v WBA (H) Match Thread

[Gritstone Ram]

On the bright side how many home grown players played today?

[Andicis]

Just now, LittleEatonRam said:

Well I don't think Waghorn is right to blame himself - he shouldn't. Two penalty misses should not be used as means of glossing over the rest of the team who haven't been much better of late. Even golden boy Marriott had a swing and a miss in front of goal in the second half that you'd expect him to at least make contact with.

And I know it's not the same as Keogh, that's why I said reminiscent rather than equal to.

Again, experienced posters such as yourself normally jump down the throat of people who single out players, but when it's a player you choose to single out suddenly it's fine.

No, I criticise people that continuous jump on one player for very little reason. For example, the Keogh criticism, a few years back, posters would criticise Keogh no matter how well he played, we're past that now obviously, but those are the posters I would criticise. I think Waghorn is a good player. I do not think, Waghorn has been playing well though. If people can come up with coherent points around a players performance, it's absolutely fine to single them out. 

Dowell is rightly getting the brunt of most of the criticism, but Waghorn didn't play well, and as such, to question his performance and why he's on penalties is more than reasonable.

[dcfcfan1]

Decent performance, shame not to win it, but it confirms we are a transition team tbh

Cant expect anything more with league 1 wingers and dowell as our main source of creativity

[Highgate]

4 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

I would agree if Waghorn were a good penalty taker, but his penalty technique is very poor because he's not confident enough to go high. If the keeper goes the right way he'll almost certainly save it. And everyone knows (from his track record) that Waghorn's goto penalty is low to the keeper's left because he can hit that harder as a left footer. Every penalty (like today's) placed on the other side (or central) is really underpowered.

We got lucky with the first one but when your penalty taker isn't convincing and has got away with one already, there's no reason to entrust him with another. I knew and the keeper knew he would revert to type. That's why the keeper went left both times today, knowing if it's Waggy's percentage kick. It's easy to rotate Waghorn off penalty duties and maintain his confidence after he's scored and that's what should have happened. It's a win-win situation for Waggy and allows us to switch to a better penalty taker much more likely to score.

Basically I think you're saying Waghorn should have taken the second because he's our designated penalty taker and had already scored. And that's fair enough. I'm saying he shouldn't be on penalties because he's not very good at them, but got lucky the first time and was very unlikely to be lucky twice. 

Yeah, it all makes sense now, I understand where you are coming from.

It's a shame that missed penalties may well have cost us 4 points this season.   Can't be sure of course, who knows how the games would have finished if Waghorn had scored those pens. but it's highly likely to be the case.

 

[NottsRam77]

52 minutes ago, Sexydadbod said:

Lawrence and Dowell are crap. At least with Dowell you can give him the excuse  that he’s young though whereas Lawrence is going to be 26 in January and he still players like a teenager. Laughable that this guy is supposed to be one of the main men on this team, attack after attack breaks down when he has the ball because either he tries to shoot from a ridiculous angle or has rubbish control- he’s making me physically angry watching him.

On a more positive note though, Lowe was excellent. Unfortunate with the penalty but he made a stupid dive so West Brom probably deserved that just for his naivety by diving. His overall game was very pleasing to see, loved his cheeky nutmeg in the first half.

And breathe

Couldn’t have worded it better myself 

Lawrence at one point second half got me a right dressing down from the Mrs cos I just lost it with him, effing and jeffing with the little one in close attendance ... there’s only so many time u can watch the same guy give the ball away cheaply I said to her, trying to give my defence 

oh Lawrence is playing again she said 

sums it up really doesn’t it 

[LittleEatonRam]

3 minutes ago, Andicis said:

No, I criticise people that continuous jump on one player for very little reason. For example, the Keogh criticism, a few years back, posters would criticise Keogh no matter how well he played, we're past that now obviously, but those are the posters I would criticise. I think Waghorn is a good player. I do not think, Waghorn has been playing well though. If people can come up with coherent points around a players performance, it's absolutely fine to single them out. 

Dowell is rightly getting the brunt of most of the criticism, but Waghorn didn't play well, and as such, to question his performance and why he's on penalties is more than reasonable.

Questioning performances and penalty taking ability is fine, and perfectly reasonable. But it's the leap to "he's cost us wins and points" that I'm objecting to.

[Kernow]

I’m not sure what kind of team he’s going to play against Forest but I hope Bogle and Holmes aren’t far away. I think our best starting XI when everyone is fit, based on form is...

Roos

Bogle Keogh Clarke Lowe

Bielik

Holmes Knight

Waghorn Marriott Lawrence

[Andicis]

Just now, LittleEatonRam said:

Questioning performances and penalty taking ability is fine, and perfectly reasonable. But it's the leap to "he's cost us wins and points" that I'm objecting to.

But the leap from missing golden chances to costing points is logical, no? If Waghorn had taken his chances, we would have more points, I don't think that's a huge leap to suggest, and I don't think he thinks that either. I also don't like hugely hyperbolic statements, but in this case, I don't think that's what I'm suggesting. As I said, I think Waghorn is a good player.

[Sparkle]

Roos - a couple of very good saves

lowe - played very well and very sad with the penalty decision against him

Keogh - excellent 

Belick - decent

battman - very decent debut

Huddlestone - needed today with his height and passing if he was quicker he would still be in the premiership 

knight - did very well on full league debut

Dowell - not bad but not great it should come 

Waghorn - did excellent today and covered the full back very well won a penalty scored one missed one 

Lawrence - actually turned up today after the last 2 where he did nothing 

Marriott - well we looked more dangerous with him and he should have scored 

[Andicis]

Love this from Cocu.

[TomBustler1884]

Enjoyed that. Lots to be optimistic about. We're about 2 players short and their names are Bogle and Holmes.

Dowell is struggling, hope he gets some support this week and perhaps a breather.

I dont think we're far away and if you told me we would only have lost one of our first five games I would have been, and am, delighted.

[jono]

Frustrating afternoon. There was great buzz before kick off and we started well. Knight looks very good, Buchannan did ok. He’s strong and brave, took a couple of full blooded knocks and worked his socks off . His positioning is good but crossing needs work. Dowell started ok and looked hungrier but it only lasted for 20 odd minutes. He just doesn’t look sharp enough or strong enough for the role he’s in. He should be a creative engine room but I’m struggling to see it at the moment. We just don’t move the ball fast enough in the middle. Hudds alone is a calming influence but he needs more zip around him. Need Holmes back ASAP. 

Lowe was excellent again; Waggy gave everything, and was up and down the pitch all day so in a sense the peno save was just hard luck. At times he was playing in midfield which felt a bit out of kilter but was necessary I suppose. Either side could have won it late on. I feel a bit flat but patience is the watch word. Cocu is still learning who is who. 

As the Aussies say “she’ll be right mate” 

 

[Kernow]

2 minutes ago, TomBustler1884 said:

Enjoyed that. Lots to be optimistic about. We're about 2 players short and their names are Bogle and Holmes.

Dowell is struggling, hope he gets some support this week and perhaps a breather.

I dont think we're far away and if you told me we would only have lost one of our first five games I would have been, and am, delighted.

Agree with all of this.

August is not the time to be pulling your hair out over results. Very fine margins separate the draws from wins, could easily have gone in our favour.

Our only loss is owed to two ridiculous goals to concede, on another day that would’ve been another point on the board.

[RamNut]

11 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

battman - very decent debut

Are you thinking of Bateman?

 

[Van der MoodHoover]

I’ll try and calm us all down.

in other news, butters has scored his first goal for Luton. 3-0 up at half time......when will we see scores like that for us? ?

[Jimbo Ram]

 Anyway, I thought we played well and feel quite optimistic. Add Bogle and Holmes and from Jan Wayne and I think we will be very competitive......

[Mucker1884]

1 hour ago, Millenniumram said:

Another two points down the drain there. 

I wouldn't consider it 2 points lost/wasted today, either historically, or on today's showing.  A draw was a fair result, regardless of how the goals came about.
I'd always take a point against them.  They've been consistently superior to us for at least two decades now.  Today's draw is not to be sniffed at.

[dcfcfan1]

If we had wayne at the start we would be have 10 pts

If we didnt get wayne at all, we would have been able to get a better winger and maybe another CM

But wayne coming in Jan is the dumbest move ever, we could be 10 pts from top 6 by then

[CWC1983]

First time Ive seen Derby for a full 90 mins this season. 

They look nice and tidy, but there's very little attacking threat. Good scoring chances were few and far between. 

WBA brought on 2 wingers / attacking players that we are crying out for. 

On the plus side, the youngsters didnt look out of place, and Lowe looks so much more confident now that he's had a run of a few games. 

I can see now why Marriott's not started this season. He's lacking a bit of fitness, and is a yard off the pace. He will get better. 

 

 

 

[Millenniumram]

8 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

I’ll try and calm us all down.

in other news, butters has scored his first goal for Luton. 3-0 up at half time......when will we see scores like that for us? ?

We’ll be lucky to see us score 3 goals altogether in a game, yet alone by half time with the “quality” of our midfield and wingers!