Matchday Thread - Derby County vs Plymouth Argyle (03/09 15:00)

[sage]

10 minutes ago, Papahet said:

It was like playing with ten men second half.

 

Any (rare) long kick Wildsmith upfield Fozzy failed to win, he's was getting run ragged and this is when Robert's should've come on for him rather than bring Thompson (baffled at that BTW ).

Also feel Hourihane is untouchable,  nowhere near the player he was at Villa and Barnsley,  another player who looks shattered after a hour or so. His corners are dire, his passing gets very sloppy midway through - needs a major kick up the arse because he's normally so technically gifted on the ball.

I wouldnt have brought Thompson on. I would agree that Hourihane seems untouchable but would add that we had already taken off almost all experienced players 

Would disagree about Fozzy. 

[jono]

1 hour ago, DavesaRam said:

That was a terrific game of football for the neutrals. 

But I'm not a neutral! In many ways it was disappointing, mainly because we shoudn't lose from 2 - 0 ahead. And unlike many I thought we at least matched them in the first half. I expected them to give us a tough game, and they proved to be the best visiting team we have seen at Pride Park this season. They had a couple of good chances in the first half, but we had more chances than we took as well. 

For a change we started the second half pretty well, but their first goal threw a spanner in the works. It gave Plymouth a lift, and knocked us back. Rosenior's substitutions did make a difference, and I like a few on here am baffled by the way Sibley is being used, or more likely misused. At last we have a manager who has responded to seeing him at his best in his best position. And yet again, we have a manager who blathers on about people earing their shirt, and keeping by how they perform, and then contradicts his words but dropping the guy after a string of good performances. And instead of putting him in McGoldrick's place, he stuck him out wide, despite numerous previous managers proving that doesn't work. Having said that, Sibley started poorly today, and didn't achieve much until we were pushing on at the end, when he started running the ball into the area. At least twice he could have gone down over the challenges being made on him in the area, but his maturity is showing through because he chose not to. Or he decided that the only players who get free-kicks for going down at the slightest of contacts play for the opposition. 

I am not surprised that McGoldrick got substituted, because he was running around flat out for most of the time he was on the pitch. He put a huge amount of effort in, to the point that I was worried he was going to injure himself by pushing too hard too soon. He actually played really, really well. Hourihane continues to disappoint. He has the air of someone the game revolves around, but unfortunately it doesn't revolve very far. Maybe we put Rooney in at DM, and push Max Bird into Hourihane's position.

I had started to call Erin "King Cashin", especially for his first half performance, so his sloppy mistake for the winning goal was rather a shame. NML's goal was genius in actin. There was nothing there when he got the ball o the edge of the box with almost the entire defence in front of him. But like a thief in the night he silently picked several locks and got past all their defences to go clear on goal. A superb effort, to follow the most satisfying goal at Pride Park for ages! The crowd response to him was tremendous!

And although Plymouth's first goal knocked the stuffing out of us, and the substitutions didn't help, the match officials played their part as well, and I have to disagree with Jono on this. I am not clutching at straws. The ref had been fairly even-handed in the first half, but there was a deja-vue feel in the second half, where it had the appearance of the ref having had his regulation bollocking from the EFL for being even-handed. Just when we were trying to play our way back into the match, we went into a 10 - 15 minute period where we only had to breathe on a Plymouth player for a free-kick to be awarded. McGoldrick was booked for what was his first foul, and it wasn't for a cynical, professional foul to prevent an attack, because it just outside the Plymouth area. Very harsh. We had the bizarre situation where a clear foul on a Derby player just inside our half saw the free-kick be awarded to Plymouth, and then re-awarded to Derby. We had two attacks where we were clean through on goal, only for the ref to pull play back for a free kick, with no advantage played. And we had Osula, who looks good, won the ball and was in on goal only for the ref to blow for a free-kick. Apparently Osula having his shirt pulled off his back is a foul on the Plymouth defender! There were lots more, and it all had the effect of making sure we didn't get back into our stride.

In the end, though, cutting out sloppy mistakes, and a bit of "Row Z" technique to see the game out would have made a huge difference today, and we could have had a great result against a very good side, who thankfully didn't result to the usual bus-parking or thug football. And the unity in the crowd is great to see - singing is starting to come from all around the ground, and the bounce virus is starting to spread a swell, even into the North stand, and the boxes! Keep it up, you fans!

Your right, the ref was rubbish in the second half, I went an interesting shade of purple after the William FK and the McGoldrick booking. I said clutching at straws because I was trying to sound mature and grown up .. but I’m not really, I was fibbing and furious. Did I miss see the offside for second ?  My memory / perception is that their player was a good 3 yards the wrong side.

First half was evens but we took our chances and Wildsmith saved well. The second half we were off it, they were hungrier and won it, but they didn’t deserve a 3-0 second half win anymore than we deserved to be 2 up in the first. 

[Chesterfield_Ram]

Was there first offside as well? I haven’t brought myself to relive it through any highlights yet. My first impression was that Whittaker was in an offside position (I didn’t have an ideal viewing position to tell for certain) before the ball *hit* a derby defender. In real time I didn’t think the derby player played the ball, rather it hit him before rebounding to Whittaker. As far as my previously confident understanding of the offside rule was I thought a defender had to play the ball for the effort not to be counted as a pass from the attacking side. I’m probably wrong though just want/need someone to tell me really.

However, I really don’t think we can blame the referee for the result as both sides lost out on decisions. Hourihane could have been booked for time wasting and the numerous times a derby player knocked it out of play then we got the throw in or goal kick. Also Plymouth we’re the better team and looked far more dangerous especially in the second half.

[Guest]

It’s pretty simple really. The kid Oduroh is a natural RB. Just play him there and get Knight where he belongs.

Major overthinking at play. 

[lukedcfc]

A lot of teams will try and do what Plymouth did today, they were brave and got a deserved win. We move on. 

[ariotofmyown]

Thought we actually started the 2nd half well today and looked like we were gonna get the 3rd in no time. Their lucky first goal really inspired them and they deserved their win.

Whilst we certainly didn't play well, we had some opportunities to create great chances down the left hand side. I think Connor, Sibley and Forsyth all guilty of been too slow to get the ball across goal.

Big moment also when our new loan striker was penalised when their last man went down. Looked like a certain goal if the ref hadn't blown.

Ah well, was a pain we lost but can't win them all. Their new signing who scored 2 goals looked quick and hungry. Think the Plymouth fans enjoyed their day out!

[sage]

8 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

Thought we actually started the 2nd half well today and looked like we were gonna get the 3rd in no time. Their lucky first goal really inspired them and they deserved their win.

Whilst we certainly didn't play well, we had some opportunities to create great chances down the left hand side. I think Connor, Sibley and Forsyth all guilty of been too slow to get the ball across goal.

Big moment also when our new loan striker was penalised when their last man went down. Looked like a certain goal if the ref hadn't blown.

Ah well, was a pain we lost but can't win them all. Their new signing who scored 2 goals looked quick and hungry. Think the Plymouth fans enjoyed their day out!

If you get to see the Forsyth one again, he has to delay the cross as the CF is offside 

[ariotofmyown]

28 minutes ago, sage said:

If you get to see the Forsyth one again, he has to delay the cross as the CF is offside 

Might be another one, sure he had 2 or 3 good positions attacking on the left when he delayed.

[sage]

5 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

Might be another one, sure he had 2 or 3 good positions attacking on the left when he delayed.

I was referring to the most striking one, the late one 

[Edtheram]

Probably going to annoy a lot of forum members here but Max Bird is no captain the guy doesn’t talk. Him and hourihane in midfield were a joke neither can make a tackle. Thompson is also a league standard below this one, he was awful when he came on. Poor subs cost us this one at 2-0 up. Plymouth by far the better team though.

[Mucker1884]

10 hours ago, ck- said:

Well we’ve been saying all season that we need to make our away form match our home form. 
looks like we’ve cracked it.

As I’m away on hols playing catch up, I was just about ready for binning my latest holiday read, but this cheered me up… or at least caused a titter. 
Thanks!  ??

[SK47]

There's 2 teams on the planet I hate more than anyone. Leeds and Plymouth Argyle, so to lose to them custard churning pasty fillers after being 2-0 up gives me absolute nightmares.

 

I hope LR learns from this in regards to game management, I reckon he will. Too many people quick to turn on the manager when the players mess up. Its not LR fault that the players cant shut out a 2 goal lead considering the standard of players we have. Although we are definitely in need of Knight in the middle of the park and a natural rb, however I'm stilI unsure Oduroh is the answer defensively.

 

I also feel we missed Korey Smith coming on to give us a bit of transitional energy. Strong in tackles and turning it over. Bird is good once he's got the ball, but Korey is that all round cm you need in this league.

 

Overall, fuming still with the result, I hope this is a wakeup call needed for the players to not switch off in future. Gonna go and hide from anything Derby and Plymouth Argyle related until Tuesday/Saturday.

 

Thanks for ruining my weekend away with the family.

 

COYR

[Rich3478]

6 hours ago, Edtheram said:

Probably going to annoy a lot of forum members here but Max Bird is no captain the guy doesn’t talk. Him and hourihane in midfield were a joke neither can make a tackle. Thompson is also a league standard below this one, he was awful when he came on. Poor subs cost us this one at 2-0 up. Plymouth by far the better team though.

It was really weak in midfield wasn’t it, like bird but some days is hard to see what he achieves. Can be far too safe with his passing too. Him and hourihane have no physicality at all. Or legs to break from midfield either.

Agree on Thompson too.

[DavesaRam]

11 hours ago, PistoldPete said:

As our chief ref complainer I am surprised you didn't mention that their second goal was offside. 

I mean it looked it in real time (clearly in an offside position when he scored) , and having seen the replay I think pretty clear he looked offside when the ball was played too. 

I couldn’t tell from the South Stand, but was clearly offside in the highlights.

[HorsforthRam]

Bird may not be the greatest speaker but he certainly won’t stop others from doing so. Yesterday there was a collective collapse from the players 

[sage]

30 minutes ago, DavesaRam said:

I couldn’t tell from the South Stand, but was clearly offside in the highlights.

I think he was off but its not by a massive margin. 

Follow the line of the grass cut from when the ball is played. He is about a foot ahead of the ball. 

Cosgrove was quicker than Cashin for the last two goals 

 

[roboto]

10 hours ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

The Substitutions were wrong also. He brings Sibley on, but leaves no one up front for him to play off.

Collins was still up top when Sibley came on, then Osula came on to replace Collins a little while later.

The substitutions weren’t great but I don’t think we can let Sibley off the hook because of formation. McGoldrick was simply much more effective today and we lost control of the midfield when he went off. Sibley should’ve been an outlet for the midfield, but was ineffective once again.

Thompson had a nightmare and I feel that Rooney is currently a better option for DM cover on current form as well as being more imposing physically.

Those first two subs (Sibley and Thompson) were the turning point in my opinion.

[PistoldPete]

53 minutes ago, DavesaRam said:

I couldn’t tell from the South Stand, but was clearly offside in the highlights.

Well as Sage has pointed out it wasn't as clear cut as it seemed with the naked eye.. attacker was well ahead of the defender but the ball was only just behind the line of the attacker so only just offside.  Would have been ruled out by VAR. 

[jono]

10 hours ago, Diego said:

It’s pretty simple really. The kid Oduroh is a natural RB. Just play him there and get Knight where he belongs.

Major overthinking at play. 

It is a good point. I like the look of Oduroh. He looks able. Maybe not spectacular but he sticks at it and isn’t shy. I’d like to think Liams reasoning is gentle introduction and using his squad. Anyway, he can do the job, he’s young and at this point is only going to improve. 

[GB SPORTS]

26 minutes ago, sage said:

I think he was off but its not by a massive margin. 

Follow the line of the grass cut from when the ball is played. He is about a foot ahead of the ball. 

Cosgrove was quicker than Cashin for the last two goals 

 

First goal looks if Knight is playing Whittaker onside, the second looks offside, though not by a huge amount.