reads like a hagiography of LR and his team selection and match tactics?

Apart from one or two extreme views which I'm excluding from this then the status quo seems to be as long as we take into account the war in Ukraine global warming and the rail strikes then after that any perceived form of even minor criticism against the manager is totally unacceptable.

[S8TY]

1 minute ago, Tyler Durden said:

Does that mean no one is allowed to comment on games unless the post reads like a hagiography of LR and his team selection and match tactics?

Apart from one or two extreme views which I'm excluding from this then the status quo seems to be as long as we take into account the war in Ukraine global warming and the rail strikes then after that any perceived form of even minor criticism against the manager is totally unacceptable.

yaaaaaawn

[Tyler Durden]

1 minute ago, S8TY said:

yaaaaaawn

Was asking a genuine question as the last couple of weeks has just reinforced this but happy to stand corrected ?

[S8TY]

2 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

Does that mean no one is allowed to comment on games unless the post reads like a hagiography of LR and his team selection and match tactics?

Apart from one or two extreme views which I'm excluding from this then the status quo seems to be as long as we take into account the war in Ukraine global warming and the rail strikes then after that any perceived form of even minor criticism against the manager is totally unacceptable.

So tell me what would you want done exactly ? is it tactics that is causing us to have 27 shots or not ? we haven't taken those chances but we will we are only a few games into a new season with a new squad and I'm pleased with how cohesive we look after just a few games together and very little pre season 

[Tyler Durden]

14 minutes ago, S8TY said:

So tell me what would you want done exactly ? is it tactics that is causing us to have 27 shots or not ? we haven't taken those chances but we will we are only a few games into a new season with a new squad and I'm pleased with how cohesive we look after just a few games together and very little pre season 

I don't know that's the point.

But to not even be able to have the temerity to even comment or god forbid mildly question the games played so far is a hanging offence which was my point.

Not directed at you btw. 

Anyway going to back to my book by Pol Pot on Freedom of Speech in Democracies. 

 

[Jourdan]

One thing I can’t understand is this idea that we should simply be happy and grateful that we have a team to support.

It’s a nice sentiment but it felt like that went out of the window the day we announced the signings of Hourihane, Chester and McGoldrick in the space of 45 minutes.

Such signings were only ever going to build expectation and increase the desire to see a winning team and of course, any sense of the club slowly mending itself seemed to disappear.

I don’t blame anyone for being frustrated. It’s instinctive when you don’t win a game of football and especially so when the opposition are so overmatched and especially when you see teams of a similar ilk faring much better.

Rosenior is not a unique case. Any manager would be in the same position. We are a big fish in the league and there is a level of expectation that comes with that. This will have been the same for Sunderland, Leeds, Forest, Southampton and all the teams that came before us.

It’s going to be hard for Rosenior to keep pace and not because of entitlement. As Derby fans, we are grounded and we have seen enough over the years to know that nothing is a given.

It’s the sheer disparity between us and the majority of clubs at this level. We have infrastructure, resources and stature that some of these clubs can only dream of. It’s not arrogance, it’s factual. 

There is always going to be a level of disappointment and questions to be asked if you can’t make that count, and so far we haven’t done that.

Two wins v Peterborough and Plymouth and the doubts will be washed away.

[Steve How Hard?]

37 minutes ago, angieram said:

Just a small point about yesterday. Their flag bearers marched their flag across the home end accompanied by flares, which they held aloft.

How does that reconcile with stadium bans on flares? 

Yep good point. Not a nice experience being trapped under that flag inhaling the fumes from the flare. Surely a fire hazard too, although I am aware the flags should be fire retardant anyway. Should being the operative word. 

[ram59]

I think that the Fleetwood manager should nip back up to Scotland for the Edinburgh Fringe, his post match comments were hilarious. He thought that a draw was probably the right result! Every statistic and every highlights show, including Fleetwood's own on youtube, shows the match to be just about the most one sided nil nil ever.?

[ollycutts1982]

Not concerned one bit. The goals and therefore wins will come. I agree with what has been said that we seem abit laboured in our play. LR yesterday was screaming for the ball to be switched many a time and each time it never was or by the time it did the space had gone. We need to take risks at times to get us up the pitch quicker. Usual problem these past few years that we seem scared to play forward incase we lose the ball. Many of these teams will sit and happily watch us play round at the back. We could quite easily have won all 3 away games and there wouldn’t be an issue.
 

One frustrating thing yesterday was at the final whistle a few “fans” shouting abuse at LR. Utter stupidity. I thought we’d lost these morons last season. ??. Very short memories some folk. 

[LeedsCityRam]

2 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

I think this is the thing. League 1 is grim (imho) and I want the Club back in the Championship asap, others might think differently. I don't agree with your 'a process of gradual improvement' at all though.

So, yes we are doing well, but we really should be doing much better - that has nothing to do with where we have recently come from. Do I think LR is the manager to do it, dunno. But I now think that if we don't go up this season it will be a failure. Again I'm sure others think differently.

I suspect many will share your ultimate ambition for the season, even if I believe its a likely 2 year project. Its all too easy to remember how hollowed out the club has been...playing & coaching staff and not just the first team. Irrespective of expectations though, couldn't begrudge people making calls on Rosenior towards the back end of the season when we will have a better idea of likely finishing place.

With respect to 'gradual improvement', that refers as much to the inevitable improvement in executing our style as the results. We have a new manager who in turn is a managerial novice with a mostly new squad, getting them to play in a particular way (i.e. not just results driven). Stands to reason that will take time & we will get progressively better at it as season goes on.

[plymouthram]

16 hours ago, Ellafella said:

Really can’t wait.

Im just looking at the early shread of evidence and with a statistician’s nose pointing out how it’s looking. “When we gel, fitness etc” is just opinion & conjecture. My hypothesis uses the accumulated evidence. 

Accumulated evidence (after 6 games, 3 won, 2 drawn and one loss). Take the cup game out of the equation and if we stay on that form over the 46 games we will finish on approx 74 points which on last season's League one table would put us in 8th place. But take the 2 draws (we were the far better side in both and they could have been wins). The defeat at Charlton also could have been a win or at least a draw. Of course it's an opinion that the team will get fitter, gel better and find the goal scoring touch. It could be another persons opinion that we could get worse (but I, along with many others doubt that).