Get him gone.

[nottingram]

Just now, Jimbo Ram said:

Might confuse the players though, Mac talking about offensive attacking football and nonsense about aiming to score more goals than them....

Ah yes very true, let us not forget that all these players are so awful despite the fact a few of them were part of a team who reached the play off final two years ago and most of them were part of a team who finished 10th last season. Let us also not forget that Rooney was only allowed to sign half a new team on deadline day and not a whole new team. He cannot be expected to do any better.

[Chris_Martin]

 

30 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

No, it wasn't - what I said was that we have a history of sacking managers.

your exact words" we are poison to any managerial career."

?

 

 

3 hours ago, BaaLocks said:

Since we have been relegated Derby have had twelve managers (not counting caretakers and interims like Hutchings, Powell and Lowe). More than half those games have been Clough and McLaren. Since Tim Ward only four managers (Smith, Rowett, McLaren and Lampard) have left of their own accord. This century Todd, Gregory, Brown, Jewell and Pearson have a worse PPG return than Rooney. Put plainly, we are poison to any managerial career.

 

[bcnram]

I am concerned about the manager as the results determine any managers security. 
My bigger concern is Marshal diving over the top of a shot, Byrne passing directly to one of the opponents for a goal, Wisdom having a lie down and losing the ball for another goal. Lawrence giving a forward a free header for another goal, Clarke letting his man go for another goal. The goal conceding list goes on and on and on. Error after error. These age not to do with how they are set up, this is all about senior players not doing their job. Their concentration levels are pathetic, they should in most cases not have been recruited. 
whether we stay up or get relegated, the players, the poor recruitment, the inability of Mel to move on are issues beyond the managers immediate control. 
 

or the short version:

changing the manager (if we did), solves nothing on its own. 
 

[BaaLocks]

8 minutes ago, nottingram said:

Well firstly I’ll make the assumption that McClaren isn’t working for us pro bono which I think is a safe assumption.

My suggestion is therefore that as we are paying them all anyway we pay messrs Rooney and Rosenior to tend their own gardens, for the time being, at an extra cost of £0. We then ask Mr. McClaren, assisted by Mr. Wassall to temporarily take charge of first team affairs to the end of the season, at an extra cost of £0. Hopefully they keep us up, this might allow us to use the difference between prospective Championship income and prospective League One income to come to a more permanent arrangement whereby Mr. Rooney can remain at home in Cheshire while we hire a proper manager, like we should’ve done in November. If we go down, so be it. We were going down anyway and I refuse to believe he will be kept on if we do go down. So nothing lost.

I agree it may well be too late to do anything to arrest the slide now, but it wasn’t too late even 10 days ago. 

I don't know what Mac's deal is with us so we'll go with your assumption.

Y'think Mel's lawyers are going to let that happen? Constructive dismissal, breach of contract, besmirchment of character and so on and so on. Ooh, that one is going to be very nasty and I can't think of another time in football when that's happened, never mind worked. I can't even think of another time when a manager has been sacked with two games to go.

Look it's great you guys (or girls, excuse me either way) think it's all just 'ah well, throw another million at it, after all we need to stay up' but it likely just isn't that simple. 

And, to be clear, I'm not saying for one second that Rooney is my first choice, even a preferred option here and now. But the moment has passed to do anything about it for this season. It's done, it's just in the fate of the stars as to whether or not we are slightly less rubbish than two other teams.

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

13 minutes ago, nottingram said:

Well firstly I’ll make the assumption that McClaren isn’t working for us pro bono which I think is a safe assumption.

My suggestion is therefore that as we are paying them all anyway we pay messrs Rooney and Rosenior to tend their own gardens, for the time being, at an extra cost of £0. We then ask Mr. McClaren, assisted by Mr. Wassall to temporarily take charge of first team affairs to the end of the season, at an extra cost of £0. Hopefully they keep us up, this might allow us to use the difference between prospective Championship income and prospective League One income to come to a more permanent arrangement whereby Mr. Rooney can remain at home in Cheshire while we hire a proper manager, like we should’ve done in November. If we go down, so be it. We were going down anyway and I refuse to believe he will be kept on if we do go down. So nothing lost.

I agree it may well be too late to do anything to arrest the slide now, but it wasn’t too late even 10 days ago. 

If we do that though Rooney will pack up his fisher price toys and storm off - he won't like sharing. He won't come back.

Oh hold on a minute.  Get him one of those little spades and give him something indestructible to plant like a bamboo, nothing to taxing we don't want hysterics.

[BaaLocks]

8 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

 

your exact words" we are poison to any managerial career."

?

 

And your defence against that statement, other than just arguing for the sake of it, is to cite a bloke that has ended up frozen out of training at a club four points above the relegation zone in the Championship. OK, no holes in that one.

[Jimbo Ram]

10 minutes ago, nottingram said:

Ah yes very true, let us not forget that all these players are so awful despite the fact a few of them were part of a team who reached the play off final two years ago and most of them were part of a team who finished 10th last season. Let us also not forget that Rooney was only allowed to sign half a new team on deadline day and not a whole new team. He cannot be expected to do any better.

Yes, he is doing his best ?

[nottingram]

2 minutes ago, bcnram said:

I am concerned about the manager as the results determine any managers security. 
My bigger concern is Marshal diving over the top of a shot, Byrne passing directly to one of the opponents for a goal, Wisdom having a lie down and losing the ball for another goal. Lawrence giving a forward a free header for another goal, Clarke letting his man go for another goal. The goal conceding list goes on and on and on. Error after error. These age not to do with how they are set up, this is all about senior players not doing their job. Their concentration levels are pathetic, they should in most cases not have been recruited. 
whether we stay up or get relegated, the players, the poor recruitment, the inability of Mel to move on are issues beyond the managers immediate control. 
 

or the short version:

changing the manager (if we did), solves nothing on its own. 
 

But this is all a bit simplistic.

Yes, players are making errors, but players will always make errors. Some of it is individual concentration, some of it is organisation. There’s a reason Warnock et al are successful at this level and that is because they organise their teams properly, starting with set pieces. Middlesbrough’s defenders for example aren’t individually better than Matt Clarke. They also don’t leave their 5 foot 10 19 year old midfielder marking Lukas Jutkiewicz and Harley Dean at the back post.

The second part of this conundrum is you shouldn’t be expected to keep a clean sheet every game to win. It won’t happen. We have no patterns of play, we have no plan going forward. When Kazim came off for Sibley on Saturday, did anything change? Of course it didn’t, we hoofed the ball to him and Waghorn to compete against two brick outhouses. What’s the plan? We look like we go into games with no idea of how to score goals, just hoping that somehow we will. That is on the manager and his coaching staff.

[Tyler Durden]

13 minutes ago, bcnram said:

I am concerned about the manager as the results determine any managers security. 
My bigger concern is Marshal diving over the top of a shot, Byrne passing directly to one of the opponents for a goal, Wisdom having a lie down and losing the ball for another goal. Lawrence giving a forward a free header for another goal, Clarke letting his man go for another goal. The goal conceding list goes on and on and on. Error after error. These age not to do with how they are set up, this is all about senior players not doing their job. Their concentration levels are pathetic, they should in most cases not have been recruited. 
whether we stay up or get relegated, the players, the poor recruitment, the inability of Mel to move on are issues beyond the managers immediate control. 
 

or the short version:

changing the manager (if we did), solves nothing on its own. 
 

I hear what you're saying but there a lot of things that you don't mention which are within Rooney's gift that he could and should be doing.

[Mostyn6]

oops. How did I end up in the politics thread?! 

[nottingram]

21 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

I don't know what Mac's deal is with us so we'll go with your assumption.

Y'think Mel's lawyers are going to let that happen? Constructive dismissal, breach of contract, besmirchment of character and so on and so on. Ooh, that one is going to be very nasty and I can't think of another time in football when that's happened, never mind worked. I can't even think of another time when a manager has been sacked with two games to go.

Look it's great you guys (or girls, excuse me either way) think it's all just 'ah well, throw another million at it, after all we need to stay up' but it likely just isn't that simple. 

And, to be clear, I'm not saying for one second that Rooney is my first choice, even a preferred option here and now. But the moment has passed to do anything about it for this season. It's done, it's just in the fate of the stars as to whether or not we are slightly less rubbish than two other teams.

No I don’t know either but I just don’t think it’s a massive stretch to say he is being paid for whatever services he is providing currently.

Football managers are put on gardening leave all the time, from what I know it is quite rare that their contracts will be paid up in cold hard cash as soon as their services are no longer required. So if, a few games ago, we had hired someone internally to replace it would seem to me to be at relatively low cost, certainly when put against the financial consequences of relegation. Maybe we do then have to pay up on Rooney’s deal, and maybe this would be expensive, but more expensive than relegation? You would like to think some sort of break clause was put in to the contract of the manager with no practical experience and incomplete theoretical experience anyway. Although maybe Sheikhy didn’t agree to that when we were letting him play “be a football owner” despite having never seen a penny of his cash.

Again, I largely agree it’s too late to do anything now. However, if we have tied ourselves into a deal with a rookie manager with no financial or legal solution to him stinking the place out then frankly whoever made that decision is utterly stupid and fully deserves to bear the brunt of whatever it ends up costing.

Let us not forget if we had not hired him as manager and extended his contract in the process we would be two short months away from him leaving the club for good and possibly going to coach Man United’s under 14’s. I am aware you are not advocating him being our manager.

[Dinnitdough]

22 hours ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Do you think Luton’s and Coventry’s squads are stronger?

Coventry def not.

But Luton has Collins, someone with the ability to score 15+ goals during a season. 

Love Kaz, dislike Waggie, but neither have the end product we need. I honestly think the rest of our squad is on par with many clubs in the Championship.

stats wise we shouldn’t be were we are, in terms of chances created, possession etc.. its only the goals that are eluding us.

 

[RoyMac5]

47 minutes ago, bcnram said:

I am concerned about the manager as the results determine any managers security. 
My bigger concern is Marshal diving over the top of a shot, Byrne passing directly to one of the opponents for a goal, Wisdom having a lie down and losing the ball for another goal. Lawrence giving a forward a free header for another goal, Clarke letting his man go for another goal. The goal conceding list goes on and on and on. Error after error. These age not to do with how they are set up, this is all about senior players not doing their job. Their concentration levels are pathetic, they should in most cases not have been recruited. 
whether we stay up or get relegated, the players, the poor recruitment, the inability of Mel to move on are issues beyond the managers immediate control. 
 

or the short version:

changing the manager (if we did), solves nothing on its own. 

How very dare you make sense! Even Cocu with a better squad kept us up! ?

[Chris_Martin]

1 hour ago, BaaLocks said:

And your defence against that statement, other than just arguing for the sake of it, is to cite a bloke that has ended up frozen out of training at a club four points above the relegation zone in the Championship. OK, no holes in that one.

i give up.

[MikeS]

The chairman seems to have hunkered down in his bunker for the last four months or so. He has decided it's s##t or bust this season.

No changes in the coaching and management and we just bite our lips and hope for the best as the team careers on a steady downward spiral with Rooney & Co clearly showing that they have run out of both ideas and indeed hope. We may escape at the last minute, but this descent into despair is not something fans will forget in a hurry. The club is floundering from top to bottom with no one sadly showing any guts or nous to try to stop the rot.

[BaaLocks]

1 hour ago, nottingram said:

However, if we have tied ourselves into a deal with a rookie manager with no financial or legal solution to him stinking the place out then frankly whoever made that decision is utterly stupid and fully deserves to bear the brunt of whatever it ends up costing.

I share your frustration, really I do. I'm no Rooney fan-boy, not by a long way, but I guess I'm just trying to remain pragmatic of what really is possible and what is already done but we have yet to feel the consequences.

[Gringo]

I see this thread which should be re-titled "Competition to determine who is the worlds worst Rams fan" is doing well. I always enjoy speculation about conjecture from people who seem determined to rubbish the club they profess to support.  

[Chris_Martin]

4 hours ago, DCFClks said:

 

Rooney's getting sacked at the end of the season

 

what's your source?????!!!!!!

[Ghost of Clough]

3 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

How very dare you make sense! Even Cocu with a better squad kept us up! ?

But but but.... people were saying Marshall is better than Hamer/Roos, Byrne is better than Bogle, Forsyth better than Lowe. Surely they offset the loss of Martin?

Holmes, Evans, Huddlestone, etc... were only average squad players. 

[DCFC Kicks]

34 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

what's your source?????!!!!!!

Chris Martin