A Kind of Blue

[Gaspode]

New blue card to send players to a 'sin bin' for 10 minutes to be trialled:

Get Off....

[SSD]

One of the most ridiculous ideas I've come across in football.

If someone goes in the sin bin, the team with ten men are going to clearly sit in with everyone behind the ball, making that 10 minutes completely boring. This isn't Rugby.

Make it simple, cynical foul is a yellow card. Dissent is a red card. It's going to cause even more confusion. The referees can't get VAR to a good standard.

[TimRam]

17 minutes ago, SSD said:

One of the most ridiculous ideas I've come across in football.

If someone goes in the sin bin, the team with ten men are going to clearly sit in with everyone behind the ball, making that 10 minutes completely boring. This isn't Rugby.

Make it simple, cynical foul is a yellow card. Dissent is a red card. It's going to cause even more confusion. The referees can't get VAR to a good standard.

Totally agree. How do they determine if an offence is blue or yellow? Player thinks "I'll take a blue for the team, worth it for 10 mins". All it will do is confuse everyone We have enough issues with var without adding more to it.

[Mucker1884]

I'm all for it.  Gets a thumbs up from me.

I'd also like to participate in a 4 hour pre-match car-boot picnic/BBQ in the West Stand Car Park, and have scantily clad female purveyors of (even more) snacks and beverages parading up and down the aisles in the stands, throughout the entire 3 hour game (extended to allow for time-outs and words from sponsors).
Oh... and if we catch a matchball, we get to keep it!

Bring it on, I say.  

Have a nice day.

[Day]

We’ve reached the point where they can’t tinker with the offside rule anymore, so had to find something else to change which keeps them all in cushty jobs.

[RadioactiveWaste]

Give them an oportunity to make a mess of something and they'll take it.

It seems to be a solution without a problem.

 

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

Always thought that when a player gets a yellow and it's enough to trigger a ban , it can really create a deficit to you rather than a benefit if the game/s they miss are against a rival who is just ahead or behind you.  I Don't know the answer to that one but if they give a sin bin foul you would get the immediate benefit but would need even more VAR as they'll be hurling themselves around all over the place.  3 hr games will be the norm.

[Tamworthram]

3 hours ago, Gee SCREAMER !! said:

Always thought that when a player gets a yellow and it's enough to trigger a ban , it can really create a deficit to you rather than a benefit if the game/s they miss are against a rival who is just ahead or behind you.  I Don't know the answer to that one but if they give a sin bin foul you would get the immediate benefit but would need even more VAR as they'll be hurling themselves around all over the place.  3 hr games will be the norm.

I agree with @SSD. A sin bin ruling would be a disaster as one team would try to kill the game for the 10 minute period. Also, I’m not sure how it would work. Would there be “time added on” for the sin bin period for any lengthy delays?

Regarding dissent, referees could help themselves by booking more players. Wasn’t there a rule a few years ago whereby if a player showed dissent after conceding a free kick the ball was moved another 10 yards? I know they do it in rugby (where field position is more important) but I thought it happened in football for a while. Maybe I was dreaming it. An extra 10 yards isn’t always an advantage so maybe the team taking the free kick should be given the option of the original placement, 10 yards further forward, or anywhere between the 2 points. Maybe cynical fouls (alternatively known as professional fouls) should be a straight red.

[silverback]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2024/feb/08/blue-cards-and-sin-bins-could-be-introduced-to-football-under-ifab-plans

 

Not sure if this has been discussed on here, but I do like the idea of blueing for the cynical professional foul that all to often ruins a promising move.

 

How that would be implemented goodness knows ????

[BathRam72]

I have said this for ages now. I am a Football and Rugby fan. 

The sin bin works in Rugby so well.

A yellow card in a football match merely makes that player slightly more reticent when going into tackles but is not really a punishment for what could be a cynical foul or dissent (you never see a Rugby player argue back or swear at the Ref).

10 Minutes off the field could be a good punishment and at this level we could end up playing against teams of 9 or 8 the way some teams play.

Edited February 9 by BathRam72
Speeeeling

[Tamworthram]

1 hour ago, BathRam72 said:

I have said this for ages now. I am a Football and Rugby fan. 

The sin bin works in Rugby so well.

A yellow card in a football match merely makes that player slightly more reticent when going into tackles but is not really a punishment for what could be a cynical foul or dissent (you never see a Rugby player argue back or swear at the Ref).

10 Minutes off the field could be a good punishment and at this level we could end up playing against teams of 9 or 8 the way some teams play.

It does work in rugby but I think that is mainly because it’s much harder to slow the game down for ten minutes in order to kill time until your sin bin player is back on the pitch especially if your team isn’t in possession of the ball. Football is much more fluid in terms of possession and I think it would be much easier to deploy such tactics.
There is no real delay in line outs because they are taken from exactly where the officials say and you don’t have to mess around waiting for one of your players to become free to receive the ball. Also, there is no real equivalent of the goal keeper holding onto the ball and not being allowed to be challenged.

In rugby, when the full backs have the ball, they don’t generally have that long and will often punt the ball down field which, more often than not, turns possession over to the other team. In football, there would be much more passing the ball backwards and forwards between the defenders. Because you can only pass backwards, this is less likely to happen in rugby.

Also, in rugby, the actual game time is much more directly linked to the actual clock which is stopped under certain circumstances (e.g. an injury). The sim bin clock also stops. We all know, in football, time added on is much more arbitrary. We’d probably need a 5th official to keep time (with appropriate pauses) for sin bin times.

In short, I think the differences between rugby (and other sports to play more to the clock and where it’s harder to waste time legally) and football is too big to use it as a comparison in this respect.

With regard whether a yellow card is really a punishment or not, I think it is when, as you say, the player has to be a bit more cautious for the rest of the game especially defenders. 

I think the only time a sin bin would be an effective punishment is when there isn’t a great deal of time left and the team on the receiving end are having to chase the game.

Edited February 9 by Tamworthram

[oldtimeram]

VAR should only be used for penalty decisions.

Offside should be the referee's call and VAR should not be used to determine if a player is offside by a finger nail.

Blue cards are yet another complication added to the game.

Football has survived fine for over 140 years and does not need any more stupid ideas being introduced 

Edited February 9 by oldtimeram
Addition

[Wolfie]

It would make dissent a more serious offence than a dangerous tackle, with a blue card being 10 mins sin bin and still half a red card. Not sure I see the logic in that.

[BaaLocks]

20 minutes ago, oldtimeram said:

Offside should be the referee's call and VAR should not be used to determine if a player is offside by a finger nail.

Blue cards are yet another complication added to the game.

Football has survived fine for over 140 years and does not need any more stupid ideas being introduced 

Which works perfectly well until the team you are playing scores a goal after being offside by a finger nail. Then the world is in meltdown.

My view on offside is that all they need to do is make it so that the player has to be completely (and clearly) offside rather than the other way round. It would encourage attacking football and shift the onus (yes, that reads onus) of blame. And with regard to technology you can then use sensors in the shirt (which are not possible on the current system) which is much more clearer and manageable as a technology).

As for the last sentence, 140 years ago we didn't have crossbars, or much more. Games evolve, even football.

[Anag Ram]

Football is becoming a video game.

[TomTom92]

Not sure what the blue card is trying to achieve other than cure the lack of respect in the game which would be nice but not at the cost of the fans enjoyment.

[ram59]

No matter what measurement you use for offside, there's always got to be a critical cut off point, which will create controversy. Say you legislate a player is only offside if there's a 1m gap between him and a defender, you'll get disputes when a player is 1.01m offside.

Like the widely accepted goal line technology, we could have offside technology using sensors in the ball to check the precise moment it is played and monitors that the players already wear to denote their position on the pitch. You'd still have to decide who's interfering with play, but technology could solve many issues.

[Mucker1884]

3 hours ago, BathRam72 said:

... and at this level we could end up playing against teams of 9 or 8 the way some teams play.

You've not really thought this through, have you!  😲

 

You've clearly forgotten/ignored the clear and obvious anti-DCFC bias that leads to us getting no decisions in our favour!  We're famous for it, remember!  👀

 

 

😉

[Mucker1884]

1 hour ago, BaaLocks said:

Which works perfectly well until the team you are playing scores a goal after being offside by a finger nail. Then the world is in meltdown.

My view on offside is that all they need to do is make it so that the player has to be completely (and clearly) offside rather than the other way round. It would encourage attacking football and shift the onus (yes, that reads onus) of blame. And with regard to technology you can then use sensors in the shirt (which are not possible on the current system) which is much more clearer and manageable as a technology).

 

Genuine question... Can you explain why the tech can't be utilised now, but could in your example?

 

Tech question aside, My thoughts are that it literally makes no difference.  We currently have the human eye checking videos/stills to see if player A is further forward than player B.  Your proposal still relies on the human eye checking videos/stills to determine whether there is an actual and complete gap/space/daylight between players A & B.

A 2mm gap in reality would be no easier to spot on screen than one being 2mm further forward than the other.

Not worse... but no improvement either.

 

 

EDIT:
Apologies... I now see @ram59 has already made the same point.  🍻
 

Edited February 9 by Mucker1884

[RadioactiveWaste]

Ultimately, I think the authorities need to be far more "it's a game, the officials decisions are final"

Once they bring in the blue card and everyone hates it, it'll be impossible to get rid of and the "baby/bathwater " problems with the game crowd will start thinking up the next thing to change in a game that worked just fine for over a hundred years....