Knight, Bird and Sibley

[Bris Vegas]

Our three jewels were all better playera during Phillip Cocu’s first season in charge.

They haven’t kicked on at all.

Put it down to managerial changes, the club situation, relegation…

But those three were tipped to become £10million+ PL regulars.

Now they don’t even stand out in League One.

I hope for their sake they move on and fulfill their potential elsewhere because I just can’t see it happening at Derby.

[Day]

In fairness to both Knight and Sibley, neither have had any kind of consistent run in the team in one position. Both have suffered due to issues with the team elsewhere and had to cover.

Really not sure how we can expect them to kick on. 

[OoooMarkWright]

I think that’s the point @David they’ve been messed around which has hindered their development, Sibley more so. He should have been ‘the one’. Rooney ruined him and he’s not recovered. He needs that bite in his game that many have criticised him for on here. I hope he can come good. I’ve no idea why managers haven’t played him in his best position. Such a waste.

[jimtastic56]

10 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

Our three jewels were all better playera during Phillip Cocu’s first season in charge.

They haven’t kicked on at all.

Put it down to managerial changes, the club situation, relegation…

But those three were tipped to become £10million+ PL regulars.

Now they don’t even stand out in League One.

I hope for their sake they move on and fulfill their potential elsewhere because I just can’t see it happening at Derby.

Sorry about that - I agree with you , especially Sibley. But I don’t think it’s too late for him to prove himself with Rams.

[Rammy03]

Maybe just maybe they're not as good as we think they are

[Magicman]

Knight Smith Hourihane seems better balanced . 

[RoyMac5]

3 minutes ago, Magicman said:

Knight Smith Hourihane seems better balanced . 

Just more experienced.

[Steve Buckley’s Dog]

We can’t score goals. Sibley can score goals. Maybe play Sibley in a position where he can score goals. We tried this for one game and he scored goals. Maybe try it again? Although to be fair we did give him another 45 minutes so probably best not to bother again. 

[DavesaRam]

1 hour ago, Rammy03 said:

Maybe just maybe they're not as good as we think they are

I suspect we’ll never find out with young (ish) Louie. I somehow don’t think he will ever get a good run in his best position.

[BondJovi]

Just now, DavesaRam said:

I suspect we’ll never find out with young (ish) Louie. I somehow don’t think he will ever get a good run in his best position.

Which I think will be one of the biggest wastes of talent this club has seen.

He hasn't had a run in that position since he got injured under Cocu 3/4 games into that season.

On 2 occasions, when he finally has started in his favoured role he has played really well, started the next match and then made the scapegoat at half time when others have played worse! Happened under Rooney and happened under Warne. Yet, more experienced players are given many more chances despite poor performances.

Garbage management. If he had a long run of matches and failed to deliver I could understand, but we haven't seen him complete 2 matches in a row in his favourite position since Cocu. How can he ever progress when that happens?

[Derbados]

I mean, playing Jason Knight at RB is like buying a Ferrari and putting a 30mph speed limiter on it, competent though he was. 

Knight will move on and become at PL player within the next 3-4 years, will probably be picked up by a top 6 Championship team this summer and kick on from there

[Papahet]

All 3 are vastly overrated tbh

[Guest]

I think Warne values Knight, sees the achievable potential in Bird, and can’t make a case for Sibley.

If a decent coach at another club gets his hands on Sibley or Bird, we will learn the hard way how good they are.  (And it won’t be as Sibley makes the England squad as a left wing-back!)

Bird’s progress looks something like a U; he was very good, then he wasn’t, then he got back to where he’d been, with some new strengths (including physicality). He has always been able to see the best pass and has a great range.

Knight reached his peak (so far) at the start of this season, in any position he played. It’s sort of intriguing as to why he’s not quite there now.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Steve Buckley’s Dog said:

We can’t score goals. Sibley can score goals. Maybe play Sibley in a position where he can score goals. We tried this for one game and he scored goals. Maybe try it again? Although to be fair we did give him another 45 minutes so probably best not to bother again. 

I read your post and found excessive common sense and logical reasoning therein. What are we supposed to do with it?

[Archied]

I’m of the opinion we have over rated our youngsters, they are obviously not rubbish players but they are young players who have shown a bit of promise in patches but even then they have looked possible championship level , they are far from standing out at league 1 level , they may progress with the right players around them but they may also have reached they’re level

[Guest]

13 minutes ago, Archied said:

I’m of the opinion we have over rated our youngsters, they are obviously not rubbish players but they are young players who have shown a bit of promise in patches but even then they have looked possible championship level , they are far from standing out at league 1 level , they may progress with the right players around them but they may also have reached they’re level

I don’t think anyone but Knight is destined for international football but I really believe they have the potential to play in the top division. (To emphasise: none of them is currently good enough to do that!)

In a way I hope you’re right because it will be hard to watch them succeed with someone else if we don’t help them towards achieving their potential (and at the same time benefit ourselves by doing so)

[TomTom92]

Think Knight has a ceiling of bottom 6 PL club, at worst he'll probably replicate Bryson's career and have 1/2 seasons where he becomes a menace in front of goal but over than that just be a honest pro who gives his all.

Bird is a bit of a mystery to me, sometimes i think he could make a very good championship player but then other times he looks league 1 at best.

Sibley is the real enigma and i feel he's at the stage where he needs to leave. Although we seem reluctant to allow this as knowing our luck we'd sell him for £400,000 and he'd rip it up for a couple of seasons at Coventry before moving on for £6 - £8m. Almost like if we can't get the best out of him then nobody else is allowed to. Shame for the lad because Derby is his team. 

But bare in mind Will Hughes probably gave us a season too many and along with a nasty injury his career has been somewhat underwhelming in comparison to what us Derby fans thought anyway. 

I expect 2 from Knight, Bird, Sibley and Cashin to move on in the summer and i wish them well. 

[RoyMac5]

I think because they have been playing with us for so long they no longer get the judgement afforded to other teams young players. Occasionally when watching the Championship games the commo will mention how good some player or other is and say 'young player' and '21' (or so) and I think we expect our young players to be fully formed but they've only just grown into men.

Hope Bird gets back in the team soon because he will become a cracking player. Sibley has been so poorly treated for someone who can score goals - when did it become fashionable to play goal-scorers as defenders? If Warne thinks he's not good enough for us at this level I hope young Sibbo goes and learns his position at another team.

Not sure where Duracell bunny Knight will end up, but his energy is relentless.

[Caerphilly Ram]

17 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

 

Hope Bird gets back in the team soon because he will become a cracking player. Sibley has been so poorly treated for someone who can score goals - when did it become fashionable to play goal-scorers as defenders? If Warne thinks he's not good enough for us at this level I hope young Sibbo goes and learns his position at another team.

Not sure where Duracell bunny Knight will end up, but his energy is relentless.

Good points about the perception of those young players as seasoned pros outside of the club, they’ve all played a fair few games of senior football due to a combination of their talents and Mel’s implosion of the club that they’re probably seen by outsiders as older than they are. 
I really don’t get this assumption that Sibley has been poorly treated and that Warne doesn’t rate him.
Warne has given Sibley way more appearances this season than previous managers have done and always speaks highly of him. Your point about it being “fashionable to use goalscorers as defenders” ignores the reality of the situation. Sibley was used as a defender through necessity and did a very good job there, which must play into the “why” of Warne using him there, he knows Sibley can do a job for the team in that role and uses him as such.
You keep professing that Sibley’s best position is further forward, he undoubtedly carries a goal threat, but 4(?) managers have now decided not to use him regularly in that role, they must have reasons for that that us fans simply don’t see.

Put yourself in Warne’s shoes for a moment, you’ve got to get Sibley in his best role as you suggest in our current squad, what formation would you use?

[Guest]

1 hour ago, TomTom92 said:

Think Knight has a ceiling of bottom 6 PL club, at worst he'll probably replicate Bryson's career and have 1/2 seasons where he becomes a menace in front of goal but over than that just be a honest pro who gives his all.

Bird is a bit of a mystery to me, sometimes i think he could make a very good championship player but then other times he looks league 1 at best.

Sibley is the real enigma and i feel he's at the stage where he needs to leave. Although we seem reluctant to allow this as knowing our luck we'd sell him for £400,000 and he'd rip it up for a couple of seasons at Coventry before moving on for £6 - £8m. Almost like if we can't get the best out of him then nobody else is allowed to. Shame for the lad because Derby is his team. 

But bare in mind Will Hughes probably gave us a season too many and along with a nasty injury his career has been somewhat underwhelming in comparison to what us Derby fans thought anyway. 

I expect 2 from Knight, Bird, Sibley and Cashin to move on in the summer and i wish them well. 

Absolutely no bite to his game whatsoever. Never been a captain.