A refereeing conspiracy?

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

Doubt there is a conspiracy but that was 100 per cent a foul on Davies for the goal. Refereeing mistake. But Derby should have been more clinical so not going to blame the referee for that defeat. 

[Sheff Ram]

We often comfort ourselves in the moment with the old "oh, it will even out over the season" adage. I guess some seasons it doesn't and this season we have had more poor decisions against us rather than in our favour. Look at the (potential) sendings off for and against us as a case in point. Sometimes it's fine margins and we pore over certain incidents. Reffing certainly is a tough job but that doesn't stop us, and nor should, it expecting refs to try and do a good job.  Refs also need to be made more accountable and poor decision-making/performance needs to be able to be challenged, as in most walks of life. Is there a conspiracy by refs? Think it is mainly poor decisions rather than anything more sinister to be honest, although there may be the odd ref with prejudices. As for the EFL, that's a different matter...

Edited March 2, 2022 by Sheff Ram

[Asanovic70]

9 hours ago, IslandExile said:

It works far better in other sports - cricket, tennis, rugby - where there are natural breaks in play.

I agree with your comment about incompetence, I do think we exaggerate the flow of a football game though, there are plenty of stoppages, sometimes the ball is only in play for 20+ minutes in a half. 

Rooney's outburst: I am not going to judge him, he is perhaps cutting an increasingly desperate & forlorn figure. He reminds me of Clough during the long, awful spells, like '10-'11 (winter). He is obviously human & lets his emotions get the better of him, as can happen to all of us.

I thought Steve Morison was magnanimous. He could afford to be after a late win. He praised the way we played. Unfortunately, we lack a cutting edge, the lack of depth, quality & experience are now all too evident. The January window really damaged us. It is reminiscent of 2008/11pts. A squad on its knees, desperate for assistance & the in-coming players didn't make much of an impact, due to our position in attracting players & lack of finances. New signings can boost a team, offer alternatives (tactics) & allow other players to rest/recover from injuries instead of rushing them back. Instead, we lost some vital experience in Jagielka & Shinnie.

[JfR]

28 minutes ago, Jubbs said:

Same ref as last night. 

He also did the game vs Boro at home this season, misses obvious Uche elbow red card.

Refereed the game in EFL cup vs Preston last season where he gave Preston a penalty for heading the ball.

Genuinely wouldn't be surprised if he has an agenda against us, after he was touched by Lowe

Also let this one go against Leeds in the Lampard season
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11688/11604861/watch-should-leeds-goalkeeper-bailey-peacock-farrell-have-seen-red

[Brammie Steve]

Confuscious he say:-

Never worry that you have a persecution complex….

They may REALLY be out to get you!!

[EnigmaRam]

I think the fact that all but one game I’ve been to or watched this season the crowd have sung “Duck the EFL, you don’t know what you’re doing or Your not fit to referee” due to poor referee decisions says it all. 
 

Whether it’s a bias against us or not I can’t really say, but you have to look at how many penalties we haven’t got that were stone wall, decisions such as Grabbans 3 foot off the ground studs showing foul that gets a yellow against Morrisons getting the ball first and going over it at a foot off the ground getting a red card and it makes you wonder. Bird gets scissored and studded yet it’s a yellow, Stearmans nowhere near as bad and gets red on 3 mins. 
 

There’s only one match this season I’ve thought the red did well and my son agreed and I think it was against Hull. Geoff Eltringham.

[Gaspode]

This is the EFL we're talking about - the level of organisation required to arrange a conspiracy with the refs is way beyond their abilities.....

[LazloW]

No conspiracy, they’re just crap and wildly inconsistent. The decision last night cost us a point. That point might be the difference between staying up and going down. Probably won’t as I think the gap is too big to bridge, but that isn’t the point. 

There have been worst decisions than that for all teams, but these decisions mean something and it is pathetic that there is no way of double checking whether a decision is correct (even though VAR is often equally crap), no way to question or query a decision, no means of getting a ref to explain themselves and no way for an error to be put right. All of these things lead to frustration, frustration leads to anger and anger leads to both fans and managers having a probably irrational rant about conspiracies. I don’t blame Wayne in the slightest for saying what he said.

[nottingram]

I think the referees are just incompetent. Perhaps there is some element of Derby cheating in the back of their mind but I would doubt it really has much of an effect.

I think we all have some level of confirmation bias and only remember the decisions that go against us, but it does feel like for the last two seasons at least there has not been much evening out of the bad decisions we get, which you would hope for at some point. Trying to be as objective as possible I cannot think of too many horrors that have gone for us, but I could name a few since the start of last season that have gone against us, without trying too hard. 

But it is what it is. I don’t think last nights decisions were horrors, could have gone either way and they went against us. If they’d scored when that donkey up front for them ran straight through Curtis I might think different.

[TuffLuff]

Just as a reposte to those waiving ohh that there’s no conspiracy, I don’t think it’s the decision on a build up to a goal that goes against us, it’s those smaller decisions that turn out to be game changers that we don’t get and I don’t think we have got for a long while. Look at what we’ve had recently that have helped stop our momentum.

Stearman’s red in the first minute, Morrisons red when we had momentum in the final minutes, that bloody Crooks challenge that wasn’t a red are three of the top of my head. Last nights example isn’t the supposed fouls in the build up to the goal, it’s the ref basically telling Izpeazu it’s ok to steam roll Davies that leads to him wrestling him in the box for the goal. 
 

As Rooney said last night, it’s the protection of players that’s lacking. Especially considering that we do then get punished for the same. I’m not saying it’s a ref conspiracy in that a ref isn’t giving us clear decisons, ref are shocking for everyone. But Rooney is correct in saying no one wants us in this league and the EFL have gone out of their way to ensure we didn’t get any more momentum. 

[Ghost of Clough]

For the first 80 minutes I felt the ref was one of the best we've had all season with him being very fair for both sides and got pretty much every decision right.
Then Ikpeazu started imposing himself and the ref started letting a few decisions go Cardiff's way.

Still one of the best refs all season.

[S8TY]

2 hours ago, BrudeRAM said:

Disappointing to see the Wayne rant, I thought the replay didn't show enough for the Festy foul. Putting aside everything happening off the pitch, we only have ourselves to blame for last night. Dominated possession all game and created 1 clear cut chance. Not good enough. We’re in a hole and the only way out is bravery (which we’re not short of) to get your head up and play the ball forward or run at your man at times. Too many occasions yesterday where Plange is through if we play it, we’re on the edge of the box and refuse to hit it or we’ve got a fullback/winger in a one-on-one and we’ve come backwards. Need to do better if we’re to stay up.

Agree with this totally ….it’s also noticeable that as soon as the ball gets to Ravel he slows it down too much and any impetus is lost but he’s not alone it’s far too slow and we let teams get back into shape…not creative enough and don’t get enough players into the box for me 

[Ram-Alf]

Officials are losing the confidence and have for a good few years now from Managers. Players and us the fans, I watched Belper Town and Spalding last Saturday, The Ref looked a teenager and gave a Penalty when a Spalding player clearly dived, But what can you do, Mark them down, The asseser in the stand who marks their performance, So who marks the asseser?

I thought Micheal Oliver was by far our best Ref...until VAR, he now shrugs his shoulders speaks into his mike and confirms the opposite from the complaining players.

Is there a conspiracy against us, I doubt it, Referees will be notified by email, Phone, Letter or speckled Jim as to where their next game will be, My feeling is...when we get our Ref, The Ref clenches his fist and says "yes" it's the Rooney effect, A world renowned ex football star who they have the opportunity to show him..."who's boss", But then it could just be incompetance ?‍♂️

 

[Wazztie16]

4 hours ago, Unlucky Alf said:

 Because it gives the man in the middle a get out of jail free card

If a referee misses a key match incident (KMI), it definitely doesn't work in their favour, so referees don't want to miss the calls, unfortunately sometimes due to their angle, they do. 

[SBW]

Not logged in for a while and just continued to read from afar, as I couldn't be bothered with the same few shooting down objectivity and the notion that Q have been performing below par and not in the interests of DCFC long-term.

However, reading this thread I felt compelled to log in and comment.

Conspiracy? don't be daft.

I've played football most my life, at varying levels including a good standard at Amateur level.  I've played in the FA Cup, FA Vase, Derbyshire Cup Final and been refereed by all sorts.  There are some nobs about, and I do think referees hold a grudge for individuals.  Of course they do, because they're human beings.  They also make mistakes and see things differently.  Remember they get to see it once, at full speed and are officiating in a world when teams now continually try to pull the wool over their eyes with players diving, exaggerating and trying to win decisions.

 

Last night was nothing to do with a conspiracy.  Firstly, I don't think it was a foul on Festy and secondly, Davies had his arms all around their forward, he just lost the duel.  In any game, watch Davies before the ball makes it to him/his forward, he is all over them, always uses his arms.  Not saying it's wrong, you'll see the same with opposition defenders.  But just think more objectivity is required when watching.  There's definitely been some poor decisions over the season, but there are every season, there's also plenty that have benefited too, but it's human nature not to pay attention to those ones. 

 

So no, no conspiracy, the referees aren't seeking to relegate DCFC and Rooney's comments were a little embarrassing to be honest.  But I think we can forgive him, as I can only imagine the stress and frustration he is experiencing and it's come out after a game that should have been won, really, but sadly wasn't.  I suspect he regrets his comments in private, but it's happened now.  Just hope he doesn't get a touchline ban for them, it never goes down well when a manager essentially accuses an official of cheating.  Hopefully his frustration/inexperience is seen and acknowledged and it's just a slap on the wrists.  

Edited March 2, 2022 by SBW

[TuffLuff]

Just to be clear, I think a few are misunderstanding Rooney’s comments last night and I don’t think the tithe of this thread particularly helps (apologies @IslandExile).

The point being made wasn’t that the EFL are telling refs not to give Derby decisions. Rooney can’t say that, it’s impossible to prove. What he was saying was that the EFL don’t want Derby in the Championship and have done everything in their power to ensure relegation, they may even ensure that we are relegated to League 2.
 

Has the EFL’s vendetta, or lack of respect, towards the club then had knock on effects like what decisions we get from refs and an overall ‘lack of protection’ of our players. Rooney gave the example last night if Roos and waiting six weeks to say they got it wrong via email. It’s a lack of respect from the top that is filtering down. To how the fourth officials speak to him and how the ref performs.

[tinman]

It's not the first time Rooney's mentioned the referees and Derby being targetted. He said it a few times at the start of the season. 

[ilkleyram]

Wayne doesn't believe any more than I do that there's a referees' conspiracy.  They're not competent enough to referee well let alone organise a conspiracy.  Clear foul on Curtis, given anywhere else on the pitch, is just the latest of a long line of poor decisions from this season.

Wayne has learnt from one of the masters of deflection and creating dressing room siege mentality ahead of a huge match on Saturday.  The headlines and chat are about him and his views not about the performance or result, it ups the pressure on Saturday's referee however subliminally and it takes some of the pressure off the players.  Ferguson did the same over and over again.

[Seaside Sam]

1 hour ago, SBW said:

Not logged in for a while and just continued to read from afar, as I couldn't be bothered with the same few shooting down objectivity and the notion that Q have been performing below par and not in the interests of DCFC long-term.

However, reading this thread I felt compelled to log in and comment.

Conspiracy? don't be daft.

I've played football most my life, at varying levels including a good standard at Amateur level.  I've played in the FA Cup, FA Vase, Derbyshire Cup Final and been refereed by all sorts.  There are some nobs about, and I do think referees hold a grudge for individuals.  Of course they do, because they're human beings.  They also make mistakes and see things differently.  Remember they get to see it once, at full speed and are officiating in a world when teams now continually try to pull the wool over their eyes with players diving, exaggerating and trying to win decisions.

 

Last night was nothing to do with a conspiracy.  Firstly, I don't think it was a foul on Festy and secondly, Davies had his arms all around their forward, he just lost the duel.  In any game, watch Davies before the ball makes it to him/his forward, he is all over them, always uses his arms.  Not saying it's wrong, you'll see the same with opposition defenders.  But just think more objectivity is required when watching.  There's definitely been some poor decisions over the season, but there are every season, there's also plenty that have benefited too, but it's human nature not to pay attention to those ones. 

 

So no, no conspiracy, the referees aren't seeking to relegate DCFC and Rooney's comments were a little embarrassing to be honest.  But I think we can forgive him, as I can only imagine the stress and frustration he is experiencing and it's come out after a game that should have been won, really, but sadly wasn't.  I suspect he regrets his comments in private, but it's happened now.  Just hope he doesn't get a touchline ban for them, it never goes down well when a manager essentially accuses an official of cheating.  Hopefully his frustration/inexperience is seen and acknowledged and it's just a slap on the wrists.  

you speak far too much sense for this website,i demand you leave right away.......??

[Animal is a Ram]

I mean... ?‍♂️

That said, I think Rooney is trying to pull a bit of a Fergie here - protect the players a little by drawing attention to other factors.

Yes, we lost the game because, at the moment, we can't create many chances let alone finish them, but it could be argued that it feels like we've lost more points than other teams as a result of poor or inconsistent decisions.