Champions League Reforms and The Super League

[Olton Ram]

6 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

Don't you sleep??

 

[CWC1983]

All I keep hearing on radio and TV is that this will kill the game for all clubs bar the 6 in England.

No it won't, it will change the game not kill it. 

Yes, the gravy train will stop and agents and players and hangers on will get less money but in my head that's a good thing. 

Hopefully it will stop the demand from fans for the next billionaire owner, the next big money signing etc.

English clubs let the wolves in through the front door and didn't care where the money came from or what the motives behind the investments were. Its not just the big 6 that are culpable here. 

It's a chance for the rest of the clubs to slowly start again, change their financial model and get back to being representatives of the city or area they belong in. 

However, listening to Stave Parish last night my fear is that the other 14 EPL clubs don't want that gravy train stopping any time soon and will bend over backwards to keep the big bad 6 in the EPL.

 

 

[AndyinLiverpool]

1 minute ago, Olton Ram said:

 

I'd love to think that @Andicisis a vampire who, instead of recruiting hoards of chiffon-clad maidens to his army of darkness, keeps nightly watch for football news and posts it on a forum.

[AndyinLiverpool]

How long is the current Sky / BT deal? That's how long clubs have to reset. Run down massive contracts, renegotiate contracts etc.

Those players / staff affected can stay where they are for less or are free to try their luck on the open market.

It's not that difficult.

[Dimmu]

Superleague has to be the best thing what has happened to football in ages. It reveals the true colours of people in the game and the rest of the footballing community can move forward without the greediest ones. Hopefully, Superleague will be founded and I also hope they'll take Sky with them.

Opportunity to clear the sport, bring financial autonomy closer to clubs, make the whole game fairer and move forward, I'd take that.

In the next step game will "only" need equality, some decent refs and then I might actually feel some engagement towards the game again.

[Old Spalding Ram]

Just heard Alan Shearer on the BBC saying that the six breakaway clubs should be thrown out of the Premier League immediately.

There was also talk of players belonging to the twelve clubs being banned from international matches and tournaments.

 

What I want to know is, if this breakaway league takes off and players are banned from tournaments will UEFA have time to update the Panini Euro 2020 sticker collection?

 

...........asking for a little friend!

[richinspain]

44 minutes ago, maydrakin said:

Unfortunately, they’ll have enough cash to stockpile a squad for Europe and a squad for home.  It’s inevitable, otherwise there’ll be calling for a 12 team top tier to prevent burnout for the stars that just have to play too many games.

So an A team and a B team! At least @MuespachRam will be right when he puts an asterisk against future league champions.

[GboroRam]

9 hours ago, sage said:

Klopp and Milner have both spoken against this. I think the ire should be aimed at owners and chief execs, not players, managers and fans of 'big clubs'. 

I can't believe 10% of our fans think this should be allowed. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised with some of the cack you see on this forum.  

I voted in favour. Bring it on. Let the big 6 eat themselves.

Football has been financially broken for as long as I can remember. Maybe from the ashes we will see something that isn't dominated by spending money you don't have. This has potential to save football - real football, not the sanitised Super League "sport", let's call it moneyball as that's all it is. It's clear that us "legacy fans" aren't what they want any more - let them go and create a league that's hugely popular with the armchair viewer. Let the matchday fans enjoy a real sport without their cash destroying everything. 

The only problem will be that the bottom 14 won't want to see their gravy trains derailed - they rely on the gullible "legacy fans" (thanks for that, Super League - I'm going to wear it as a badge of honour) to keep wasting money on their garbage. While we're carrying on paying Sky and BT hundreds per year to watch, and forking out £80 for a nylon shirt, we're still useful to them. We're just not rich enough for the top 6, sadly.

Let it all burn.

[angieram]

9 hours ago, sage said:

Klopp and Milner have both spoken against this. I think the ire should be aimed at owners and chief execs, not players, managers and fans of 'big clubs'. 

I can't believe 10% of our fans think this should be allowed. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised with some of the cack you see on this forum.  

I think the problem is with the stark yes/no choice in the poll.

People may be voting yes in a "kick em out and let's rebuild football" sort of way rather than the "yes, tickle my tummy" option.

[Day]

You know who’s going to profit the most out of all this? 

Lawyers.

Going to be so many legal battles across Europe that the cream of the crop legal teams won’t need to eat Turkey this year for Christmas.

[maxjam]

This is a good listen...

 

[May Contain Nuts]

Allowing the super league to happen in any way, shape or form completely devalues the domestic leagues, making them a shallow & meaningless pursuit.

The indignant 'duck them, let them have it and we'll carry on without them' stance neglects this, the anger fueled rants seem very much a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face too - all that means really is that they get their way, they win, we lose.

Although we'd then try to claim it as some sort of moral victory for us it would be just as hollow as being victorious amongst the competition that remains - that wouldn't matter one jot to them, they couldn't give a duck as they've already made clear.

I'm not actually against kicking these teams out of our league system if it leaves them with nowhere to go - I don't think it's their removal itself that would make the current competitions shallow and meaningless, that's only the case if they're allowed to go on to form a new league and are allowed to lord it over everyone else.

There's absolutely no point kicking them out though if they can immediately find a cushty new home expensively furnished & tailored to suit them, that's no punishment.

The only acceptable outcome for me is for the football authorities, governments etc do everything in their power to ensure that this 'super league' cannot happen.

[ramsbottom]

Yes he's an utter Bamford, but he makes a couple of good points...

https://twitter.com/MsBennyBonsu/status/1384406613822525440?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1384406613822525440|twgr^|twcon^s1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Ffootball%2Flive%2F2021%2Fapr%2F20%2Feuropean-super-league-backlash-builds-against-breakaway-plan-live

[May Contain Nuts]

ps

I am aware that if we remove these clubs from our leagues it's ultimately the fans who pay the price, it would be devastating for them to lose their club. The proposals put forward for this new league are hardly a good thing for them either, the fans of these clubs are being screwed over whatever happens.

[Pearl Ram]

I’m in the kick ‘em out category. It appears to me they want their cake and to eat it. Also, should some of them have a disappointing season...well it doesn’t matter, they’re guaranteed to have their Super League competition to compensate.

What about the West Ham’s or Leicester’s (and hopefully us one day) that finish in what would be a CL qualifying place in today’s game, would they have to wait for the big 12 to have a meeting and vote to see if they are worthy of being allowed to join them in a closed shop competition they earned on merit ?

It stinks. Pearl Ram says kick ‘em out* the league and they can spend their free time practicing for their Super League and swanning around the planet playing exhibition matches to swell their global shirt sales.

*This point of view has nothing to do with Manchester United not showing up against Sheffield United at Old Trafford and losing thus leaving the Blades still on 11 points and still in with a chance of at least equalling our woeful record. Honest ?

 

[JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta]

The problem is clubs like Leicester, Everton, West Ham, Newcastle, Villa etc don't want to cut their cloth accordingly in a more equal landscape, so any thought that we can cut the big six off and make some sort of competitive utopia without them is a non-starter, at least that's how I see it.

The current Premier League clubs are interested in one thing at this point, and that is preserving their slice of the pie and making sure that the pie doesn't get smaller. That's it. They do not care a single iota for the impact this will have on the pyramid below them, they care about the impact this will have on them specifically.

I'd be quite happy to see the six clubs booted out of domestic competition and left to fend for themselves, push six clubs up from the second tier and even out the numbers across the tiers below. The problem is that the 14 Premier League clubs left in the lurch here wont go for it, at least I don't think they will.

[Gaspode]

3 minutes ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

The problem is clubs like Leicester, Everton, West Ham, Newcastle, Villa etc don't want to cut their cloth accordingly in a more equal landscape, so any thought that we can cut the big six off and make some sort of competitive utopia without them is a non-starter, at least that's how I see it.

The current Premier League clubs are interested in one thing at this point, and that is preserving their slice of the pie and making sure that the pie doesn't get smaller. That's it. They do not care a single iota for the impact this will have on the pyramid below them, they care about the impact this will have on them specifically.

I'd be quite happy to see the six clubs booted out of domestic competition and left to fend for themselves, push six clubs up from the second tier and even out the numbers across the tiers below. The problem is that the 14 Premier League clubs left in the lurch here wont go for it, at least I don't think they will.

It depends - unless there is some sort of prize at the end of the season, then the EPL will be a waste of everyone's time. Why would the remaining EPL clubs accept the 'big 6' joining the ESL and thereby being even more finacially dominant at home?

It's hard for the 'smaller' EPL clubs to compete currently but at least there is the carrot of European football for those that can sneak into the top 6 (or even the chance for a tetam like little Leicester to upset the apple cart and win the league occassionally) - once the 6 have the extra financial muscle from the ESL, the top 6 places in the EPL will be a closed-shop and the rest literally have nothing to play for other than to avoid relegation.....

[ramsbottom]

26 minutes ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

The problem is clubs like Leicester, Everton, West Ham, Newcastle, Villa etc don't want to cut their cloth accordingly in a more equal landscape, so any thought that we can cut the big six off and make some sort of competitive utopia without them is a non-starter, at least that's how I see it.

The current Premier League clubs are interested in one thing at this point, and that is preserving their slice of the pie and making sure that the pie doesn't get smaller. That's it. They do not care a single iota for the impact this will have on the pyramid below them, they care about the impact this will have on them specifically.

I'd be quite happy to see the six clubs booted out of domestic competition and left to fend for themselves, push six clubs up from the second tier and even out the numbers across the tiers below. The problem is that the 14 Premier League clubs left in the lurch here wont go for it, at least I don't think they will.

I did think this.  Those teams who're annually the middle tier teams will simply become the new big six.  

Since the formation of the Premier League and the influx of Sky money the game has been an arms race.  Things look like it may reset when ITV digital collapsed, but then Roman came swanning up The Thames on his super yacht and kicked it all off again.  Until steps are made to curtail EVERY clubs spending, and go some way to levelling the playing field, it won't stop.  But because they want to protect their interests, and in Spurs' case, justify having an in house brewery, they need more and more money to break even.  It's getting to the point where the actual first XI are a means to an end to make money, where in an ideal world, it's the other way around.

[AndyinLiverpool]

56 minutes ago, Coconut said:

Allowing the super league to happen in any way, shape or form completely devalues the domestic leagues, making them a shallow & meaningless pursuit.

The indignant 'duck them, let them have it and we'll carry on without them' stance neglects this, the anger fueled rants seem very much a case of cutting off your nose to spite your face too - all that means really is that they get their way, they win, we lose.

Although we'd then try to claim it as some sort of moral victory for us it would be just as hollow as being victorious amongst the competition that remains - that wouldn't matter one jot to them, they couldn't give a duck as they've already made clear.

I'm not actually against kicking these teams out of our league system if it leaves them with nowhere to go - I don't think it's their removal itself that would make the current competitions shallow and meaningless, that's only the case if they're allowed to go on to form a new league and are allowed to lord it over everyone else.

There's absolutely no point kicking them out though if they can immediately find a cushty new home expensively furnished & tailored to suit them, that's no punishment.

The only acceptable outcome for me is for the football authorities, governments etc do everything in their power to ensure that this 'super league' cannot happen.

These clubs need to be saved from their owners

[JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta]

19 minutes ago, Gaspode said:

It depends - unless there is some sort of prize at the end of the season, then the EPL will be a waste of everyone's time. Why would the remaining EPL clubs accept the 'big 6' joining the ESL and thereby being even more finacially dominant at home?

It's hard for the 'smaller' EPL clubs to compete currently but at least there is the carrot of European football for those that can sneak into the top 6 (or even the chance for a tetam like little Leicester to upset the apple cart and win the league occassionally) - once the 6 have the extra financial muscle from the ESL, the top 6 places in the EPL will be a closed-shop and the rest literally have nothing to play for other than to avoid relegation.....

I agree with you, long term it might be better to just rip the plaster off and get rid of them now. I just don't think that's what the current Premier League clubs or the Premier League themselves will allow to happen.

The Premier League as an organisation would have to accept that they will be getting smaller TV deals, Sky would have to accept it, BT would have to accept it, the teams currently in the Premier League would have to accept it. I suspect if it came down to it they will all collectively try and cling on the status quo for as long as possible, regardless of how futile that may prove to be.