Derby v Man City U21s Matchday Thread

[Tamworthram]

14 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

It's endemic in football, They are taught this in training...why...it's all about the £s.

Am I right in that Man City first called this game off as they couldn't get a team together?, If yes, It shows money and who you are gets what you want.

Derby County had to play their under 18 team in the 3rd round of the FACup a few years back, As Covid had gripped the players, We asked for a postponement...it was refused.

Yes different rules for different comps...but it still stinks of £££££s

From memory, I don’t think City “called off” the original tie. Derby agreed to postpone it. Perhaps more evidence that we weren’t that bothered about the competition.
Whilst I agree the FA cup incident was a bit of a farce, the difference then was that it might have been difficult to fit a rearranged game in before the next round (especially allowing for a potential replay) whereas there was plenty of time for this game to be delayed.

[Ghost of Clough]

5 minutes ago, jimtastic56 said:

Respect your opinion , but I think Plymouth would beat them because City were so bad at defending corners. Apart from Foden I can’t remember many players coming through the academy for them. I suspect most of their players last night will end up in the Championship.The best way to stop their winger last night would be to cut off the supply of thru balls.

Foden, Sancho, Romeo Lavia, Bazunu and Edodie (Southampton), Angelino (Hoffenheim), Iheanacho, Adarabioyo, Lukas Nmecha (Wolfsburg), Brahim Diaz (AC Milan), Eric Garcia (Barcelona), David Brooks, Harwood-Bellis (Burnley), Matondo (Rangers)

Schmeichel, Trippier, Boyata, Denayer, Ben Mee

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

3 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

Wow. That must be some of record. More than 2 hours (as far as I can see) after the match before any blamed the ref for our defeat. ?

The Port vale one

[Ram-Alf]

34 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

From memory, I don’t think City “called off” the original tie. Derby agreed to postpone it. Perhaps more evidence that we weren’t that bothered about the competition.
Whilst I agree the FA cup incident was a bit of a farce, the difference then was that it might have been difficult to fit a rearranged game in before the next round (especially allowing for a potential replay) whereas there was plenty of time for this game to be delayed.

Man City must have then called the EFL/DCFC for an agreement on a postponement?

DCFC are playing more games this season than the season when the FA Cup was played irrespective of whether a replay would have happened...so for there being plenty of time for this game to be played is a bit of a tall story...imo.

 

[GenBr]

57 minutes ago, jimtastic56 said:

Respect your opinion , but I think Plymouth would beat them because City were so bad at defending corners. Apart from Foden I can’t remember many players coming through the academy for them. I suspect most of their players last night will end up in the Championship.The best way to stop their winger last night would be to cut off the supply of thru balls.

It takes time to develop academy players and they haven't be owned by the petro state for all that long. You will start to see players coming through now that have been training in the overhauled academy for 10+ years. Not many have reached the man city first team yet, but they are doing far better than our vaunted academy - better quality of players and they made a good amount of money from academy sales last year.

 

[Tamworthram]

10 minutes ago, Unlucky Alf said:

Man City must have then called the EFL/DCFC for an agreement on a postponement?

DCFC are playing more games this season than the season when the FA Cup was played irrespective of whether a replay would have happened...so for there being plenty of time for this game to be played is a bit of a tall story...imo.

 

It's not a tall story at all. The knock out stages don't begin until the 30th November (as I understand it). So, whilst this may be a little tight it's like not like the FA cup where the 4th round was played just two weeks after the 3rd round. (I know the Southampton v Shrewsbury game was postponed but perhaps Shewsbury literally didn't have enough players to field a team at all).

Also, don't forget, Man City were asking the EFL (and it would seem we agreed) whereas we would have been asking the FA (seems unlikely but maybe we asked and Chorley objected) - different organisations. 

I'm fairly confident that if we'd objected then the original game against Man City would have gone ahead with whatever team they could field.

[Crewton]

11 minutes ago, GenBr said:

It takes time to develop academy players and they haven't be owned by the petro state for all that long. You will start to see players coming through now that have been training in the overhauled academy for 10+ years. Not many have reached the man city first team yet, but they are doing far better than our vaunted academy - better quality of players and they made a good amount of money from academy sales last year.

 

Who did they sell from their Academy last year? Jack Harrison to Leeds is the only one that springs to mind, but they have so many players going through their Group clubs it's hard to keep track.

[jono]

One Laugh I had was, with the stadium so relatively empty, the players could hear individual fans. I shouted to Loach “Scotty give us wave” and he did ?. For certain the linesman on the east stand side registered …. ahem …. the group disapproval of his decisions ! 

[kevinhectoring]

2 hours ago, DavesaRam said:

 it was that one decision to not give a free-kick for the foul that swung the game. The ball broke through for roadrunner to score, and our heads went down straight away. Game over.

Roberts made the initial error, a poor pass that put Collins immediately under pressure. Collins is very slow to adjust, he’s weak in the tackle and he’s lost the ball before he’s fouled.  
We deserve what we get after that catalogue of errors 

Edited October 19, 2022 by kevinhectoring

[Ghost of Clough]

36 minutes ago, Crewton said:

Who did they sell from their Academy last year? Jack Harrison to Leeds is the only one that springs to mind, but they have so many players going through their Group clubs it's hard to keep track.

Angelino to Leipzig and Nmecha to Wolfsburg for £30m. Garcia left on a free

This summer, Southampton paid£35m for Bazunu, Romeo Lavia, Larios and Edozie. Gyabi went to Leeds for £5m

[jimtastic56]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Foden, Sancho, Romeo Lavia, Bazunu and Edodie (Southampton), Angelino (Hoffenheim), Iheanacho, Adarabioyo, Lukas Nmecha (Wolfsburg), Brahim Diaz (AC Milan), Eric Garcia (Barcelona), David Brooks, Harwood-Bellis (Burnley), Matondo (Rangers)

Schmeichel, Trippier, Boyata, Denayer, Ben Mee

When I said “For them” I meant into the Man  c first team. Any of the currant regulars besides Foden?

[Ghost of Clough]

11 minutes ago, jimtastic56 said:

When I said “For them” I meant into the Man  c first team. Any of the currant regulars besides Foden?

Cole Palmer has been in 14 of their match day squads. Rico Lewis (who was last night's RB) has been in 13, Wilson-Esbrand (last night's LB) has been in 12.

[Oldben]

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/derby-county-warne-paul-board-7720666

After the game pw has come out and said, he needs 18 to 20 players, assuming that includes the 14 that were signed in the summer.

He says he needs to improve the defense and he lacks the wing backs for 352 system he likes to play.

There's some time to go before the January transfer window opens and I'd ask the question, why play 352 against man city, if he knew we didn't have the strength in depth to pull that off.

If he had to have 3 at the back, then why not play 343. We wouldn't have needed the wing backs in that formation.

We have the wingers that might have helped.

As I linked to an earlier article, that article says that free agents are OK, but they tend to be the wrong side of 30. They tend to know the style of play they like to play and don't wish to adapt their style of play at their age.

They know that the club signing them is giving them a final pay day, because this is probably their last hurrah. They know their new clubs unlikely to find a buyer for them when they come to the end of their contracts with the club.

These older players are not as fast as they once were, even if they still have the footballing brain.

Derby has still signed some great free agents over the summer, but as I said thru might want to play the pw way, or have the speed to play the counter attack football that 352 is generally used for.

 

[Ghost of Clough]

10 minutes ago, Oldben said:

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/derby-county-warne-paul-board-7720666

After the game pw has come out and said, he needs 18 to 20 players, assuming that includes the 14 that were signed in the summer.

He says he needs to improve the defense and he lacks the wing backs for 352 system he likes to play.

There's some time to go before the January transfer window opens and I'd ask the question, why play 352 against man city, if he knew we didn't have the strength in depth to pull that off.

If he had to have 3 at the back, then why not play 343. We wouldn't have needed the wing backs in that formation.

We have the wingers that might have helped.

As I linked to an earlier article, that article says that free agents are OK, but they tend to be the wrong side of 30. They tend to know the style of play they like to play and don't wish to adapt their style of play at their age.

They know that the club signing them is giving them a final pay day, because this is probably their last hurrah. They know their new clubs unlikely to find a buyer for them when they come to the end of their contracts with the club.

These older players are not as fast as they once were, even if they still have the footballing brain.

Derby has still signed some great free agents over the summer, but as I said thru might want to play the pw way, or have the speed to play the counter attack football that 352 is generally used for.

 

He said he needs a very good core squad of 18/20 players. Some of those 14 won't be part of that.

352 and 343 both use 'wing backs'. That's our Mendez-Laing and Barkhuizen. Roberts and Forsyth aren't wing backs. Oduroh isn't ready.

352 is Warne's formation, and he used it last night to see if some of those players are good enough in that system. Using something else may have got a different result, but wouldn't tell him if a certain player can play in a certain role.

[May Contain Nuts]

21 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

352 is Warne's formation, and he used it last night to see if some of those players are good enough in that system. Using something else may have got a different result, but wouldn't tell him if a certain player can play in a certain role.

The vast majority of the forum could have told him, for free, that certain players on our books won't suit certain roles in his preferred system.

Rather than wasting a game proving to everyone what should already have been quite obvious, he should have just joined up and done a poll! ??

[Ghost of Clough]

3 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

The vast majority of the forum could have told him, for free, that certain players on our books won't suit certain roles in his preferred system.

Rather than wasting a game proving to everyone what should already have been quite obvious, he should have just joined up and done a poll! ??

Even Davies forced his way back into Cocu's possession based side in the end.

[May Contain Nuts]

21 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Even Davies forced his way back into Cocu's possession based side in the end.

He did, but from memory only really on the back of some poor form when Cocu started to drop his beliefs and yield to popular opinion. The start of the end for him, really.

I think Davies' lack of passing ability has always been overstated anyway. People clinging onto the memory of Keogh and pretending you need to maraud up the pitch and be involved 50-60 yards away from your goal to be a CB in a good footballing side. HisHe was fine last season, and we played some good stuff.

Talking of Keogh, i didn't realise he was at Ipswich. Hopefully he plays on Friday (probably unlikely), it'd be fun to see him trying to keep up with Osula!

Edited October 19, 2022 by Kokosnuss

[jono]

28 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Cole Palmer has been in 14 of their match day squads. Rico Lewis (who was last night's RB) has been in 13, Wilson-Esbrand (last night's LB) has been in 12.

I haven’t followed their lineups in the other games. Are you saying we got their creme de la crème while Mansfield got the second string ? It certainly felt like it !
No denying City played well. Buzzing around us and working together. The more I think about it the more I reckon we gave a reasonable account of ourselves. We did create chances and for a neutral it must have been an lively and interesting game. We just looked less polished in the first touch department and a few percentage points slower to react - regardless of players ages. There was no lack of effort or intent. 

[alram]

15 hours ago, Crewton said:

Last time I looked, we WERE a L1 side, and THAT other team was the U23 team of the richest club in the world. 

Get a sense of perspective. We made 10 changes from Saturdays starting line up and we have a much more important game on Friday and another next Tuesday. 

i am not complaining about that. just that's it's an eye opener at wher we are as a club.

 

i dont care if it's the u23 side of the richest club, it's still an u23 side which a team of senior players should beat. most of them in that team won't go on to play prem football.

[RoyMac5]

4 hours ago, Ian Buxton's Bat said:

I was really impressed with Man City last night. Best team we've played this year IMO.

They play the same way from tiny kids to 1st team and know exactly what they're doing, exactly where their mates will be when they play a pass and, let's be honest, are just superb, technically brilliant footballers. Didn't one of them play in the Champions league a couple of weeks ago?

If we could get pretty much any of them on loan in Jan then they'd improve our squad.

Thought the lads did OK last night - I'm not sure how you set up to deal with Usain Bolt style pace but we weren't set up to deal with it. Felt sorry for Rooney, who was exposed by the system / lack of support from Odhuro or DMs.

Two of their goals were ‘long balls’ run onto by ‘Usain Bolt’. How does that make them impressive? Odhuro was let down by lack of midfieldsupport. Thomson was awful, most of his passes were poor and he ran around aimlessly - unpopular to say I’m sure. The third was a deflection. 

It wasn’t our first team and some of our youngsters matched theirs.

For me I don’t want to loan any more young players, we need experience.