The Paul Warne Poll

[Andicis]

1 minute ago, duncanjwitham said:

That's the whole point though.  If we're supposedly restricted on what we can spend, you can't be going out and spending presumably decent wages on Elder, when he struggles to play in the formation you want to use as your main formation for the season.

He struggles to play that formation based on the very few minutes in which the whole team wasn't playing well in that formation? 

[trappatoni]

It's got to be a back 4 from now on surely.   The 532 especially with Ward and Wilson at the club leaves no place for NML and it's difficult to see Barkhuizen playing it.    I think the 433 we could see Wilson as the wide left attacker when NML tires/is injured and ward can play as a progressive RB especially if Elder is more of a traditional LB.

 

Also more difficult tuo o see John Jules starting in a 532 and I do think we are going to need him or at least that type up front just for pace.

[duncanjwitham]

2 minutes ago, Andicis said:

He struggles to play that formation based on the very few minutes in which the whole team wasn't playing well in that formation? 

It's more than a few minutes, he played the whole game against Blackpool there and looked completely lost for one.  Yeah it's still early days, but even if he does figure it out, it still made no sense to sign him to play in a position he's never played before, or to sign him purely for games where we wanted to play a back 4.  

[Andicis]

Just now, duncanjwitham said:

It's more than a few minutes, he played the whole game against Blackpool there and looked completely lost for one.  Yeah it's still early days, but even if he does figure it out, it still made no sense to sign him to play in a position he's never played before, or to sign him purely for games where we wanted to play a back 4.  

I agree, it's early days. So maybe we shouldn't use that as a rod for the manager's back? 

[duncanjwitham]

3 minutes ago, Andicis said:

I agree, it's early days. So maybe we shouldn't use that as a rod for the manager's back? 

It's not just Elder though, is it?  Players being given jobs to do that they seem incapable of doing has been a constant throughout Warne's time here.  We had the whole of last season being told that we couldn't judge Warne because he didn't have his own players, it's not his fault that the players can't do what he needs them to do.  Well now he's got his own players, and they don't seem any better at doing what he needs from them, so it's hard not to be infuriated by the whole thing.  

[Andicis]

6 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

It's not just Elder though, is it?  Players being given jobs to do that they seem incapable of doing has been a constant throughout Warne's time here.  We had the whole of last season being told that we couldn't judge Warne because he didn't have his own players, it's not his fault that the players can't do what he needs them to do.  Well now he's got his own players, and they don't seem any better at doing what he needs from them, so it's hard not to be infuriated by the whole thing.  

He has his own players now, agreed. It also takes time coaching players into formations and getting them to play the way you want, especially with 10 new signings. We've had an indifferent start but seem to be improving. It'll be interesting to see next time he turns to a 5 at the back from the beginning of a game how it looks, however the squad seems to have settled and is playing a winning way. Doesn't seem to be that infuriating to me? 

[Archied]

I agree with @Iram  , we have a manager that some like ( have faith in enough to give time ) some just don’t rate him or like his approach, we will be banging this around the whole of his time here , you pays your money you takes your choice 🤷🏻‍♂️, personally I’m on side with him but that doesn’t mean I’m right and others are wrong , we just see different things , the only thing that is certain is that he won’t be at derby forever , no manager ever is 

Edited August 28, 2023 by Archied

[Ghost of Clough]

2 hours ago, ariotofmyown said:

Well, despite all his inherent faults, he's managed to get us to 1 point off automatic after 5 games.

Maybe "a bunch of new signings that don't seem capable of doing the jobs they were signed for" could be changed to "a bunch of new signings, some of which had a couple of bad performances getting used to a new team".

We've made 10 signings so far this season, with only 1 of them being in the 9 most used (Nelson). 

It's a case of signing a bunch of players to play a certain system, then use the original bunch of players who failed in that system last season instead.

[FlyBritishMidland]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

We've made 10 signings so far this season, with only 1 of them being in the 9 most used (Nelson). 

It's a case of signing a bunch of players to play a certain system, then use the original bunch of players who failed in that system last season instead.

Sorry but you really are trying to make the stats fit your narrative.  Of the 10 signings Vickers was always 2nd choice GK; Elder, Wilson and Washington were either carrying knocks or recovering at the start of the season; Wilson is injured again; Ward was a starter until injury; Waghorn needed fitness due to coming in late (after the first game) and not having a full pre-season; Tyrese and Tyreece were only signed last week and have only been available for one game.  That leaves Bradley who’s started 3 out of 5 league games.

And in terms of appearances, other than Nelson who you’ve mentioned and excluding the cup game as teams always rotate for those, with exception of Bradley, all the new signing have appeared as a starter or sub in all the games they’ve been available.  Those who were carrying knocks have been eased in and now starting.

You make it sound like the other 9 signings haven’t even featured in a match day squad, let alone be on the pitch for any part of the game.

[Andicis]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

We've made 10 signings so far this season, with only 1 of them being in the 9 most used (Nelson). 

It's a case of signing a bunch of players to play a certain system, then use the original bunch of players who failed in that system last season instead.

Elder, Ward, Washington, Waghorn and Wilson have all had injuries. Deliberately misleading data to post. 

[Foreveram]

10 minutes ago, FlyBritishMidland said:

Sorry but you really are trying to make the stats fit your narrative.  Of the 10 signings Vickers was always 2nd choice GK; Elder, Wilson and Washington were either carrying knocks or recovering at the start of the season; Wilson is injured again; Ward was a starter until injury; Waghorn needed fitness due to coming in late (after the first game) and not having a full pre-season; Tyrese and Tyreece were only signed last week and have only been available for one game.  That leaves Bradley who’s started 3 out of 5 league games.

And in terms of appearances, other than Nelson who you’ve mentioned and excluding the cup game as teams always rotate for those, with exception of Bradley, all the new signing have appeared as a starter or sub in all the games they’ve been available.  Those who were carrying knocks have been eased in and now starting.

You make it sound like the other 9 signings haven’t even featured in a match day squad, let alone be on the pitch for any part of the game.

Everything I wanted to say but couldn’t be bothered 😂

[Eddie]

It's really easy for me.

I support the manager until he's gone. That's not to say that I'm a happy clapper - just that I do not feel qualified to judge performance - because it always has to have the caveat "under the circumstances" - and in truth, I haven't a clue what those circumstances are. So I end up grinning and bearing it.

[Ambitious]

3 hours ago, trappatoni said:

It's got to be a back 4 from now on surely.   The 532 especially with Ward and Wilson at the club leaves no place for NML and it's difficult to see Barkhuizen playing it.    I think the 433 we could see Wilson as the wide left attacker when NML tires/is injured and ward can play as a progressive RB especially if Elder is more of a traditional LB.

 

Also more difficult tuo o see John Jules starting in a 532 and I do think we are going to need him or at least that type up front just for pace.

We are still playing with a back three, but the last two games have seen it vary between 3-5-2, 4-3-3 and 4-4-2 in the game. 
 

My interpretation is Wildsmith in goal, back three of Rooney (RCB), Nelson (CB) and Cashin (LCB). Forsyth playing a hybrid LB/LM role, Smith the deep-lying CM, Thompson covering gaps all over (tbh) and Hourihane picking up pockets within the opposition half. NML is playing a RM/RW Role, with Washington and Waghorn both rotating upfront. Waghorn drops deep but sticks in the centre of the pitch, Washington will drift out left and stay high up the pitch. 

It’s a very asymmetrical system, honestly feel that Thompson’s energy is so important to it working. I’m not sure it works with Bird in his place (for example). 

[ariotofmyown]

5 hours ago, i-Ram said:

Time to close this thread/poll methinks. The truth is Warne is the human equivalent of Marmite. Nothing really to be gained keeping this going at the mo. Tastes aren’t going to immediately change. Will be interesting to run it again at the end of October. 

I'm not sure he really is the equivalent of the invented  advertisment campaign for Marmite.

There seems to be a vocal minority who decided straight away they don't like him and/or his football. And this minority has probably grown a bit due to our appalling start to the season (9 points from 15).

There is possibly a smaller minority who thinks he walks on water, but can't recall too many such posts.

Then there seems to be a large, rational element (which naturally includes myself!) that thinks it's probably worth giving him plenty of time to get things right, especially considering the expense to replace him and his team.

Also, I've hardly ever heard him speak and find the while analysis of his comments fairly boring. He could well turn our to be a genius though, continually taking the spotlight away from the players by saying ambiguous things. Like the new Mourinho, minus the bile and bullying.

Ps I quite like Marmite

[alram]

9 hours ago, BOB BIGGS said:

I think DC has referred to a 5 year plan previously. Presumably, he hopes we will be established in the Championship before that but perhaps it’s an indication of where we are financially. 
 

I continue to be totally appreciative of his decision to save the Club and am fully supportive of him. 

i am fully supportive of him but our actions in the transfer market dont really add up to a 5 year plan, most of our signings under DC will be in a zimmer frame in 5 years

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, alram said:

i am fully supportive of him but our actions in the transfer market dont really add up to a 5 year plan, most of our signings under DC will be in a zimmer frame in 5 years

The lengths of the contracts suggest they won't see out the culmination of the five year plan but just help us through the period of restriction inflicted by the EFL agreed business plan.

[Guest]

6 hours ago, i-Ram said:

Time to close this thread/poll methinks. The truth is Warne is the human equivalent of Marmite. Nothing really to be gained keeping this going at the mo. Tastes aren’t going to immediately change. Will be interesting to run it again at the end of October. 

We accept and welcome your concession for the meantime but why are you calling for it to be run again in two months time when there is a clear vote from the majority that they don't want anything before Christmas, if ever? We shouldn't have to put up with it in October just because it might interest you but no one else. What if we are challenging for promotion by then?

Please understand that many of us here have had a torrid time since 2015 with the never ending Brexit, the pandemic, Ukraine,  the quest for another Scottish referendum and our football club being run into the ground. Just as we have passed the anniversary of the saving of our club most of us look forward to some stability if that's possible. It took us eight years to see off Nicola Sturgeon but you want another chance in eight weeks. Have some heart and give us a break 😂.

[BOB BIGGS]

1 hour ago, alram said:

i am fully supportive of him but our actions in the transfer market dont really add up to a 5 year plan, most of our signings under DC will be in a zimmer frame in 5 years

I presume, but don’t know, that he sees it unfolding in 2 or 3 stages. First Stage is to get players in to get back into the Championship, followed by different players to try to consolidate our position. 
 

Only time will tell…

[Wolfie]

1 hour ago, alram said:

i am fully supportive of him but our actions in the transfer market dont really add up to a 5 year plan, most of our signings under DC will be in a zimmer frame in 5 years

So we should only sign players who’ll still be with us in 5 years time? On our budget? With fans wanting quick promotion? OK. 

[RoyMac5]

6 minutes ago, Wolfie said:

So we should only sign players who’ll still be with us in 5 years time? On our budget? With fans wanting quick promotion? OK. 

Well the last two incomers seem a better 'middle ground' but obvs there's not many of them about.