Dean (hick) Saunders Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 5 minutes ago, PistoldPete said: So would you pay top dollar for Norwich , West Brom or Fulham in their biennial tour of Premier league grounds? More than double what you would pay if they were in the Championship? I wouldn't. A bit more but “not a lot” as the little wizard used to say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said: League has a massive impact on a club's value Yes perhaps the admins will do a deal with a buyer that includes a deferred payment if we stay up Edited October 9, 2021 by kevinhectoring Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 2 hours ago, Carnero said: The stadium being held outside the club actually helps us at the moment as without that the club has little in the way of assets to liquidate. The club’s single most valuable asset (so far as we know) is the claim for deferred sale price against the stadium owning company. So not sure what you say is correct Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 We have a value as either a league 1 or league 2 club and a going concern .. The huge question is what is that value and will it exceed what MSD can get for whatever assets it has a lien / first call over. ? If those values as L1 L2 DCFC doesn’t exceed the figures they can get for their share of the fixed assets then we are in serious do do What are the players worth in cash ? …. Given contracts are running down and knowing what we paid for Nathan Byrne values are tumbling … which actually might be good for us What is the Stadium / Moor farm worth This is a hardball game .. I am appalled at how slowly the EFL are working in regard to pints deductions .. we are a member, regardless of administration.. The EFL needs to come clean and play fair or, one could conclude, they are failing protect both their members and the integrity of their competition ! RoyMac5 and Rampage 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 3 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: The club’s single most valuable asset (so far as we know) is the claim for deferred sale price against the stadium owning company. So not sure what you say is correct Where are we on the stadium .. I was under the impression that MSD and Mel owned a chunk each but Mel might have paid off the MSD part ? Is that correct ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram-Alf Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 23 minutes ago, jono said: We have a value as either a league 1 or league 2 club and a going concern .. The huge question is what is that value and will it exceed what MSD can get for whatever assets it has a lien / first call over. ? If those values as L1 L2 DCFC doesn’t exceed the figures they can get for their share of the fixed assets then we are in serious do do What are the players worth in cash ? …. Given contracts are running down and knowing what we paid for Nathan Byrne values are tumbling … which actually might be good for us What is the Stadium / Moor farm worth This is a hardball game .. I am appalled at how slowly the EFL are working in regard to pints deductions .. we are a member, regardless of administration.. The EFL needs to come clean and play fair or, one could conclude, they are failing protect both their members and the integrity of their competition ! They'll wait untill we've acumalated enough points to move up the Championship then hit us with a -9 point deduction r_wilcockson, jimtastic56 and Boycie 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 28 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: The club’s single most valuable asset (so far as we know) is the claim for deferred sale price against the stadium owning company. So not sure what you say is correct I would imagine that has been netted off against rents payable and with MM's loans over the last 3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 15 minutes ago, Carnero said: I would imagine that has been netted off against rents payable and with MM's loans over the last 3 years. But Mel's loans are worthless, as he is an unsecured creditor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 (edited) 34 minutes ago, PistoldPete said: But Mel's loans are worthless, as he is an unsecured creditor. Erm thanks but what has that got to do with anything? MM is writing off any outstanding loans due to him anyway, supposedly. I was actually responding to @kevinhectoring who thought we might be owed money by the stadium company. We likely won't be as that debtor will have been netted off against loans from the stadium company via MM (IE. over the last 3 years, BEFORE we've gone into administration) Edited October 9, 2021 by Carnero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Martin Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 4 hours ago, DCFC Kicks said: 'another club is Derby fold is if it were' 'a team like Man Utd fro' what? DCFC Kicks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 1 hour ago, jono said: Where are we on the stadium .. I was under the impression that MSD and Mel owned a chunk each but Mel might have paid off the MSD part ? Is that correct ? The admins and MSD have total control over the stadium. MM has none. And they told us they will sell the club and the stadium together. So it is a non issue jono 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Carnero said: I would imagine that has been netted off against rents payable and with MM's loans over the last 3 years. Well it’s true we don’t know all of the cashflows until accounts are published. But the rent is a mere £1.?m a year, so no way has that dented the 10s of £millions payable for the stadium. What we don’t know is whether club losses have been funded by paying down the receivable from Gellaw 202; or whether they have been funded from ‘soft loans’ from MM to the club. I’d guess it’s largely the latter. Because the admins are all excited about MM waiving his ‘soft loans’. And because in the famous Samuelson documentary, MM boasted to the football loving world that he could sell the club and later waive legacy loans to boost the FFP position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 1 hour ago, PistoldPete said: But Mel's loans are worthless, as he is an unsecured creditor. I think 25% needs to be repaid under EFl rules, no? Unless he waives them which he has agreed to do. Mel what a guy Dean (hick) Saunders 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 8 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: What we don’t know is whether club losses have been funded by paying down the receivable from Gellaw 202; or whether they have been funded from ‘soft loans’ from MM to the club. I think it'll be both. We'll find out for sure over the coming weeks once the administrators report is available. kevinhectoring 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Carnero said: Erm thanks but what has that got to do with anything? MM is writing off any outstanding loans due to him anyway, supposedly. I was actually responding to @kevinhectoring who thought we might be owed money by the stadium company. We likely won't be as that debtor will have been netted off against loans from the stadium company via MM (IE. over the last 3 years, BEFORE we've gone into administration) Your suggestionwas that we had swapped the stadium for the money we owed Mel. Right now I would rather we owned the stadium, it would be worth more than the cancelled loans, which would have been worthless anyway.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PistoldPete Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 20 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: I think 25% needs to be repaid under EFl rules, no? Unless he waives them which he has agreed to do. Mel what a guy I think we repay what we can. If we are liquidated without a buyer Mel gets nothing anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaspode Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 2 minutes ago, PistoldPete said: Your suggestionwas that we had swapped the stadium for the money we owed Mel. Right now I would rather we owned the stadium, it would be worth more than the cancelled loans, which would have been worthless anyway.. If Mel hasn't put the £80M into the club, then perhaps we still do own the stadium. It's all very well trying to show off how clever you are by getting round FFP, but has he actually paid the club the market value that he claimed? r_wilcockson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 38 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: The admins and MSD have total control over the stadium. MM has none. And they told us they will sell the club and the stadium together. So it is a non issue It’s a conundrum though. The stadium may have some worth as a venue but it’s purpose is for a city football club … but MSD are owed what 19 million ? … they almost won’t care as long as they get their cash back .. they need their 19 million and I suspect stadium plus moor farm in land value is worth that .. so what are they likely to care whether we continue or not Is Derby County post Covid, still awaiting points deductions, worth more than 19 million ? As I read it MSD as the largest creditor get first shout and first dibs. ? Or is there some voting rights thing on offers received ? It is also worth saying that the EFL’s continued foot dragging is damaging a member club without good reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnero Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 17 minutes ago, PistoldPete said: Your suggestionwas that we had swapped the stadium for the money we owed Mel. Right now I would rather we owned the stadium, it would be worth more than the cancelled loans, which would have been worthless anyway.. What we'd rather and what has actually happened are two completely different things unfortunately. If the swap has occurred over the last 3 years (before we went into administration) then that's just where we're at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted October 9, 2021 Share Posted October 9, 2021 56 minutes ago, jono said: It is also worth saying that the EFL’s continued foot dragging is damaging a member club without good reason. Strongly agree with this Seems to be a consequence of the way their board is constituted jono 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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