Derby County Administration (with the slight possibility of Liquidation still there)

[Beetle]

I thought, apart from the debt that no-one has confirmed, it had been confirmed the club is running at a sustainable level at the moment. If that is the case I would hope we can agree a deal with HMRC to pay the debt back as presumably we are paying the HMRC the PAYE at the moment?

[MackworthRamIsGod]

2 hours ago, CBRammette said:

Yes I hope you are too but I feel very edgy.

Something doesn't sit right with me.

Their first interview was great, I came away full of optimism, they spoke very well. But they seem to change what they have said, ever so slightly, but still.

We have gone from them saying there is enough in the coffers to run the club for 3 months, a takeover in 3 months so doable and that short term funding would be needed beyond that. Those words seem to have changed slightly, if last nights meeting notes are accurate.

[MackworthRamIsGod]

2 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

I hope he was wrong too and not meaning to shoot the messenger but, why would the father of an ex player know enough about the financial situation to question what the administrator is saying publicly? I doubt even the current players know a great deal more than most.

Totally agree, I don't know the man personally, I just know other gym goers seem to hold him in high esteem.  

I do agree that doesn't make him genuinely ITK.

 

[Stive Pesley]

3 hours ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

The more I hear from the administrators the more I fear all isn't as it seems and all isn't going to be as rosey as they are trying to suggest.

I overhead someone at the gym, a father of an ex Derby player saying Derby are in a much bigger mess than the administrators are letting on.

I really hope he is wrong and I am wrong.

Then again, I've seen someone on one of the FB groups who had been ITK before claiming that it's all a done deal and the administrators asking for bids is just a charade. I guess only time will tell 

[Donnyram]

5 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

Then again, I've seen someone on one of the FB groups who had been ITK before claiming that it's all a done deal and the administrators asking for bids is just a charade. I guess only time will tell 

I think that whatever the actual situation is (and I suspect that there is genuine interest) the administrators will give positive messages about significant interest in the club - a bit like car sales! 

[Guest]

If there is substance in this report from the Daily Mail, the situation does not allow the optimism that is being expressed by the administrators. It seems there is a very difficult bridge to cross with HMRC:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-10060109/Derby-Countys-future-hangs-balance-taxpayers-bail-club-say-analysts.html

 

[PistoldPete]

40 minutes ago, atherstoneram said:

As i understand it.

Well like I say liquidating a club to maximise your share of the debt makes no financial sense. different for a business that is losing trade or has become obsolete then i could understand HMRC getting whatever they can from the wreckage.  

[atherstoneram]

5 minutes ago, Crewton said:

Well, it won't sit well with the "leveling up" agenda when there are less than 10 league clubs left north of the Trent. HMRC going out of their way to kill any significant businesses in the wake of the pandemic will soon become political.

Well find out soon enough.

To many people there are more significant items on the "levelling up" agenda then football. I know it is astonishing but not everyone has an interest in football and have no idea of the difference between the PL and EFL,they may know which league their local team plays in but that's as far as it goes,some aren't even that bothered. You only have to see the reaction when England are shown on terrestrial TV and Coronation St.etc. are not shown that night. What they do see on the news is players making the headlines commanding transfer fees of £100M and therefore think football is awash with money.

[atherstoneram]

2 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

Well like I say liquidating a club to maximise your share of the debt makes no financial sense. different for a business that is losing trade or has become obsolete then i could understand HMRC getting whatever they can from the wreckage.  

It will be interesting to see what stance the HMRC take.

[Ghost of Clough]

6 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

If there is substance in this report from the Daily Mail, the situation does not allow the optimism that is being expressed by the administrators. It seems there is a very difficult bridge to cross with HMRC:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-10060109/Derby-Countys-future-hangs-balance-taxpayers-bail-club-say-analysts.html

 

I hope we get this sorted soon as the bill is increasing every day. £26m a couple of weeks ago, now already at £28m!

[RadioactiveWaste]

9 minutes ago, Brailsford Ram said:

If there is substance in this report from the Daily Mail, the situation does not allow the optimism that is being expressed by the administrators. It seems there is a very difficult bridge to cross with HMRC:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-10060109/Derby-Countys-future-hangs-balance-taxpayers-bail-club-say-analysts.html

 

Well, that was bleak reading. I would treat it as "we want a piece on how bleak the future is for Derby, I want no hope at all in the article" and it's a counterpoint to the "very good runner, very popular model, lot of tread on the tyres, just been serviced" point of view of the administratiors. Truth probably being a muddle in the middle.

[Ghost of Clough]

Why is the market value estimated at "significantly less than £30m"?
Sunderland went for £30m and Ipswich for £25m as L1 clubs

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Why is the market value estimated at "significantly less than £30m"?
Sunderland went for £30m and Ipswich for £25m as L1 clubs

But what was the level of their debt compared with ours? Also the position of HMRC as a creditor has been strengthened since those clubs went into administration. Derby is the first football administration since the status of HMRC was altered. However, I think the less than £30m figure applies solely to the football club, which doesn't own the ground. If Mel Morris is prepared to be generous with the amount he will take for the ground in a package deal, it will make the overall package more attractive.

 

Edited October 5, 2021 by Guest

[atherstoneram]

9 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Why is the market value estimated at "significantly less than £30m"?
Sunderland went for £30m and Ipswich for £25m as L1 clubs

They owned their own grounds didn't they?

[Chris_D]

44 minutes ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

Something doesn't sit right with me.

Their first interview was great, I came away full of optimism, they spoke very well. But they seem to change what they have said, ever so slightly, but still.

We have gone from them saying there is enough in the coffers to run the club for 3 months, a takeover in 3 months so doable and that short term funding would be needed beyond that. Those words seem to have changed slightly, if last nights meeting notes are accurate.

They said initially they would need short term funding to get through the next three months: 

https://www.thebusinessdesk.com/eastmidlands/news/2052088-administrators-say-Derby-county-have-95-chance-of-rescue

“Jackson said the cash situation as the club is “extremely tight”. He added: “There is cash, but not enough to keep the club going for three months. We’re looking to take some short-term funding, and we’re in discussion with funders. We’ll be continuing with football fixtures.”

[atherstoneram]

Normally i would take what the DM say with a pinch of salt but this time i think there is some truth in what has been reported by giving quotes from people who have had dealings in such matters previously.

[Bob The Badger]

19 hours ago, rammieib said:

Agreed thats a risk. Hopefully someone has had the foresight to at least put that Appeal letter in the post! Maybe Pearce has done something to justify is hefty salary!

meanwhile in the Derby office 

[atherstoneram]

2 minutes ago, Chris_D said:

They said initially they would need short term funding to get through the next three months: 

https://www.thebusinessdesk.com/eastmidlands/news/2052088-administrators-say-Derby-county-have-95-chance-of-rescue

“Jackson said the cash situation as the club is “extremely tight”. He added: “There is cash, but not enough to keep the club going for three months. We’re looking to take some short-term funding, and we’re in discussion with funders. We’ll be continuing with football fixtures.”

Surely the short term funding would be as unsecured creditors who wouldn't get their money back if things go belly up,as i wouldn't imagine the administrators adding further debt to the list

[Crewton]

27 minutes ago, atherstoneram said:

To many people there are more significant items on the "levelling up" agenda then football. I know it is astonishing but not everyone has an interest in football and have no idea of the difference between the PL and EFL,they may know which league their local team plays in but that's as far as it goes,some aren't even that bothered. You only have to see the reaction when England are shown on terrestrial TV and Coronation St.etc. are not shown that night. What they do see on the news is players making the headlines commanding transfer fees of £100M and therefore think football is awash with money.

The Government got mighty interested when fans of the ESL clubs were kicking up a stink about those proposals, even talking about legislating to prevent it. The issues that become political aren't always the ones that one would logically assume to be most important. 

 

[atherstoneram]

Just now, Crewton said:

The Government got mighty interested when fans of the ESL clubs were kicking up a stink about those proposals, even talking about legislating to prevent it. The issues that become political aren't always the ones that one would logically assume to be most important. 

 

But that's the PL you are talking about,the government wouldn't give any financial support to EFL clubs during Covid and said the PL could easily afford to do that.