The Paul Warne Poll

[RoyMac5]

15 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

It’s easy to say we should replace Warne now, but let’s remember it would be the people who appointed him and wanted him to be at the heart of the club’s long term plan who would be tasked with this.

If they can make this mistake once, what is there to stop them from doing it again?

Lol. I'm not getting your point here. They've made a mistake so can't have another go at it because they've made a mistake before? 😄

[Jourdan]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

Lol. I'm not getting your point here. They've made a mistake so can't have another go at it because they've made a mistake before? 😄

The point is, if we replace Warne now, the club are admitting a mistake was made.

So the people involved in the decision making process would be under pressure to get it right the second time around.

Would you feel confident in them getting it right?

[Ambitious]

I think if it’s a car crash over the next few months then we review at Christmas, otherwise end of the season. We’ve built for the short-term, there is no long-term project here under Warne so we’re going to be blowing it up at the end of the year anyway in terms of playing squad - especially with so many out of contract. Warne, Thomas, et al need to prove that they’re capable operators over the course of the season or find someone who can. 

[RoyMac5]

2 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

The point is, if we replace Warne now, the club are admitting a mistake was made.

So the people involved in the decision making process would be under pressure to get it right the second time around.

Would you feel confident in them getting it right?

Why not? How does staying with a wrong decision make that right. Nor does it mean that another decision will be wrong.

Edited August 23, 2023 by RoyMac5

[Ambitious]

4 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

The point is, if we replace Warne now, the club are admitting a mistake was made.

So the people involved in the decision making process would be under pressure to get it right the second time around.

Would you feel confident in them getting it right?

They need to get it right, regardless of our confidence in them to do so, their decisions have a knock on effect that change the fortunes of this club in significant ways. 

I think the Paul Warne experience will be a good lesson for Clowes even if it doesn’t work out, because everyone can see why he was their chosen candidate and what they hoped he would bring to the club. We are (now) seeing the things that don’t quite align with the values of the club historically and why there are questions being raised by the fans. 

I honestly thought Warne would be a pragmatic manager, so I was massively caught off-guard when he came in and set the team up as he has. He is the least pragmatic manager I believe I have ever seen in charge of Derby, including Daz Waz in that who liked to play a little fast and loose at times. 

[May Contain Nuts]

The main reason for keeping someone should never be the fear of what happens if you don't.

Edited August 23, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Jourdan]

5 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Why not? How does staying with a wrong decision make that right. Nor does it mean that another decision will be wrong.

Of course, there are no guarantees in either case.

However, for the fanbase to have confidence in the key people in the club, surely they have to stand by their decisions and not just rip everything up at the first sign of trouble?

To me, if we sack Warne now, it’s simply reactive. It’s not part of a bigger, well thought out, well projected plan.

[RoyMac5]

5 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

Of course, there are no guarantees in either case.

However, for the fanbase to have confidence in the key people in the club, surely they have to stand by their decisions and not just rip everything up at the first sign of trouble?

To me, if we sack Warne now, it’s simply reactive. It’s not part of a bigger, well thought out, well projected plan.

You see I think exactly the opposite.

They have a well thought out plan, involving not just a new manager but a reworking of the Academy. When it becomes apparent that their choice has not worked out then they don't throw away the whole plan, they re-choose a manager who can put the plan into effect.

Edited August 23, 2023 by RoyMac5

[InstaRam]

43 minutes ago, Mick Brolly said:

What if we're 7th 3 points off top spot at Christmas 🎄 

If at Christmas we managed to collect fewer or as many points as six other teams in a league where maybe 1-3 teams contain something that even resembles elements of quality, it is surprisingly weak, I must say. Last year, for example, there were basically three teams that could play football. The remaining teams were at a level that could be mistaken for semi-amateur. We no longer compete with these three  teams because they have already advanced. We should be able, given the conditions, to deliver a performance that a maximum of 5 teams can match until Christmas. Otherwise, it means that we have probably been a team that kicks long and runs a lot but to limited benefit. That for me is not good enough and something would need to change. For the record I think Warne will get us to minimum top 6 this year.

So to answer the question, 7th is not a top 6 placement 😅

If, on the other hand, we are playing good football and are heading in the right direction but are 7th 3p from first place then I take back all of the above and firmly claim the opposite.

 

[RadioactiveWaste]

We all remember how GSE just kept with "Nigel's our guy" for year after year? We mostly look back on GSE as having actually been good and responsible owners, and there were points where Nigel was really not popular.

How many people are giving it both "we need promotion this year" and "theres no long term plan"?

I'm not a massive fan and I've had the odd "Peason" vibe of "this just isn't going to work" but I'm a moron off the internet so I'm not going to get carried away on this, but if the team are still underperforming around christmas, then, yes, perhaps start thinking about it.

At the moment it seems like they're just bad at being what Warne wants them to be, rather than just being bad. But then, i thought the tea would get good at doing what Cocu wanted and that didn't work out so well.

 

[Jourdan]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

You see I think exactly the opposite.

They have a well thought out plan, involving not just a new manager but a reworking of the Academy. When it becomes apparent that their choice has not worked out then they don't throw away the whole plan, they re-choose a manager who can put the plan into effect.

To me, sacking a key figure less than a year into a four-year term doesn’t really mesh with that.

If the plan is well thought out and the appointment of said key figure is too, surely you would have anticipated some bumps in the road and be ready and willing to work things out?

[RoyMac5]

4 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

To me, sacking a key figure less than a year into a four-year term doesn’t really mesh with that.

If the plan is well thought out and the appointment of said key figure is too, surely you would have anticipated some bumps in the road and be ready and willing to work things out?

Well yes, and in the football world that is usually achieved by appointing another manager.

[Jourdan]

3 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Well yes, and in the football world that is usually achieved by appointing another manager.

Are our circumstances usual, though?

[Rammy03]

9 minutes ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

At the moment it seems like they're just bad at being what Warne wants them to be, rather than just being bad. But then, i thought the tea would get good at doing what Cocu wanted and that didn't work out so well.

 

The difference is Warne has actually been there done it and got the t shirt.

[Big Trav]

I would say unless it’s a calamity, near relagation/ not looking to challenge for top 6 then I would get rid. But if we’re working 6-7 points of top 6 I would keep him just for stability. If it does go all pear shaped then Luke Williams at Notts County would be my number 1 choice or Mike Williams at Gateshead

[TomTom92]

The biggest lesson here is don’t hand out a 4 year contract. 
 
I appreciate at the time Warne was in demand so Clowes went balls deep to ensure we got our man. But if things don’t take a turn for the better then either he’s paying up big time and admitting a mistake. Or he sticks with Warne and half the fan base continue to be toxic.

I still think with 3/4 good signings we’re back in contention but our dealings in the market don’t give me confidence that we’ll get the job done.

[sage]

24 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

Of course, there are no guarantees in either case.

However, for the fanbase to have confidence in the key people in the club, surely they have to stand by their decisions and not just rip everything up at the first sign of trouble?

To me, if we sack Warne now, it’s simply reactive. It’s not part of a bigger, well thought out, well projected plan.

Do you see signs of this now?

[IslandExile]

1 minute ago, Rammy03 said:

The difference is Warne has actually been there done it and got the t shirt.

People talk a lot about Warne's three promotions with Rotherham.

It was three because they were relegated twice under him immediately afterwards. That often seems to be overlooked.

[TomTom92]

3 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

Are our circumstances usual, though?

Point taken. 
 
But without being harsh surely if DC is a Derby man through and through he’ll look to sell if he can’t finance us to be at the right end of the table?

[Rammy03]

8 minutes ago, IslandExile said:

People talk a lot about Warne's three promotions with Rotherham.

It was three because they were relegated twice under him immediately afterwards. That often seems to be overlooked.

Still had to get them up and he did. Rotherham were expected to be down the bottom of the championship table. He didn't exactly have a lot to work with. Warne did well for Rotherham.

Edited August 23, 2023 by Rammy03