Sparkle Posted January 25 Share Posted January 25 2 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: Not so strange Morris might have said: I own the stadium (worth £81m) and I’ll sell it to the purchaser of the club for £40m. Instead, he sold it to DC for £23m. Maguire is making the point that Morris lost a large part of his fortune and - at the end of the day - facilitated the deal with DC. A point that’s lost on most fans Absolutely correct - he caused the problems but could have made them a lot worse if he wanted to, horrible times in so many ways kevinhectoring 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 6 hours ago, kevinhectoring said: Not so strange Morris might have said: I own the stadium (worth £81m) and I’ll sell it to the purchaser of the club for £40m. Instead, he sold it to DC for £23m. Maguire is making the point that Morris lost a large part of his fortune and - at the end of the day - facilitated the deal with DC. A point that’s lost on most fans Bravo MM. It wouldn't have mattered if he sold the ground or not as there was a lease in place for DCFC anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 7 hours ago, kevinhectoring said: Not so strange Morris might have said: I own the stadium (worth £81m) and I’ll sell it to the purchaser of the club for £40m. Instead, he sold it to DC for £23m. Maguire is making the point that Morris lost a large part of his fortune and - at the end of the day - facilitated the deal with DC. A point that’s lost on most fans 7 hours ago, Sparkle said: Absolutely correct - he caused the problems but could have made them a lot worse if he wanted to, horrible times in so many ways Not sure how he could have made it worse for us? He owned a football ground, that was worthless without a team to play in it and had a £23m debt against it which he had personally guaranteed. Even by selling the ground for £1, he was £23m better off than the worse case scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 21 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said: Gellaw 202 (the stadium) and The Club are both owned by Clowes Developments. The £750k is essentially moved from the left hand to the right hand. I believe a 'real rent' has to be paid for P&S purposes. If the last line is correct, which I don't doubt, isnt Clowes missing a trick by not having the ground and the club in the same company, eliminating the rent and giving us more wiggle room for P&S? Or maybe this is his route for getting some return on his investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted January 26 Author Share Posted January 26 It could have been worse! BatRam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 3 hours ago, G STAR RAM said: Bravo MM. It wouldn't have mattered if he sold the ground or not as there was a lease in place for DCFC anyway. Lease rendered void by administration … and there would be plenty of buyers - including Mike Ashley - who wouldn’t dream of buying the club without the stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 43 minutes ago, angieram said: It could have been worse! "Now that looks like a fit and proper person if I ever saw one!" The EFL and Quantuma, presumably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foreveram Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 18 hours ago, RoyMac5 said: Your opinion is just that. Oh hang on lets have another 'who is the best and biggest fan' thread. Who is worthy! 😄 Sorry I can’t seem to find that thread, can you point it out to me. Maybe we could have a “ who is the most negative fan “ I’m sure you’d be on the shortlist 😂 Comrade 86 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted January 26 Author Share Posted January 26 (edited) 12 minutes ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said: "Now that looks like a fit and proper person if I ever saw one!" The EFL and Quantuma, presumably. I don't think he ever did pass the test? But he would have done, if he'd shown evidence of having the money. This is because the EFL can only check whether a potential owner has the money, not how they got hold of it. They aren't the Bank of England and the system is flawed. Quantuma spent more time with him. Should they have smelt a rat? Yes, I suspect they did, but were a bit desperate. Edited January 26 by angieram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBRammette Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 (edited) 12 minutes ago, angieram said: I don't think he ever did pass the test? But he would have done, if he'd shown evidence of having the money. This is because the EFL can only check whether a potential owner has the money, not how they got hold of it. They aren't the Bank of England and the system is flawed. Quantuma spent more time with him. Should they have smelt a rat? Yes, I suspect they did, but were a bit desperate. I think you're being generous. Under anti-money laundering checks you have to ensure you know source of funds not just that someone has funds. People on here and twitter were saying it didnt stack up that that company and he had those funds available from the start. He didnt appear to be but must have been a more sophisticated fraudster than he looked to satisfy AML checks that presumably Goldman Sachs, Quantuma etc used. I think everyone was just so desperate for someone to buy us as they were so under pressure. anyway never mind bullet but huge nuclear bomb dodged. I shudder when I think what position club would be in if he had somehow made those funds transfer. Edited January 26 by CBRammette Addition Crewton, FlyBritishMidland and angieram 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crewton Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 2 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: That'll be a breeze compared to being the owner of DCFC. He doesn't know how lucky he is. i-Ram, Steve How Hard? and Comrade 86 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richinspain Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 1 minute ago, Crewton said: That'll be a breeze compared to being the owner of DCFC. He doesn't know how lucky he is. At least they'll use the soap in the prison. Some on here go straight in! Mucker1884, Steve How Hard?, FlyBritishMidland and 3 others 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted January 26 Author Share Posted January 26 6 minutes ago, CBRammette said: I think you're being generous. Under anti-money laundering checks you have to ensure you know source of funds not just that someone has funds. People on here and twitter were saying it didnt stack up that that company and he had those funds available from the start. He didnt appear to be but must have been a more sophisticated fraudster than he looked to satisfy AML checks that presumably Goldman Sachs, Quantuma etc used. I think everyone was just so desperate for someone to buy us as they were so under pressure. anyway never mind bullet but huge nuclear bomb dodged. I shudder when I think what position club would be in if he had somehow made those funds transfer. Thanks for that, CBRamette. I am no accountant and only know from my involvement at the time that the EFL seemed very limited in what they could check. When you see some of the dodgy owners elsewhere in football, I think their investigatory powers must be somewhat limited. As you say, he conned Goldman Sachs too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 32 minutes ago, Foreveram said: Maybe we could have a “ who is the most negative fan “ I’m sure you’d be on the shortlist 😂 the forum’s eeyore is surely one chop, who somehow expresses the plight-of-the-long-suffering-rams-fan with levity in his pithy posts. Always cheers me up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 3 hours ago, G STAR RAM said: If the last line is correct, which I don't doubt, isnt Clowes missing a trick by not having the ground and the club in the same company, eliminating the rent and giving us more wiggle room for P&S? Or maybe this is his route for getting some return on his investment. I’d guess there are several reasons why they are kept separate. As you point out, one is that it gives him more options on sale it would be interesting tho’ - if he were to sell the stadium to the club - to see what price the club pays for it … Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 23 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: I’d guess there are several reasons why they are kept separate. As you point out, one is that it gives him more options on sale it would be interesting tho’ - if he were to sell the stadium to the club - to see what price the club pays for it … I think it is possible that they have already sold it once to a melco without receiving payment. You would have to know how the third party mortgage worked for more clarity. That valuable asset has been lost to the club unless a current or future owner gifts it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 (edited) It's already gone from twenty to thirty years in the clink for Mr Kirchner then! https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/failed-derby-county-bidder-chris-9058974 Edited January 26 by Stive Pesley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Sagan Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 Here's the American Dept of Justice press release on Kirchner: https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndtx/pr/jury-convicts-slync-founder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted January 26 Share Posted January 26 2 hours ago, kevinhectoring said: Lease rendered void by administration … and there would be plenty of buyers - including Mike Ashley - who wouldn’t dream of buying the club without the stadium. Wasnt aware regarding the lease, thank you. kevinhectoring 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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