Referees

[ilkleyram]

10 hours ago, TuffLuff said:

After seeing the fan cam of the disallowed goal, and the controversy surrounding it, my one thought is that we were seemingly quite nice about it in the aftermath. I don’t think we should be surrounding the ref, but we just accepted it and moved on. Should Bird be going and getting clarification from the ref in real time and communicating to the other players they believed McGoldrick fouled the keeper to which Bird or whoever can point out how far McGoldrick was away from the incident?

The officials won’t change their mind and yes the refs are rubbish etc, but they are also human and you can introduce doubt into their head once the game has restarted.

I agree about making more of a fuss but Bird did go to the ref after the goal was disallowed, twice. He went to him once just afterwards and then a little later in a break in play.  Perhaps we need a louder more concerted team effort.

 The trouble with microphones is that you can’t see that communication is taking place and sometimes the officials need to show the crowd and players they are talking to each other. One way of getting them to review a decision is for more players to be involved with both lino and ref.

Edited April 2, 2023 by ilkleyram

[G STAR RAM]

So I'm clearly not up to date with the rules.

Can anyone confirm if players should still be receiving a yellow card for simulation or not?

[bcnram]

Generally, I think most of the referees have been ok. Of course we have had the odd shocker as well. If yesterdays officials were guilty of miscommunication that is poor. One of the major things referees need to realise is the effect on clubs and players livelihoods when they get a simple thing wrong without double checking with each other. Even from the other end of the ground the linesman looked confused. 
Hopefully they will learn from it. 

[Rambam]

One major problem is referees apparently will not issue two yellow cards for time wasting, therefore a red. Players know this, as well as taking turns to waste time. 
Give Ipswich their due. They’d done their homework. 
Having watched the Rams for nearly 40 years I am shocked to discover that easily the worst level of time wasting is found in League One. 
The standard of refereeing is equally shocking. I said at Barnsley when their first offside goal was allowed to stand, despite that idiot referee, who is despised in Scotland, going over to the linesman who had his flag up, we’re getting nothing out the refs in this division. 
The disbelief after that fiasco yesterday around the ground, and the lack of clarity about what had happened, was almost unique. The linesman didn’t even raise his flag. I’ve heard the Ipswich commentary. They didn’t have a clue either. 
Something needs to be done. 

 

Edited April 2, 2023 by Rambam

[Gritstone Ram]

11 minutes ago, Rambam said:

One major problem is referees apparently will not issue two yellow cards for time wasting, therefore a red. Players know this, as well as taking turns to waste time. 
Give Ipswich their due. They’d done their homework. 
Having watched the Rams for nearly 40 years I am shocked to discover that easily the worst level of time wasting is found in League One. 
The standard of refereeing is equally shocking. I said at Barnsley when their first offside goal was allowed to stand, despite that idiot referee, who is despised in Scotland, going over to the linesman who had his flag up, we’re getting nothing out the refs in this division. 
The disbelief after that fiasco yesterday around the ground, and the lack of clarity about what had happened, was almost unique. The linesman didn’t even raise his flag. I’ve heard the Ipswich commentary. They didn’t have a clue either. 
Something needs to be done. 

 

I think the whole time wasting thing needs to be looked at differently. I think the team doing the time wasting should get a warning like an unofficial yellow card so all players know not to time waste then the next one to do it is sent off rather than let 4 different players get booked for doing the same thing.

Edited April 2, 2023 by Gritstone Ram

[Rams forever]

This is supposed to be professional sport, managers lose their jobs on decision making like this, it's frankly not good enough! 

We now do not know what the result would have been if the goal was allowed as we were just starting to get on top in the game anything could have happened. 

[Grumpy Git]

10 hours ago, estinnes said:

 …… why the linesman didn't then correct the referee 

You’re having a laugh right?

FFS, they wait for the ref to tell them which way to award a throw-in that happened a yard away.

[Rambam]

6 minutes ago, Gritstone Ram said:

I think the whole time wasting thing needs to be looked at differently. I think the team doing the time wasting should get a warning like an unofficial yellow card so all players know not to time waste then the next one to do it is sent off rather than let 4 different players get booked for doing the same thing.

Agree with that. Something else I would like to see is an official time keeper in the professional game. Not leave it to the ref. Each time the ball is out of play or the game stops. Or even better, 30 minute halves plus stop the clock for breaks in play like Basketball. That won’t happen, though. 
I’m sick to death of it. The players going down for seemingly nothing in tandem is becoming a regular occurrence. 

[angieram]

Another aspect of refereeing at League One level is the amount of holding that goes completely unpunished. Ipswich were taking full advantage of that yesterday  with two arms wrapped around our players, especially Collins and McGoldrick  not just at corners  but all over the pitch.

Anything above waist height and refs just ignore it - holding, two-handed pushes, barges etc. Basically  the more physical players are, the more advantages in our League.

In contrast, the referee booked Rodri at Man City for holding yesterday and the commentary indicated he was perhaps lucky not to have received a second yellow for the same offence.

Such inconsistency.

[Red Ram]

Have watched the highlights multiple times. Can't see anything wrong with the goal at all. I didn't think the Knight's penalty appeal was a penalty though.

The standard of refereeing has been noticeably worse in League One compared with the Championship.

The suggestion that it's some kind of EFL conspiracy is just laughable though. As David has pointed out previously, the EFL aren't even responsible for the governance of referees.

But just keep believing whatever you find comforting if you really want to...

[Guest]

49 minutes ago, Gritstone Ram said:

I think the whole time wasting thing needs to be looked at differently. I think the team doing the time wasting should get a warning like an unofficial yellow card so all players know not to time waste then the next one to do it is sent off rather than let 4 different players get booked for doing the same thing.

This is good because it gives a direct advantage to the team who are bearing the brunt of their timewasting (i.e. by facing fewer players right now) but an alternative could be that the ref informs the captain/manager of the offending team that he’s awarding a “strike” against them; three strikes = 1 point deduction.

Hopefully that would knock it on the head, albeit it gives the major advantage to any opposition they play while on 2 strikes, rather than when on 1 or 0!

Or maybe your idea (warning then red card for next offender whoever it is) but instead of a red, award a penalty? Since the timewasting is designed to stop the opponent creating a chance to score (well obviously) this would seem the most appropriate punishment!

[Guest]

1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said:

So I'm clearly not up to date with the rules.

Can anyone confirm if players should still be receiving a yellow card for simulation or not?

Yes, but not if they play their joker.

[Guest]

11 hours ago, estinnes said:

When checking for a foul, the linesman said "No, I had eyes on the goalkeeper", the referee heard this as "it's a foul on the goalkeeper".

They've then apologised after the game for the miscommunication and said "we're still learning"... It's shocking that the referee didn't check with the linesman, why the linesman didn't then correct the referee 

I realise football officiating is a little different to many jobs that involve working with colleagues, but if for example you asked your colleague to arrange the meeting with a particular client at 11am, then he told you he’d confirmed the meeting for 7am as per your request, wouldn’t you (or indeed anyone) tell him his mistake and correct it rather than expecting the client to turn up in their pyjamas to their massive inconvenience?

(In other words: why didn’t the lino just say “not sure what you’re up to ref because you asked me then disallowed the goal, but I saw no reason to disallow it”)

[Topram]

46 minutes ago, angieram said:

Another aspect of refereeing at League One level is the amount of holding that goes completely unpunished. Ipswich were taking full advantage of that yesterday  with two arms wrapped around our players, especially Collins and McGoldrick  not just at corners  but all over the pitch.

Anything above waist height and refs just ignore it - holding, two-handed pushes, barges etc. Basically  the more physical players are, the more advantages in our League.

In contrast, the referee booked Rodri at Man City for holding yesterday and the commentary indicated he was perhaps lucky not to have received a second yellow for the same offence.

Such inconsistency.

That first corner before our perfectly good goal the ref had a word with the guy holding roberts the corner comes in he’s still all over him and the ref just points to him then his eyes as if to say I’m watching you, well why didn’t you give us the pen then? How many chances to they get, same with time wasting, dark arts of football that’s what yesterday  was clear cheating but they know they’ll get away with it.

 

one thing I’m not sure has been said or not when them 2 players went down absolutely fine both of them why did neither go off? Ref just let them stay on?

[Grumpy Git]

13 minutes ago, jameso said:

I realise football officiating is a little different to many jobs that involve working with colleagues, but if for example you asked your colleague to arrange the meeting with a particular client at 11am, then he told you he’d confirmed the meeting for 7am as per your request, wouldn’t you (or indeed anyone) tell him his mistake and correct it rather than expecting the client to turn up in their pyjamas to their massive inconvenience?

(In other words: why didn’t the lino just say “not sure what you’re up to ref because you asked me then disallowed the goal, but I saw no reason to disallow it”)

Too easy.

A bit like banks having messages posted-up saying “we won’t tolerate abusive behaviour, blah, blah, blah….”

Just employ more staff you tight barstewards.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, angieram said:

Another aspect of refereeing at League One level is the amount of holding that goes completely unpunished. Ipswich were taking full advantage of that yesterday  with two arms wrapped around our players, especially Collins and McGoldrick  not just at corners  but all over the pitch.

Anything above waist height and refs just ignore it - holding, two-handed pushes, barges etc. Basically  the more physical players are, the more advantages in our League.

In contrast, the referee booked Rodri at Man City for holding yesterday and the commentary indicated he was perhaps lucky not to have received a second yellow for the same offence.

Such inconsistency.

Agree, also there were clear a number cases of obstruction, it happens all of the time in games and it really infuriates me that the rules are not enforced 

“Impeding the progress of an opponent means moving into the opponent’s path to obstruct, block, slow down or force a change of direction when the ball is not within playing distance of either player.
 

Why were none of the Ipswich players sanctioned?  They did the above consistently.

 

[G STAR RAM]

47 minutes ago, Topram said:

That first corner before our perfectly good goal the ref had a word with the guy holding roberts the corner comes in he’s still all over him and the ref just points to him then his eyes as if to say I’m watching you, well why didn’t you give us the pen then? How many chances to they get, same with time wasting, dark arts of football that’s what yesterday  was clear cheating but they know they’ll get away with it.

 

one thing I’m not sure has been said or not when them 2 players went down absolutely fine both of them why did neither go off? Ref just let them stay on?

Have a read of the rules a bit further up this thread. Referee was correct in allowing them both to stay on.

News to me but yet another rule change to the detriment of the 'beautiful' game.

[May Contain Nuts]

14 minutes ago, Andrew1 said:

Agree, also there were clear a number cases of obstruction, it happens all of the time in games and it really infuriates me that the rules are not enforced 

“Impeding the progress of an opponent means moving into the opponent’s path to obstruct, block, slow down or force a change of direction when the ball is not within playing distance of either player.
 

Why were none of the Ipswich players sanctioned?  They did the above consistently.

 

Yeah the one on Knight was scandalous. Play on says the ref.

[Crewton]

That "goal" yesterday reminded me of one we had disallowed incorrectly for a non-existant foul on the keeper (Byrne direct from a corner iirc) back in 20/21, which cost us a point. The number of critical errors committed by the officials seemed to escalate that season and have got worse each season since. I don't care how other teams have been affected by this apparent deterioration in officiating standards, I only care that we seem to have suffered allot more than we've benefited, this season being the worst so far.

 Something has to be done to reduce the number of errors, be that VAR or something like teams being able to call for a couple of reviews each per game. 

"Swings and roundabouts" is a meaningless cliché now.

[estinnes]

1 hour ago, jameso said:

I realise football officiating is a little different to many jobs that involve working with colleagues, but if for example you asked your colleague to arrange the meeting with a particular client at 11am, then he told you he’d confirmed the meeting for 7am as per your request, wouldn’t you (or indeed anyone) tell him his mistake and correct it rather than expecting the client to turn up in their pyjamas to their massive inconvenience?

(In other words: why didn’t the lino just say “not sure what you’re up to ref because you asked me then disallowed the goal, but I saw no reason to disallow it”)

Exactly, the referee could have easily double checked, the linesman could have equally have said what are you doing?! 

We pay enough money to not have to put up with officials that are still learning... Go and learn at grass routes level!