B4ev6is Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Just now, angieram said: Well said! Thanks angieram Switching managers got us no were and most cost the club a lot of money why cocu had to try weal and deal and be same this summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MACKWORTHRAM Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I'm fully behind Cocu. With the players at his disposal this season he's done what I expected. Our squad isn't good enough. To even suggest he's not the future is borderline ridiculous. We haven't started back to back seasons with the same manager since Clough. We need stability. He came in last season with 3 weeks of a pre season which was a disaster. Nowhere near enough time to assess the squad and see what was needed. Next season is a big season. Hopefully the EFL charge will come to nothing and we can strengthen. I'd sell Bogle tomorrow if a decent enough offer came in (£8-£10 million) He's gone backwards from last season. Not the best defensively and his crossing leaves a lot to be desired. Then we have the funds to strengthen. The lack of pace out wide and through the middle is staggering. Our midfield is all pedestrian. Rooney, Shinnie, Bird, Knight. There's not a lot of creativity there and that needs addressing. Keeper, winger (possibly 2) a striker, a centre half and something different in midfield. Add that in with Bielik being back, Marriott getting a pre season behind him and we could have a good season.. You can't expect us to go anywhere if we just keep changing managers. Wouldn't surprise me if talks had already begun with players. There's some decent free transfers out there too. Cocu knows more about football than all of us put together. He knows what's needed and what we need to do. Pretty sure his first season at PSV wasn't that good either. Give the bloke a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yani P Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 As has already been mentioned, although this has been our poorest overall performance for many seasons it still pales by comparison with the 3 seasons straight after we were relegated from the Premier League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBRammette Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 It may not be as good a squad as we all would like but I love that we have youngsters coming through that hopefully care for the club and each other from their success in the academy. Mr Cocu has had the biggest pile of ?to deal with, none of it his fault. We ran out of steam in this intensive mini-season unsurprisingly given our reliance on Rooney and Martin (as others let us down with red cards at this key time - again not his fault). People forget the start of this mini season until suspensions kicked in and unsettled the team. Give the man a break. I like him and his team and am more than happy to see what they can do next year. And who else would you want? Would you rather spend money on termination payments than playing staff? Many on here suggested the Huddersfield boss and how did that turn out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 18 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said: I am fully behind Cocu. He has had a very difficult first season and on the whole done well. What I am looking for next season is a faster tempo and more urgency. We don’t move the ball quick enough and don’t seem to have that cutting edge in the final third. That is his challenge next season. Agreed. New GK, Te Weirk, Bielik, winger and ST will help with this. Too many players right now who are either not comfortable on the ball/dynamic with it/move it quickly enough, or just don't have legs. I'm also fast running out of patience on this insistance Rooney plays every minute. He's physically not capable. Would much rather he plays to his potential and goes off after 65 minutes than this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Cocu deserves ( and will get ) the chance to continue working with our club. Cocu has shown that he has integrity and a vision for the future. He treats everyone with respect (even wayward players who have behaved badly ). Rooney's playing role is more questionable. Can he be dropped for some matches even when not fit? Rotation and resting, as happens with some other players might be needed next season for Rooney. We desperately need a mobile forward with skill and a decent winger. It would be a good time to jettison some of the deadwood. ( Josefzoon & Malone & Bennett for starters). That we need a better goalkeeper goes without saying. Today's performance does not matter. Psychologically the players had little to play for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CornwallRam Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Over the course of this season my admiration for Cocu as a man has increased hugely. He's coped with a pantomime of a season with a cool, confidence that is almost super-human. I really hope that he succeeds and goes down in history as our greatest manager ever. He's certainly earned the right to manage us next season - to get rid of him now would be ridiculous. It will be fascinating to see how things go when he has more of his own players. He also knows a lot more about the existing players and the division. Hopefully we'll follow the PSV time-line, with a steady first season, setting up years of triumph. Despite my heart wanting PC, and obviously Derby County, to succeed my head still believes that he won't. I don't believe his style could succeed (ie get promoted) in the Championship unless we have the very best squad - and that means spending a lot of cash which FFP stops us from doing. IMO opinion, to get promoted without bags of cash we need organisation, pace and power...and that's just not Cocu's way. My prediction is next season we'll also be in mid table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superzak Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Its alright sticking by a manager if the said manager is worth while sticking by. With cocu i have my doubts im afraid...the football is boring in the extreme ,very little pattern of play.His subs of which he has now got 5 to choose from leave me baffled all the time. We are playing in the old second division languishing in mid table and we are no where near a promotion side. I see absolutely no improvement this season from last. The reason we are playing mostly under 23s is the fact we have nothing better and after the last 7 seasons at the top of the 2nd division we should by now have a better core of seasoned professionals to choose from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellafella Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 15 minutes ago, Ramfan1958 said: The team today played so slow it's so boring to watch , theres no passion in the players. That was Leeds reserve team and they were miles better than us. Are we improving No is the answer. 48 years season ticket holder and I don't see what the future is with this manager , it's been a shocking season tell me one game were you went Wow !!. Have to agree with you. It’s Paul Clement stylee. Like a slow cha cha cha and turn and slowly send the ball side-ways, now backwards, cha cha cha, and sideways, now backwards, cha cha cha, oops there goes another ball in our net, cha cha, cha, and sideways, again, from the start, and backward . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 4 minutes ago, superzak said: Its alright sticking by a manager if the said manager is worth while sticking by. With Cocu i have my doubts im afraid...the football is boring in the extreme ,very little pattern of play... The reason we are playing mostly under 23s is the fact we have nothing better and after the last 7 seasons at the top of the 2nd division we should by now have a better core of seasoned professionals to choose from. Don't you think the former is dictated somewhat by the latter? I do. I think he's tried to make sure we don't lose games firstly, although I think he sends us out to do better than we achieve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rammieib Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 11 minutes ago, MACKWORTHRAM said: I'm fully behind Cocu. With the players at his disposal this season he's done what I expected. Our squad isn't good enough. To even suggest he's not the future is borderline ridiculous. We haven't started back to back seasons with the same manager since Clough. We need stability. He came in last season with 3 weeks of a pre season which was a disaster. Nowhere near enough time to assess the squad and see what was needed. Next season is a big season. Hopefully the EFL charge will come to nothing and we can strengthen. I'd sell Bogle tomorrow if a decent enough offer came in (£8-£10 million) He's gone backwards from last season. Not the best defensively and his crossing leaves a lot to be desired. Then we have the funds to strengthen. The lack of pace out wide and through the middle is staggering. Our midfield is all pedestrian. Rooney, Shinnie, Bird, Knight. There's not a lot of creativity there and that needs addressing. Keeper, winger (possibly 2) a striker, a centre half and something different in midfield. Add that in with Bielik being back, Marriott getting a pre season behind him and we could have a good season.. You can't expect us to go anywhere if we just keep changing managers. Wouldn't surprise me if talks had already begun with players. There's some decent free transfers out there too. Cocu knows more about football than all of us put together. He knows what's needed and what we need to do. Pretty sure his first season at PSV wasn't that good either. Give the bloke a chance. Spot on - the only thing I’d challenge is whether Bogle is worth that. Ultimately anyone is paying for potential because these last few games he’s been utterly useless. (Like a lot of them). Cocu needs time. I’m personally worried that he wants to keep Martin as that shows to me his approach at the end of the season is almost how he wants to go into next season. Same with wanting to keep Huddlestone. Two constantly deep lying centre Mids may not be the answer either. Rooney does have a brain smarter than most (Hernandez shows that you can be old and effective in this league) but we’re desperate for quality and pace around him therefore. I will trust Cocu to kick us on and deliver top six next season. I trust Morris to find one external investment as we need it especially now. Just a lot of deadwood to go: Davies, Malone, Martin, Flojo, Hamer A lot who could go: Shinnie, Lowe, Bogle, Evans, Roos And build the team around: Te Wriek Rooney Bird Sibley Bielik Good luck in the off season Mr Cocu. You have my support! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MACKWORTHRAM Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 minute ago, rammieib said: Spot on - the only thing I’d challenge is whether Bogle is worth that. Ultimately anyone is paying for potential because these last few games he’s been utterly useless. (Like a lot of them). Cocu needs time. I’m personally worried that he wants to keep Martin as that shows to me his approach at the end of the season is almost how he wants to go into next season. Same with wanting to keep Huddlestone. Two constantly deep lying centre Mids may not be the answer either. Rooney does have a brain smarter than most (Hernandez shows that you can be old and effective in this league) but we’re desperate for quality and pace around him therefore. I will trust Cocu to kick us on and deliver top six next season. I trust Morris to find one external investment as we need it especially now. Just a lot of deadwood to go: Davies, Malone, Martin, Flojo, Hamer A lot who could go: Shinnie, Lowe, Bogle, Evans, Roos And build the team around: Te Wriek Rooney Bird Sibley Bielik Good luck in the off season Mr Cocu. You have my support! Can't argue. I put that value on him for potential more than anything. We've got a lot of deadwood in this squad. That we probably won't be able to get rid of. Bogle is the only one that I would happily sell and will probably fetch the most money. But I'd sell or let go any of these:- Roos, Forsyth, Davies, Shinnie, Waghorn, Malone, Jozefzoon, Evans. Wouldn't bother me one bit if any of those went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 15 minutes ago, superzak said: Its alright sticking by a manager if the said manager is worth while sticking by. With cocu i have my doubts im afraid...the football is boring in the extreme ,very little pattern of play.His subs of which he has now got 5 to choose from leave me baffled all the time. We are playing in the old second division languishing in mid table and we are no where near a promotion side. I see absolutely no improvement this season from last. The reason we are playing mostly under 23s is the fact we have nothing better and after the last 7 seasons at the top of the 2nd division we should by now have a better core of seasoned professionals to choose from. and how is that Cocu's fault? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyinLiverpool Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 31 minutes ago, B4ev6is said: For godsake cocu needs time to build a team and that means sticking by a manager. This should be the end of the matter. Close the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimmu Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I'm afraid Cocu won't be able to tinker the squad as much as he would like to. Hard to sell anyone and therefore, he won't have room to bring in players he'd like to. Also, I assume we need to cut our wage costs as the income will take a hit due crowd missing. It does not look rosy for the next season either, thanks to covid-19. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ilsonram12 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Brolly Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 51 minutes ago, B4ev6is said: For godsake cocu needs time to build a team and that means sticking by a manager. Hear hear give the man a chance let's wait until at least September. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeedsRam1999 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 Not one single player on the pitch was signed by Cocu permanently. I don’t say how you can say he isn’t the future of this club without letting him sign any of his own players. He is trying to solve the fundamental issue of this club. The fact that the squad is chopped and changed every season as a result of no manager managing consecutive seasons since Mac 1. He is going to transform the squad into only players who can play this way and fit his style of play. This season was the audition for the players. He will sell who he doesn’t like and buy who he wants. This can take years but we have to give him time. He did it at PSV, he will do it here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkle Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 I think he has done well with what he had at his disposal, especially after a crap pre season and some very strange signings given to him then losing the captain and best defender in Keogh with Lawrence and Bennett losing focus all at the same time to be followed by all the FFP stuff and yes we managed to find a player every week to make a major mistake. We ended up trying to play 2 defensive midfielders to stop the flow of goals against but it didn’t really stop us from conceding 2-3 most weeks and yes we even lost a player because he got stabbed. You simply couldn’t make it up. we need a goalkeeper better than what we have, we need a central defender better than we have who can dominate in the championship. We need a centre forward with pace who is direct and scores goals with certainly at least one wide player who can do the same, but most of all we need an attacking style to go with all of that which we simply couldn’t do with all the mess we have had to deal with this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie20 Posted July 19, 2020 Share Posted July 19, 2020 1 hour ago, Ramfan1958 said: Is Cocu the Future in my opinion it's a no . Is Rooney the Future as a player again it's a no. I think this is the worst Derby team for many a year. Really worried if we play 50% academy players next year that we could be relegated. Just being honest !!! Yet less than a fortnight ago you were happy with the season and encouraged by the introduction of the young players. Don't go out if it's windy - you'll change your view again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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