The Paul Warne Poll

[Blondest Goat]

3 minutes ago, Andicis said:

You literally undermine your first and last line with your second. You are right in the bolded thing, I agree. That's the entire point I'm making. 

Conveniently ignoring the point about past results.  

Don't bother replying.

[RoyMac5]

8 minutes ago, Andicis said:

"I would say based on our fixtures we've played some pretty strong teams to begin the season, including games away at Bolton and Peterborough as well as home games vs Oxford and Wigan. We were pretty unfortunate to lose to Bolton and Wigan." An opinion, quantified by the "I would say" at the beginning of the string. 

Oh I see, your opinion. It's just an opinion, but more worthy than my opinion? 😄

Edited September 8, 2023 by RoyMac5

[Andicis]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

Oh I see, your opinion. It's just an opinion, but better than my opinion? 😄

No, and that isn't even a good attempt at a strawman. I wouldn't try and present my view of the game as a fact, that is the part I'm objecting to. I don't want to end up in yet another circular discussion with you, so I'll leave it here. 

[RoyMac5]

4 minutes ago, Andicis said:

No, and that isn't even a good attempt at a strawman. I wouldn't try and present my view of the game as a fact, that is the part I'm objecting to. I don't want to end up in yet another circular discussion with you, so I'll leave it here. 

Nowhere did I say that you did try and present it as fact, I said your opinion. But obfuscation is your thing. 😄

Edited September 8, 2023 by RoyMac5

[DCFC Kicks]

57 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

I didn't make the assertion, you did.

Where basically you've admitted that you can't support this with any evidence whatsoever but you've decided to tout it anyway as it fits with your narrative.

What you've just answered with are just pure generalisations.

You have no evidence whatsoever of which players whom we actually were in for decided to accept offers elsewhere due to Warnes playing style as you put it, nor what players would have come to the club if Rooney or Rosenoir had been in charge and not Warne.

I wasn't making an assertion, I was hypothesising. Sorry, I wasn't aware you had to present a fully cited academic paper to support every casual opinion you put on a football fan forum. 

There's plenty of evidence that we were after players who ended up at other clubs. There's obviously reasons they chose other clubs instead of us. I was stating an opinion that our style of play doesn't help attract players. Again, you have no evidence that counters my opinion. Unless you do, then please share.

[Premier ram]

2 minutes ago, DCFC Kicks said:

I wasn't making an assertion, I was hypothesising. Sorry, I wasn't aware you had to present a fully cited academic paper to support every casual opinion you put on a football fan forum. 

There's plenty of evidence that we were after players who ended up at other clubs. There's obviously reasons they chose other clubs instead of us. I was stating an opinion that our style of play doesn't help attract players. Again, you have no evidence that counters my opinion. Unless you do, then please share.

What players?

[Tyler Durden]

3 minutes ago, DCFC Kicks said:

I wasn't making an assertion, I was hypothesising. Sorry, I wasn't aware you had to present a fully cited academic paper to support every casual opinion you put on a football fan forum. 

There's plenty of evidence that we were after players who ended up at other clubs. There's obviously reasons they chose other clubs instead of us. I was stating an opinion that our style of play doesn't help attract players. Again, you have no evidence that counters my opinion. Unless you do, then please share.

Yano I've never defended Warnes teams playing style, if a poster says they don't find it attractive then I respect their opinion and have never argued against this. 

Speculating, which it is, that Warnes playing style is then hindering our attempts to sign players is a step too far and when you make baseless comments like that expect to be challenged back. 

[Archied]

1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said:

Instant gratification?! We could see how well Rosenior had the squad playing, and then Warne managed to keep it going for a while too. Why shouldn't we expect' instant' gratification, the players were good enough.

Plenty didn’t see it your way , plenty thought we were playing poorly and getting worse game on game after a really good start at Charlton 

[Old Spalding Ram]

44 minutes ago, Andicis said:

Based on....? 

I'm not suggesting anything, again if you make a point you should back it up. 

And Plymouth literally demonstrates the example that it is possible to recover from a stuttering start with 2 league and a cup defeat early last season. Simply highlighting that fact. We aren't at the halfway point, we're at the start point. That is a much better fit for the example. 

Not quite sure what your point is about Plymouth.

Their first four league matches as you say they lost two, but they’d also won two.

After the first match in Sept (Derby away) they’d played 7, won 5 and lost 2 in the league including wins against Bolton, Peterborough and Derby.  Their next defeat was in December including a run of 15 league matches unbeaten. Two defeats in their first twenty games.

Personally………..I’d love a stuttering start like that! 👍

[Andicis]

12 minutes ago, Old Spalding Ram said:

Not quite sure what your point is about Plymouth.

Their first four league matches as you say they lost two, but they’d also won two.

After the first match in Sept (Derby away) they’d played 7, won 5 and lost 2 in the league including wins against Bolton, Peterborough and Derby.  Their next defeat was in December including a run of 15 league matches unbeaten. Two defeats in their first twenty games.

Personally………..I’d love a stuttering start like that! 👍

We've lost 3 games at the start of the season, that's very comparable? Factoring in they lost 5-1 to a poor Charlton and lost 2-1 to Fleetwood, yes it was a stuttering start (if Warne had lost 5-1 at the start of this season our fans would be rioting). We know they hit good form after the start, not sure what you're trying to say as that's my point. 

Edited September 8, 2023 by Andicis

[Tamworthram]

22 minutes ago, DCFC Kicks said:

I wasn't making an assertion, I was hypothesising. Sorry, I wasn't aware you had to present a fully cited academic paper to support every casual opinion you put on a football fan forum. 

There's plenty of evidence that we were after players who ended up at other clubs. There's obviously reasons they chose other clubs instead of us. I was stating an opinion that our style of play doesn't help attract players. Again, you have no evidence that counters my opinion. Unless you do, then please share.

What "obvious reasons" rather than guesses or assumptions?

[Chris_Martin]

4 hours ago, Jourdan said:

I am not sure I agree that there was such a regression. We played well at times but often would shoot ourselves in the foot, have no luck or not be able to sustain that quality of play over 90 minutes. We played some of our best football of the whole season v Plymouth, Peterborough and Wednesday away, for instance. We just couldn’t hold our nerve at key moments.

If Rosenior hadn’t signed McGoldrick, he would have signed another player. Who knows how well or how badly that player would have been suited to a Warne team? It’s impossible to say.

How do you measure the recruitment by Warne against recruitment by Rosenior? Rosenior’s signings have been here for a year or more. Warne’s signings have been here for six league games or in many cases fewer. Surely a better comparison can be made in April or May next year?

I think Warne needs until the end of the season. A whole season with his own squad of players and two transfer windows to bring in the players he wants seems fair to me. 

In the summer, there will be the opportunity to bring in someone new if we feel Warne has underachieved, and from there a new manager and the club can work without the restrictions of the business plan looming large.

How will the season be a write off? Unless we are 10+ points from the play-offs, which we are not currently and unlikely to be, we’ll have something to play for right until the very end.

Just look up the ppg before and after february, theres a significant drop off. 

To say warne would've signed a player remotely close to matching what McGoldrick did for us is just delusional.

As for warnes v roseniors recruitment, they are polar opposites. Rosenior was signing players with technical ability, premier league experience, promising young players. Warne has so far (despite having less transfer restictions) signed lower end championship/league one players with very little technical ability. Playing a good style of football helps to attract players. I mean who wants to come and play a bit of head tennis and run round like a headless chicken for 90mins every week?

Given the current state of this division, we should be getting top 2, not just aiming for the play offs again. It's wide open this year with no stand out teams, even the relegated championship ones have points deductions. This is a huge oppurtunity this year and giving warne another season to see if he can improve seems like a waste. 

[DCFC Kicks]

8 minutes ago, Tamworthram said:

What "obvious reasons" rather than guesses or assumptions?

I didn't say 'obvious reasons'. I said 'there's obviously reasons'. When a player choses to sign for one club over another, there's usually reasons involved, as oppose to a flip of a coin. Or do you need me to give evidence to back that statement up as well? 

[Chris_Martin]

2 hours ago, Tyler Durden said:

What bona fide evidence do you have to back up your assertion?

probably the fact they haven't signed for us😅

[Tamworthram]

6 minutes ago, DCFC Kicks said:

I didn't say 'obvious reasons'. I said 'there's obviously reasons'. When a player choses to sign for one club over another, there's usually reasons involved, as oppose to a flip of a coin. Or do you need me to give evidence to back that statement up as well? 

Alright buddy. No need to get worked up. I misread your post and, not only do I acknowledge my error, I apologise. 

Edited September 8, 2023 by Tamworthram

[Chris_Martin]

2 hours ago, Andicis said:

Every player we signed finished higher than we did last year. "The majority of our transfers this season are from L1 or lower champ" Why are you including league one? We signed more premier league players then we signed League One players. Of course these players from the clubs in the leagues above us aren't playing, otherwise why would they decide to move down a league?

 

They had offers to stay in the championship, but chose to drop down to league one because it was liam rosenior and the way he wanted to play football. I specifically remember him saying that at the time.

[Chris_Martin]

42 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said:

Yano I've never defended Warnes teams playing style, if a poster says they don't find it attractive then I respect their opinion and have never argued against this. 

Speculating, which it is, that Warnes playing style is then hindering our attempts to sign players is a step too far and when you make baseless comments like that expect to be challenged back. 

why is it ?

happens all the time at various different clubs.

[MackworthRamIsGod]

4 hours ago, Yoxoram said:

I think the point Terry Hennessy was trying to make was that it didn't work.

And the point I was making was, with Mel Morris in charge, it was never going to work.

You don't decide to stick on the same course simply because the previous fella messed up more times than the Conservative party.

[Tyler Durden]

1 minute ago, Chris_Martin said:

why is it ?

happens all the time at various different clubs.

We aren't debating other clubs we are debating DCFC

It's simpler to end this argument to just name the players whom turned down joining our club due to their concerns about our playing style.

I'll be waiting......

[MackworthRamIsGod]

54 minutes ago, Premier ram said:

What players?

Alfie May.

Regardless of what some posters have you belive, he was one we were after.

Sam Smith another.