Derby County Administration (with the slight possibility of Liquidation still there)

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

2 hours ago, Andicis said:

History? They haven't won anything since the 50's... They have a bigger ground than us, but their support is no better. 

Why should they be one of the greatest teams? What divine right do they have? 

They have great support. Although the whole built up area of Tyneside is very big population wise (much bigger than Derby). Derby is very well supported for the size of the area but Newcastle is another level. 
Having said that, no team has a divine right to do anything and Newcastle could end up being relegated this season although it’s probably unlikely. 

[DerbyGeordie]

8 minutes ago, Andicis said:

For a club that hasn't won a trophy since the 1950's, your fans certainly have delusions of grandeur. You're on a thread about Derby being in administration, I really feel for Newcastle, you've really had it tough. 

Everton have chucked around silly money though. Villa is more understandable as with the sale of Grealish they've brought plenty of money in. Ashley ran Newcastle like a business. Maybe you'd have liked it if he'd have been consistently put money in, but he kept you in a consistently healthy financial position in the Premier League. Your fans make it sound like you've been in a position similar to us. You absolutely haven't. 

Haven't won a trophy since the 50s, yet still 9th most successful club in English football. And I'm not trying to stick it to yous or anything like that, what's happened to Derby County is criminal.

I know, but we had Benitez. Villa are owned by billionaires. And I'm not, I'm just saying that Ashley is a terrible football club owner as I've experienced 14 years of his tenure, and you're saying he isn't and we're deluded for thinking he is.

Edited October 9, 2021 by DerbyGeordie

[Rammy03]

10 minutes ago, Andicis said:

By kicking on and improving, you mean throwing around silly money? Because that's how you do that. 

You can kick on and not throw around silly money. The two things aren't mutually exclusive. 

Leicester spent a total of 25m on Kante, Vardy, Maguire and Mahrez. They sold 3 of them for a total of 172m.

Newcastle spent 40m on Joelinton. Yes. 40 million British pounds. They'd be lucky to get 5m for him.

They are a poorly run football club. Enough said.

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

56 minutes ago, DerbyGeordie said:

Hi all,

Newcastle fan here. Been going to Uni of Derby for 2 years now (in my final year) and after hearing and reading what's went on at the club in the last few years I've grown a bit of a soft spot for DCFC. Saw that you were linked with Ashley taking over, now, I am aware that as a club you're probably in the worst state you've ever been in. Ever. In administration, a potential risk of going into liquidation, absolutely criminal that could happen to your club, as to me its still a good sized club with standing in English football. Ashley seems like a ticket out, financial stability. But, and I have to say after reading some of the posts on here which are terribly incorrect, the man is/was an utter parasite.

Where we were as a club before Ashley was probably where Spurs, West Ham are now. Promoted to the Premier League in 1993, finished 3rd, 6th, 2nd, 2nd, 4th, 3rd, 5th and 7th in the period before Ashley took over, regulars in Europe, played 3 seasons of Champions League football. Won nothing obviously, but we had genuine hope. Ashley takes over in 2007, within 2 years we're relegated. We bounce back due to the quality of the squad we had at the time, stay in the Premier League for another 6 seasons (3 of which were relegation battles) and get relegated again. The second relegation, we had a wage bill the size of a midtable PL club in the Championship and had Rafa Benitez in charge so we bounce straight back again. Since then we've been fighting relegation again, Rafa leaves due to no ambition at the club beyond staying up; his replacement summing up that ambition which even he is making an arse of.

Now I know it's rich to come on here and complain about doing nowt more than staying in the PL given your situation, but this is all relative. Our two promotions Ashley lucked out at the squad and managers present there at the time and we only had to get promoted because of beyond tragic management from Ashley in the first place.

The whole 'he's a good business man' and 'got Newcastle financially sound' is a myth. Part of £300m fee paid for the club from the consortium on Thursday will have partly been made up my interest free loans Ashley took out from the club; taking money out so to speak. Our commerical revenue was greater than Spurs, Everton and West Ham before Ashley took over, now clubs like Brighton & Hove Albion are millions ahead. Across his 14 years his net spend is +£10m which in the PL scheme of things is peanuts.

I see why you may want him, you'd probably take almost anyone and I don't blame yous for that. But he is not a good football club owner and the perception that he was good for us is so far wide of the mark is untrue. He has set us back years and this golden ticket we've been given will see that, as it'll be years until we're on a level footing with Spurs, Everton, West Ham and Villa.

Interesting comments and good to read a Newcastle fan’s opinion. Think Derby fans just want a club to support in years to come . Don’t know if Mike Ashley is interested in Derby or who else is but think fans will welcome anyone at this moment to prevent liquidation. Tough times 

[Andicis]

Just now, DerbyGeordie said:

Haven't won a trophy since the 50s, yet still 9th most successful club in English football. And I'm not trying to stick it to yous or anything like that, what's happened to Derby County is criminal.

I know, but we had Benitez. Villa are owned by billionaires. And I'm not, I'm just saying that Ashley is a poo owner as I've experienced 14 years of his tenure, and you're saying he isn't and we're deluded for thinking he is.

9th most successful club that few people have seen win a trophy.

Having Benitez is completely irrelevant. He ran Newcastle to make a profit, I fail to see anything wrong with that. I wish all clubs were ran that way, football would be much more healthy. 

[Andicis]

2 minutes ago, Rammy03 said:

You can kick on and not throw around silly money. The two things aren't mutually exclusive. 

Leicester spent a total of 25m on Kante, Vardy, Maguire and Mahrez. They sold 3 of them for a total of 172m.

Newcastle spent 40m on Joelinton. Yes. 40 million British pounds. They'd be lucky to get 5m for him.

They are a poorly run football club. Enough said.

Let's be honest though, if it was that easy why don't all clubs do what Leicester have? Because they're an anomaly, and they've had some pretty poor signings too. Those 4 were all amazing signings, no doubt. But would you say Everton are a well run club? They've thrown poo loads of cash around, and haven't really got anywhere. 

The amount of teams that are kicking on without throwing money around is how many? Ultimately you hit a ceiling. Yes Leicester won the Premier League, but they won't get near it again. They've reached their ceiling now, to consistently challenge they'd need to throw cash about. 

Depends how you quantify what is well or badly run. 

[Rammy03]

2 minutes ago, DerbyGeordie said:

Haven't won a trophy since the 50s, yet still 9th most successful club in English football. And I'm not trying to stick it to yous or anything like that, what's happened to Derby County is criminal.

I know, but we had Benitez. Villa are owned by billionaires. And I'm not, I'm just saying that Ashley is a terrible football club owner as I've experienced 14 years of his tenure, and you're saying he isn't and we're deluded for thinking he is.

He is terrible. What has he done? They went down twice during his tenure. Relegation battle practically every season. They've stayed up in spite of Mike Ashley. Poor player recruitment, poor manager recruitment, poor training ground. That club has been doing nothing for years. And when you take into account the history and size of the fanbase, it's shocking. 

Derby fans are giving Ashley credit because Mel Morris has sold us down the river. Just because we've been run like crap doesn't mean Ashley is a great football club operator. Mel Morris was just that bad. We expect an owner to not gamble away the future of our club. 

[Rammy03]

3 minutes ago, Andicis said:

But would you say Everton are a well run club? They've thrown poo loads of cash around, and haven't really got anywhere

No, they're badly run as well. 

[Andicis]

Just now, Rammy03 said:

No, they're badly run as well. 

So again, which clubs do you think are well run, other than Leicester? Are Burnley well run? They're treading water and not investing, like Newcastle, and yet I'd argue all day that they're well run.

[DerbyGeordie]

Just now, Andicis said:

9th most successful club that few people have seen win a trophy.

Having Benitez is completely irrelevant. He ran Newcastle to make a profit, I fail to see anything wrong with that. I wish all clubs were ran that way, football would be much more healthy. 

Still 9th. Doesn't matter when they were, and in the Sky-PL age we've challenged and been regulars in European competitions before him.

It wasn't, Benitez galvanised the club, offered hope and is a top class manager. Look at what he's achieving with Everton having only spent £2m(?). Ashley had the chance to kick on, without spending big and willingly chose not to. 

Perhaps, but when an owner skims off the top to the point where it's to the detriment of the club it's not good. It's only paper talk and I know you'll take almost anyone with the club almost on it's knees but I hope that it isn't Ashley. I don't know if there's anyone else in the running, I hope there is. Someone better.

Anyway, I truly wish you, others on this board and the whole of DCFC nothing but the best, assuming I forget my login details, which I probably will. You should come through this, too much of a standing in the game to not. I hope. 

 

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

7 minutes ago, DerbyGeordie said:

Haven't won a trophy since the 50s, yet still 9th most successful club in English football. And I'm not trying to stick it to yous or anything like that, what's happened to Derby County is criminal.

I know, but we had Benitez. Villa are owned by billionaires. And I'm not, I'm just saying that Ashley is a terrible football club owner as I've experienced 14 years of his tenure, and you're saying he isn't and we're deluded for thinking he is.

Newcastle had a great team in the 90s, regardless of not winning trophies then, they were a fantastic team to watch. Always found the Newcastle support to be passionate. Know a 90 year old Newcastle fan, can have great conversations about football of the 1930s and he remembers top Newcastle aides from decades ago. 

[Rammy03]

4 minutes ago, Andicis said:

So again, which clubs do you think are well run, other than Leicester? Are Burnley well run? They're treading water and not investing, like Newcastle, and yet I'd argue all day that they're well run.

Brighton, Southampton, Leeds, Villa, Burnley, Brentford are all well run clubs. 

The problem with Newcastle is that there has been no clear strategy, unlike the club mentioned above. They have a huge fanbase and with that comes expectation. The club just haven't looked like delivering anything of any substance. They've been relegated twice, close to the drop many times and survived in spite of Mike Ashley. 

[Andicis]

1 minute ago, Rammy03 said:

Brighton, Southampton, Leeds, Villa, Burnley, Brentford are all well run clubs. 

The problem with Newcastle is that there has been no clear strategy, unlike the club mentioned above. They have a huge fanbase and with that comes expectation. The club just haven't looked like delivering anything of any substance. They've been relegated twice, close to the drop many times and survived in spite of Mike Ashley. 

What is Southampton's strategy? Or Brighton's? What have they delivered of substance? Newcastle's strategy was to be stable in the Premier League, which they generally were, they had 2 dips followed by immediate promotion. Not every team gets to be top 6, not every team gets to win trophies. 

[TheresOnlyWanChope]

15 minutes ago, Andicis said:

So again, which clubs do you think are well run, other than Leicester? Are Burnley well run? They're treading water and not investing, like Newcastle, and yet I'd argue all day that they're well run.

Brighton very well run- they’ve been transformed totally. 

[RadioactiveWaste]

On Ashly i can't see it being good beyond the "any port in a storm"/who else we going to get in our state aspect.

but given we're in the storm with every chucking water over the sides with buckets and still the sea creeping colser to side of the decks, i'll take him.

[uttoxram75]

4 minutes ago, Andicis said:

Taking your analogy, you wouldn't be going up to said homeless people and moaning about all the problems with your accommodation though, would you? There is a real chance our club could go under, frankly I think it's slightly insensitive to come on here and moan about Mike Ashley, Mel Morris has done a much worse job here.

By kicking on and improving, you mean throwing around silly money? Because that's how you do that. 

Bit unfair on the Geordie lad really. He is pointing out that Newcastle were a decent premier league outfit before Ashley took over, several years with a top 7 or above finish then once Ashley took over a decline with 2 relegations afterwards.

 

 

[Andicis]

Just now, uttoxram75 said:

Bit unfair on the Geordie lad really. He is pointing out that Newcastle were a decent premier league outfit before Ashley took over, several years with a top 7 or above finish then once Ashley took over a decline with 2 relegations afterwards.

 

 

They'd already declined and were reverting back to mean when they were taken over. The relegations were followed by immediate promotion. 

[uttoxram75]

2 minutes ago, Andicis said:

They'd already declined and were reverting back to mean when they were taken over. The relegations were followed by immediate promotion. 

Ashleys still a bit of a Bamford/Gibson though.

[Ghost of Clough]

Kinda suggests the decline started before he took over.

[atherstoneram]

6 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Might want to double check the populations for both cities

Latest comparable figures per population of the actual cities in 2019 was approx.

Newcastle 300,820

Derby  258,740.

However if you want to include the surrounding areas Chad, Littleover, Alvaston etc and Gateshead, Manors, Byker etc then Newcastle is approx 3 times the population of Derby.