Match Thread: vs Northampton Town (a)

[McArthur Park]

44 minutes ago, Seth's left foot said:

apparently we’re not allowed to criticise him due to our league position.

And those of us who prefer to see the league position as a positive are derided because "it's a rubbish league, with another manager we'd have walked the league, we have the biggest wage budget so should be walking the league, we're only second inspite of Warne not because of him, and we don't deserve it because something, something xG".

[Lokidoki]

1 hour ago, McArthur Park said:

And those of us who prefer to see the league position as a positive are derided because "it's a rubbish league, with another manager we'd have walked the league, we have the biggest wage budget so should be walking the league, we're only second inspite of Warne not because of him, and we don't deserve it because something, something xG".

As I see it, the main issue is that PW has far too many off days, particularly against opposition that we should be beating. It is obvious tactically. Analyse the match, the pitch was narrow but we set with 5 at the back and a midfielder that should’ve been in the middle playing totally out of position. We have a ball playing midfielder on the bench, when it is obvious to see that CH was playing badly and has no strength in defence longer, the two legged jump, the standard procedure to frighten the opposition, being totally ineffective and not scary in the least.

Then we have the so called most able attacking player in this division, sat on the bench.  Instead of subbing early, we bring 5 on after 65. 
as I have stated in my other posts it’s the inconsistency, one match good, another like a rabbit in headlights. I don’t expect every ball to go in the net at this level but I do expect us to limit the opposition by understanding their setup and doing things in mitigation and this should be done quite early in the game, thus our chances should go further. However, I simply cannot see it game after game and it is this that really concerns me.

on a weekly basis we see managers of lesser teams making these changes more consistently and effectively and that has been my charge all the time. Lack of obviously learning from mistakes, making a good decision one week and repeating an old one the following week.

I hope that for the last few weeks, we do not have to continue this Groundhog Day. I just want success.

[Wolfie20]

I think it's fair to say that's what most of us want but I would also suspect that, for the majority of supporters, the need for success when following our Club isn't the be all and end all.

Edited March 25 by Wolfie20

[McArthur Park]

25 minutes ago, Wolfie20 said:

I think it's fair to say that's what most of us want but I would also suspect that, for the majority of supporters, the need for success when following our Club isn't the be all and end all.

Actually this is a really good point , and may be the reason that the "two sides", as there seem to be, are so polarised? There are those who actually do see success as the be all and end all, and therefore are perhaps more likely to be critical if they don't think we are going to achieve that, and those, myself included, who just enjoy following the club, enjoy everything that match day entails, irrespective of style of football, the league we are playing in etc. Obviously it would be great to be playing scintillating football, 20 points clear at the top, but it's not the only, or most important, thing for some.

[Walkley Ram]

43 minutes ago, McArthur Park said:

Actually this is a really good point , and may be the reason that the "two sides", as there seem to be, are so polarised? There are those who actually do see success as the be all and end all, and therefore are perhaps more likely to be critical if they don't think we are going to achieve that, and those, myself included, who just enjoy following the club, enjoy everything that match day entails, irrespective of style of football, the league we are playing in etc. Obviously it would be great to be playing scintillating football, 20 points clear at the top, but it's not the only, or most important, thing for some.

I'm neither. I don't expect success. But I don't want turgid football either. I'd rather play well and achieve nothing (as we have for the last 20 years or so, give or take) than play awful and achieve nothing.

The best we can hope for as Derby fans is the odd blip of success, the odd sniff of the premier league every few years, maybe even a few seasons there every now and then. Hope is that key word. It's like only fools and horses, "this time next year lads, we'll be in the prem"....

I'm not sure if it's the manager, the players, league one, administration, some combination of all of the above, but that little flicker of hope in me has gone. I don't see us as a temporarily embarrassed premier league team any more. Games like Saturday have absolutely ground that kind of thinking out of me.

I don't honestly care if we go up or not this season, or if we win lose or draw etc. I just want something to look forward to next time I watch the match, and that's pretty much gone for me at the moment.

Sorry for the essay.

[Archied]

6 hours ago, oodledoodle said:

I'm neither. I don't expect success. But I don't want turgid football either. I'd rather play well and achieve nothing (as we have for the last 20 years or so, give or take) than play awful and achieve nothing.

The best we can hope for as Derby fans is the odd blip of success, the odd sniff of the premier league every few years, maybe even a few seasons there every now and then. Hope is that key word. It's like only fools and horses, "this time next year lads, we'll be in the prem"....

I'm not sure if it's the manager, the players, league one, administration, some combination of all of the above, but that little flicker of hope in me has gone. I don't see us as a temporarily embarrassed premier league team any more. Games like Saturday have absolutely ground that kind of thinking out of me.

I don't honestly care if we go up or not this season, or if we win lose or draw etc. I just want something to look forward to next time I watch the match, and that's pretty much gone for me at the moment.

Sorry for the essay.

To be honest , reading your post it sounds more like what your looking for is consistency and what knocks the stuffing out of you is the lack of it ,guts me too , my reaction during and for a while after the game was , why the duck do I bother putting myself through this 

reality is you really don’t get consistency at this level or even below mid table prem , the players lack that and it’s why they are not top level , what you gonna do ? Give up and support city ? 
nah where’s the gut churning butterflies , highs and lows in that ?
I get it though ,I really do ,it’s hard work being a derby fan

[IlsonDerby]

19 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Or it could be that having a squad made up of bargain basement freebies and players in the twilight's of their careers, due to the financial constraints we were under, means that we are prone to injuries which in turn necessitate changes in formation and tactics.

Of course when they work it is because Warne is lucky and when it doesn't work it is because Warne is a tactically naive PE teacher.

Think I've got that right. 

Who are these ‘bargain basement’ players you’re alluding to? 
 

Every player we have signed would have had a queue of suiters in this division lining up for them. 
 

Basement bargain signings were what Rooney was using in the relegation season. 

[derbydaz22]

43 minutes ago, Archied said:

To be honest , reading your post it sounds more like what your looking for is consistency and what knocks the stuffing out of you is the lack of it ,guts me too , my reaction during and for a while after the game was , why the duck do I bother putting myself through this 

reality is you really don’t get consistency at this level or even below mid table prem , the players lack that and it’s why they are not top level , what you gonna do ? Give up and support city ? 
nah where’s the gut churning butterflies , highs and lows in that ?
I get it though ,I really do ,it’s hard work being a derby fan

I don’t think it’s consistency that fans crave it’s basics like getting the ball down and try and play football even if it doesn’t work. Games like Sat make us look a poor side and we have had far to many off days even if we are 2nd.

[Archied]

27 minutes ago, derbydaz22 said:

I don’t think it’s consistency that fans crave it’s basics like getting the ball down and try and play football even if it doesn’t work. Games like Sat make us look a poor side and we have had far to many off days even if we are 2nd.

We do that in patches then we have times when the players couldn’t pass wind , the ball bounces off them like pinball or they take an eye off the ball , miss control or let the ball roll out of play ,

personally I’m not keen on the idea of keep doing something even if it doesn’t work , it’s a results business and the so called better football teams like Bolton and Peterborough are doing slightly worse than us in the league and just as prone to the destructive dire performance and result 🤷🏻‍♂️

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

34 minutes ago, derbydaz22 said:

I don’t think it’s consistency that fans crave it’s basics like getting the ball down and try and play football even if it doesn’t work. Games like Sat make us look a poor side and we have had far to many off days even if we are 2nd.

Agreed. I want to be proud of my team and currently I'm not. I'm proud of our history, proud of our stadium, proud of our training facilities, proud of our fans but I'm not proud of the team when they play like they did Saturday. Absolutely unacceptable. 

[TheRamOfSwad]

I'd rather get promoted with s*** football, don't know why we'd wanna stay playing the likes of Fleetwood again next season when we could go up no matter the playing style. 

Aint got the luxury to be picky and choosy that's for when you're already winning in the Premier league and have a significant budget to buy a squad 

Get out of this league = more money, better fixtures, bigger attraction to be able to sign better players. Plus some achievement to celebrate 

If Paul doesn't work next season then we can part ways, but give him a handshake and thank him for getting us up and move on it's not a big deal

Don't know why some people don't actually want promotion, it's weird but perhaps they enjoy the suffering somewhat and " oh I knew it would happen" 

[Tamworthram]

2 minutes ago, TheRamOfSwad said:

I'd rather get promoted with s*** football, don't know why we'd wanna stay playing the likes of Fleetwood again next season when we could go up no matter the playing style. 

Aint got the luxury to be picky and choosy that's for when you're already winning in the Premier league and have a significant budget to buy a squad 

Get out of this league = more money, better fixtures, bigger attraction to be able to sign better players. Plus some achievement to celebrate 

If Paul doesn't work next season then we can part ways, but give him a handshake and thank him for getting us up and move on it's not a big deal

Don't know why some people don't actually want promotion, it's weird but perhaps they enjoy the suffering somewhat and " oh I knew it would happen" 

How many people, if any, on this forum have said they don’t want promotion?

I suspect the majority would love to see us playing entertaining football AND getting promoted but are prepared to go without the former this season provided we go up. At this stage in the season, I for one am prepared to accept us winning ugly. If we park the bus at Pompey and hold on for a point, that’s OK. If we scrape a win in all of three remaining home games, I can live with that now we’re at the sharp end of the season (although I’d obviously rather we won handsomely and avoided a nerve wrecking final few minutes). 
 

BUT, what surely concerns most of us is the type of football we’re likely to see next season if we go up and if we’ll struggle to survive or not. Despite PW’s record at Championship level, I for one am prepared to defer any opinion until we see what he delivers for us.

[TheRamOfSwad]

51 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

How many people, if any, on this forum have said they don’t want promotion?

I suspect the majority would love to see us playing entertaining football AND getting promoted but are prepared to go without the former this season provided we go up. At this stage in the season, I for one am prepared to accept us winning ugly. If we park the bus at Pompey and hold on for a point, that’s OK. If we scrape a win in all of three remaining home games, I can live with that now we’re at the sharp end of the season (although I’d obviously rather we won handsomely and avoided a nerve wrecking final few minutes). 
 

BUT, what surely concerns most of us is the type of football we’re likely to see next season if we go up and if we’ll struggle to survive or not. Despite PW’s record at Championship level, I for one am prepared to defer any opinion until we see what he delivers for us.

Probably going to be about 10 players leaving, it's gonna be a different squad

Look at the difference Adams and Nyambe have made being younger and more athletic players. I think a few more signings like that would suit Paul's style more but I think securing a mid table finish next season would be perfectly acceptable 

But we shouldn't worry or look too far ahead as it robs you off enjoying the moment just need to moan less and get behind the lads is all I'm saying and I have seen comments like they aren't enjoying it like we are 2nd to be honest I'm enjoying being up the top end of a table regardless of some bad performances 

Paul Warne wins 3-0 and the match thread is about 20-30 pages less than if he loses, that's telling to me that people love to f****** moan 😂😝

 

[Lokidoki]

6 minutes ago, TheRamOfSwad said:

Probably going to be about 10 players leaving, it's gonna be a different squad

Look at the difference Adams and Nyambe have made being younger and more athletic players. I think a few more signings like that would suit Paul's style more but I think securing a mid table finish next season would be perfectly acceptable 

But we shouldn't worry or look too far ahead as it robs you off enjoying the moment just need to moan less and get behind the lads is all I'm saying and I have seen comments like they aren't enjoying it like we are 2nd to be honest I'm enjoying being up the top end of a table regardless of some bad performances 

Paul Warne wins 3-0 and the match thread is about 20-30 pages less than if he loses, that's telling to me that people love to f****** moan 😂😝

 

That wasn’t quite my point earlier on. The players can in some respects be excused, unless they stupidly head-but the opposition, they are mostly old or nowadays journeyman, they are third division players. Therefore at times poor football is to be expected.

What I was alluding to is that the most inconsistent team member(s) is the coach and his team. They get picked over tactically by lesser teams too frequently and this goes back to last season. We are not learning lessons. The games that we do well at is when the opposition allows us to play.  
When PW and his team use midfield correctly and use the footballing common sense they must have (to have got this far in their careers) then the result is usually acceptable. Dumb sticking to the original plan when it isn’t working, until too late, is what cheeses me off. And that is my point, learn by mistakes, coaching team, please.

[Tamworthram]

6 minutes ago, TheRamOfSwad said:

Probably going to be about 10 players leaving, it's gonna be a different squad

Look at the difference Adams and Nyambe have made being younger and more athletic players. I think a few more signings like that would suit Paul's style more but I think securing a mid table finish next season would be perfectly acceptable 

But we shouldn't worry or look too far ahead as it robs you off enjoying the moment just need to moan less and get behind the lads is all I'm saying and I have seen comments like they aren't enjoying it like we are 2nd to be honest I'm enjoying being up the top end of a table regardless of some bad performances 

Paul Warne wins 3-0 and the match thread is about 20-30 pages less than if he loses, that's telling to me that people love to f****** moan 😂😝

 

I’m still in the PW in camp (just about) but sadly the good 3:0 wins are far outweighed by the poor defeats and the less than convincing wins. I also think the point you’ve made about new signings in the summer suiting Warne’s style is what is worrying a lot of people. Like I said, I think many of us are prepared the stomach the often less than entertaining football in order to get us out of this league but maybe don’t relish the prospect of the same next season. I also enjoy (most of the time) being at the top end of the league regardless of some (many I would suggest) bad performances but let’s be realistic, if we get promoted, we’re unlikely to have the luxury of being in the top six or so next season to compensate for the quality of football.

I think the higher number of posts when we lose compared to when we win is reflective of the above rather than people not wanting us to get promoted.

For me, I obviously want us to get promoted. Playing great football in the process would be ideal but not essential now that we’ve got so few games to go.

If we fall short, I’ll just accept it and we go again next season with PW in charge.(I’ll still be renewing my season ticket next season). If we go up I’ll be hopeful of surviving comfortably (again with PW in charge) and seeing some decent football. I’m certainly not assuming the football will be c**p and we’ll struggle.

 

[TheRamOfSwad]

I think if we were handed our league position at the start of the season 9/10 would have grabbed the opportunity. I certainly didn't expect to steamroll teams playing amazing football 

Guess it's the old you take it as it comes but yeah maybe Paul has a sell by date and that's fine. in fact it's how football works now. I think whats probably more limiting is the amount of financial backing the club has going forward to be able to compete with the parachute payment clubs long term etc 

unfortunately finances dictate a lot nowadays but of course I want attractive football too as well as results, what Derby fan wouldn't 

I just try to be positive going in as I think It's what it's all about, going to the match with my dad, enjoying the day being optimistic in our score lines and whacking a tenner on a result that never comes off 😂

[G STAR RAM]

13 hours ago, IlsonDerby said:

Who are these ‘bargain basement’ players you’re alluding to? 
 

Every player we have signed would have had a queue of suiters in this division lining up for them. 
 

Basement bargain signings were what Rooney was using in the relegation season. 

Bargain basement refers to the price paid for goods and them being cheap.

With all of out signings being freebies, I'd suggest they are all bargain basement.

I'd add that there is usually a reason players are available on a free, and it's probably reflected in our current injury list.

 

 

Edited March 26 by G STAR RAM

[IlsonDerby]

10 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Bargain basement refers to the price paid for goods and them being cheap.

With all of out signings being freebies, I'd suggest they are all bargain basement.

I'd add that there is usually a reason players are available on a free, and it's probably reflected in our current injury list.

 

 

Id suggest that post covid the market is completely different. Most transfers in league 1 happen with no money changing hands at all. The odd transfer fee paid by traditional championship clubs but we’d have our hands snapped off for NML, TB, CN, CE, KW, EA, JC at this level. 

[S8TY]

21 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

I’m still in the PW in camp (just about) but sadly the good 3:0 wins are far outweighed by the poor defeats and the less than convincing wins. I also think the point you’ve made about new signings in the summer suiting Warne’s style is what is worrying a lot of people. Like I said, I think many of us are prepared the stomach the often less than entertaining football in order to get us out of this league but maybe don’t relish the prospect of the same next season. I also enjoy (most of the time) being at the top end of the league regardless of some (many I would suggest) bad performances but let’s be realistic, if we get promoted, we’re unlikely to have the luxury of being in the top six or so next season to compensate for the quality of football.

I think the higher number of posts when we lose compared to when we win is reflective of the above rather than people not wanting us to get promoted.

For me, I obviously want us to get promoted. Playing great football in the process would be ideal but not essential now that we’ve got so few games to go.

If we fall short, I’ll just accept it and we go again next season with PW in charge.(I’ll still be renewing my season ticket next season). If we go up I’ll be hopeful of surviving comfortably (again with PW in charge) and seeing some decent football. I’m certainly not assuming the football will be c**p and we’ll struggle.

 

Ipswich have been brilliant this season after promotion from this league and yes have had time to build a better team and squad I think the worry is with some fans including myself is, even if PW did have the time I don't think his style/methods would be successful in the championship 

This sounds harsh but football can be , If PW got us promoted I would say thankyou for your efforts and come to an agreement to let him go as I think we need someone different in a higher league

It would be a mistake IMO if we let PW spend our tight budget in the championship on players who may well not suit a different manager and i don't see why we couldn't be a good side challenging for play offs if we were to use our academy and bring in some good young players with a couple of loanees and few old heads 

 Robins and Mckenna are good young forward thinking examples of good managers  who have come from lower down the leagues and I still think we'd be an attractive option for a good young coach/manager

 

 

 

[Crewton]

Mendez-Laing was generally described as "trouble" and incapable of playing more than 30 games a season when we signed him.  Few Wendies fans wanted to keep him.

Nelson and Collins were generally described as "past it" and "never that good anyway".

Elder and Barkhuizen were generally thought to be good signings at this level. Adams is only on loan and was regarded as a "crock" who'd had one good season with FGR.

Other clubs were clearly interested in Wilson, though some thought he also was just another "one season with FGR" wonder.

How many of those signings were ones where the majority thought "wow, that's a great signing"? I'm sure if you read the transfer threads on here, not many will have been welcomed as much as the Sonny Bradley signing.

The club took a bit of a gamble on them, because they had to. So "bargain basement"? Perhaps not, because we clearly pay good wages, but definitely from the "closing down sales". Some of them have proven to be very good purchases indeed