The coronabrexit thread. I mean, coronavirus thread

[Wolfie]

2 hours ago, Archied said:

Agree with most but not mass school vaccination s, in the words of pink floyd , leave our kids alone??‍♂️
it’s becoming clear that double jabbed people are still testing positive for covid 

I agree that kids probably (because I don't know the risk data) should be left alone but nobody has ever said that the jabs would stop people catching it. There's a lower chance of catching it, transmitting it and with reduced severity if you do get it.

I'm certainly in no hurry for Miss Wolfie to be jabbed.

[ariotofmyown]

2 hours ago, Wolfie said:

What I can't get my head around, about the Boris & Rishi not isolating thing is who the hell ever thought that it was a good idea and the right thing to do, with businesses suffering because of all the people being pinged?. A staggering lack of awareness and basic common sense from the top.

From both sides, actually...

Jonathan Ashworth (Shadow health) on 5Live this morning (and other places yesterday) banging on about installing air purifiers in all schools during the shool holidays - hadn't even done basic reserach on whether it might be feasible, with the number required/supply/installation engineers etc.

This is really basic stuff. Can we have some competent people in charge some time soon please?

I reckon Johnson did it deliberately to try and bring Sunak down to his level. Anyone who still supports Johnson won't care about this, but fans of Sunak will be a little disappointed. If there is a leadership challenge at some point, he seems the only credible candidate.

[Angry Ram]

Just seen that I have been given a dodgy AZ Indian vaccine on my first jag.. Brilliant. Just got to wait for the Italians and French to recognise it.

[Spanish]

11 hours ago, Leeds Ram said:

Given that covid isn't going anywhere the answer is to vaccinate as many people as quickly as possible. Currently we've got 2/3rds of the over 18's double jabbed and I believe hovering at 91% for single jabbed we're doing a good job and should be looking at mass school vaccination programmes too.  Maybe we are opening up a little too soon but currently this state of affairs is doing nothing to stop the spread anyway so we might as well fully open up and get it out of the way now than face a potential winter crisis. 

Covid in the long run will be an endemic like influenza is and we need to be approaching a state of affairs that treats it like that. If you get pinged but if you test negative in my book that shouldn't mean isolation. Perpetual lockdowns are not the answer; they're economically devastating, socially destructive and awful for the overall health of the country. You cannot de-link the economy or social welfare from health as people who are pro lockdown are doing.  They should only be considered as a last resort when there is realistic evidence hospitals are going to be overwhelmed which they aren't likely to be because of the vaccines. 

 

I am definitely losing the plot with all this.  The vax does not stop you getting infected.  Talking from a Gibraltar position everybody here has had the double.  However, infections are rising, small numbers but proportionally of interest.  152 active cases, 127 are residents with 467 self isolating.  Somewhere sometime we need to rely on the protection of the vaccination and live with the risk of infection surely?

I have bee very supportive of lockdowns and social distancing but when do we accept life is a risk.

[maxjam]

2 minutes ago, Spanish said:

I am definitely losing the plot with all this.  The vax does not stop you getting infected.  Talking from a Gibraltar position everybody here has had the double.  However, infections are rising, small numbers but proportionally of interest.  152 active cases, 127 are residents with 467 self isolating.  Somewhere sometime we need to rely on the protection of the vaccination and live with the risk of infection surely?

I have bee very supportive of lockdowns and social distancing but when do we accept life is a risk.

The jabs do protect against hospitalization and death but not against infection - in which case we will always have thousands of people infected and tens of thousands being unnecessarily 'pinged' every day.  

 

The data has been clear for a while now, 50k infections per day but only around 1 in 1000 deaths and 60%-70% of those are double vaccinated elderly/vulnerable people that unfortunately don't just have covid to worry about.

Personally, I think its time to delete the app and start living life.  Unless the NHS comes under pressure again its time to start living with covid and not hiding from it.

[Leeds Ram]

38 minutes ago, Spanish said:

I am definitely losing the plot with all this.  The vax does not stop you getting infected.  Talking from a Gibraltar position everybody here has had the double.  However, infections are rising, small numbers but proportionally of interest.  152 active cases, 127 are residents with 467 self isolating.  Somewhere sometime we need to rely on the protection of the vaccination and live with the risk of infection surely?

I have bee very supportive of lockdowns and social distancing but when do we accept life is a risk.

Yes, the key is the level of vaccination atm we're doing well but could be slightly better. I do think a good proportion of people (polling suggests big support for increased restrictions) need to understand once the vaccination programme has reached 70% plus double jabbed then there is no reason why any restrictions should remain in place. 

[Wolfie]

1 hour ago, ariotofmyown said:

I reckon Johnson did it deliberately to try and bring Sunak down to his level. Anyone who still supports Johnson won't care about this, but fans of Sunak will be a little disappointed. If there is a leadership challenge at some point, he seems the only credible candidate.

Possible but then we're back to the question of whether Boris's buffoonery is a deliberate bluff or he just can't help it.

[ariotofmyown]

2 minutes ago, Wolfie said:

Possible but then we're back to the question of whether Boris's buffoonery is a deliberate bluff or he just can't help it.

Maybe half and half? This new book seems pretty damming. I can't understand why they don't want an inquiry now? Couldn't a schoolfriend of a cabinet minister knock something up, where literally everything was Matt Hancock's fault?

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jul/19/boris-johnson-failure-to-start-covid-inquiry-this-year-is-a-disgrace-says-sage-adviser-jeremy-farrar

[Stive Pesley]

I'm currently now the only person in the house not isolating due to a covid contact.

The school bubble is closed because a kid in his class had it. Mild symptoms (that any other time you would pass off as a "bit of a cold") lasted 24 hours. Child was already fine before the PCR test result came through

Missus got pinged because she'd been sat in a friend's garden last week, at least 2m apart and said friend (double jabbed) has now tested positive. Again - her symptoms are so mild she nearly didn't bother getting tested, but her husband works in frontline NHS so they did it to be on the safe side

It's getting a bit silly isn't it

[therealhantsram]

47 minutes ago, maxjam said:

The jabs do protect against hospitalization and death but not against infection - in which case we will always have thousands of people infected and tens of thousands being unnecessarily 'pinged' every day.  

Ok, I need to correct this.

There was a study about a month ago run by Oxford University into the effectiveness of the vaccines specifically against the Delta variant.

All of the vaccines being issued in this country give 60% protection against symptomatic infection. And they give 95% protection against hospitalisation.

 

 

[Spanish]

30 minutes ago, Wolfie said:

Possible but then we're back to the question of whether Boris's buffoonery is a deliberate bluff or he just can't help it.

not sure which is more worrying?

[DarkFruitsRam7]

Might not fit in well here because of all the (understandable) talk of rising infections and hospitalisations.

But I'm going to a nightclub on Thursday and I can't bloody wait.

[ariotofmyown]

15 minutes ago, therealhantsram said:

Ok, I need to correct this.

There was a study about a month ago run by Oxford University into the effectiveness of the vaccines specifically against the Delta variant.

All of the vaccines being issued in this country give 60% protection against symptomatic infection. And they give 95% protection against hospitalisation.

 

 

That's ok, because we'll only be hitting...erm...100k cases per day soon.

[JoetheRam]

10 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

Might not fit in well here because of all the (understandable) talk of rising infections and hospitalisations.

But I'm going to a nightclub on Thursday and I can't bloody wait.

Poor sod.

[maxjam]

16 minutes ago, therealhantsram said:

Ok, I need to correct this.

There was a study about a month ago run by Oxford University into the effectiveness of the vaccines specifically against the Delta variant.

All of the vaccines being issued in this country give 60% protection against symptomatic infection. And they give 95% protection against hospitalisation.

95%.

Do we need to wait until its 100% or is 95% as good as its ever going to get?  So long as the NHS isn't under pressure, its time to open back up imho.

Is the remaining 5% made up of entirely the elderly/vulnerable that without wanting to be to uncaring would have probably succumbed to the next thing they caught anyway?  And if we're protecting 95% of an already small percentage at what point do we consider we've done all we can and open back up?

[Stive Pesley]

10 minutes ago, maxjam said:

Is the remaining 5% made up of entirely the elderly/vulnerable that without wanting to be to uncaring would have probably succumbed to the next thing they caught anyway?

Ah! The Shipman defence! ?

[DarkFruitsRam7]

17 minutes ago, JoetheRam said:

Poor sod.

If you saw the state of the nightclub you’d be setting up a charity appeal.

[therealhantsram]

25 minutes ago, maxjam said:

95%.

Do we need to wait until its 100% or is 95% as good as its ever going to get?  So long as the NHS isn't under pressure, its time to open back up imho.

Is the remaining 5% made up of entirely the elderly/vulnerable that without wanting to be to uncaring would have probably succumbed to the next thing they caught anyway?  And if we're protecting 95% of an already small percentage at what point do we consider we've done all we can and open back up?

That's too simplistic.

There is also the issue of long Covid. There have not been any proper studies yet on the long term impact of this on young people in particular.

There is a compassionate argument to take it easy for their benefit. There is also an economic argument. How many people will not be able to return to work? How many people will require state benefits for the rest of their life. We just don't know at this point.

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

It's July 19th 2021, Freedom Day - close this bloody thread. 

[therealhantsram]

36 minutes ago, ariotofmyown said:

That's ok, because we'll only be hitting...erm...100k cases per day soon.

Quite. Looking at the data from the Netherlands is really scary. They did pretty much as we are doing now, about 4 weeks ago. At the time they had 50% of population fully vaccinated.

At the moment we have about 65% fully vaccinated.

We are sitting in the middle of an experiment right now. Will we go the way of the Netherlands. Will our vaccination rate save us from the worst that they experienced?