New Manager

[MackworthRamIsGod]

1 hour ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Johnson would walk in to the current team....

So would Dawkins, Ward, Russell, Martin, Jake Buxton, Eustace.....Sammon?

North of 100 million spent on transfer fees since Mel took over and how far we have regressed.

[S8TY]

Getting rid of Cocu was unfortunately inevitable but having no replacement is scandolous.....Forest had one lined up...if its because we are in the middle of a takeover then Mel should've waited for them to make the decision , the takeover is being blamed for lack of decisive action being taken so Mel won't appoint a new manager but is ok to appoint a technical director in Mac....wow!! game saver that 

[Ramarena]

55 minutes ago, S8TY said:

Exactly this...we are in a proper mess to be honest....I don't know about anyone else but i agree with @Mafiabob this whole situation is really getting me down...football does affect your life afterall ....

Mel has made things worse by bringing Mac back for me , if he was back to manage then fair enough ( not my choice though ) he is a coach sat in the stands and going into the dressing room ??

I thought Rooney looked lost today in the technical area and said nothing as far as i could make out, but the real reason I am so down is.....this mess has been compounded by our Mel by bringing Mac back into an alien role whilst we carry on with 4 wannabe managers that have now had a chat and decided Rooney will be the voice!!? if that fails will it be Rosenior next / or Given ? or maybe back to Mac ? someone who's been sacked twice ...I mean ...please tell me all of this is a bad dream ffs....

Now if we do appoint a Paul Cook type manager what about Rooney ? does he stay ? does he play ? what about Mac does he still go in the dressing room ? I mean for pity's sake this is an embarrasing mess and instead of getting better is actually getting worse!!

will the new owners clear the decks and bring in there own manager and his own coaches  ?or will they need to assess things first taking yet more time and you can bet it will mean the window will have shut or be close to shutting so guess what ? we missed any targets our magnificent scouting team led by Macs son had drawn up...you can just hear the excuses being readied now... and is Mac the man to help them ? or Mel ? Its a complete and utter joke and mis management at its best....the red dogs down the road must be wetting themselves with laughter......

I think the single most worrying thing is this....who trusts the current people at the club like Mel or Mac to make the correct decisions for the good of Derby County Football Club......not themselves but the club....this whole mess is self generated and big bold decisions need to be made and I don't think thats going to happen!! 

from a totally disillusioned unhappy fan who has supported this club through thick and thin for years and will continue to do so albeit with a heavy heart....sad times indeed

I can’t see how Rooney would stay if he was demoted, he looked completely disinterested under Cocu towards the end, you’re telling me going to knuckle down and keep playing to his best under a new manager???? Can’t see it myself.

The problem in that situation is what happens with his contract......This guy doesn’t have the class of Cocu he’s going to want his pound of flesh and the rest!

This is why I think he’s actually the future plan. We can’t afford to risk demoting him.......as you say it’s a mess!

 

[uttoxram75]

1 hour ago, Jourdan said:

To me, a good and fair time to have made the call on Cocu was after Huddersfield away.

Imagine if a new manager had had Barnsley, QPR and Wycombe at home to have a go at picking things up.

The fact that we gave Cocu five more games in charge, including two of those pivotal home games, may be looked upon as the difference between staying up and going down when May comes around.

We needed to stick with Cocu. Yes it was slow progress but we were beginning to play better and turn it round. He was given a 4 year contract because of his previous management success. We decided one season and 11 games was enough.....pathetic, the guy was building a dynasty

Either Mel or the new owners panicked and now we are in limbo. Until the new owners take over we can't have a permanent manager so Rooney is in the hot seat for now.

 

 

 

[DCFC1388]

People saying when we sacked Cocu we should have had someone lined up, maybe the new owners did/do but cant confirm it until the takeover is complete.

To be fair, pretty much straight after Cocu left it came out that Rooney etc would take charge for the next 3 games. Those 3 games have now passed & with Rooneys statement of the takeover being days away I do wonder if something will happen before the Coventry game.

[Beanie]

14 hours ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

A big rabbit? Isn't Peter a more appropriate name? 

Looks like he'd be a good number 2...?

Thats clever it deserves something 

[MackworthRamIsGod]

4 hours ago, DCFC1388 said:

People saying when we sacked Cocu we should have had someone lined up, maybe the new owners did/do but cant confirm it until the takeover is complete.

To be fair, pretty much straight after Cocu left it came out that Rooney etc would take charge for the next 3 games. Those 3 games have now passed & with Rooneys statement of the takeover being days away I do wonder if something will happen before the Coventry game.

Or maybe the new owners did have someone lined up, but they dont want it now.

Like I said, when we sacked Cocu, although our league position was poor, it was recoverable, we had winnable games coming up and we werent 6 points adrift.

Now, we are almost passed the winnable games and are 6 points adrift.

After Coventry we have got Millwall, Brentford, Stoke, Swansea. If any new potential manager had been watching this squad of players over the last few weeks they would probably quickly realise theres not a lot they could do. We could genuinely be over 10 points adrift of safety by the time the transfer window opens.

[JustOneBiblicalKazim]

Wouldn’t mind Chris Powell, certainly over the likes of Terry and Rooney 

[wollatonram]

9 hours ago, uttoxram75 said:

We needed to stick with Cocu. Yes it was slow progress but we were beginning to play better and turn it round. He was given a 4 year contract because of his previous management success. We decided one season and 11 games was enough.....pathetic, the guy was building a dynasty

Either Mel or the new owners panicked and now we are in limbo. Until the new owners take over we can't have a permanent manager so Rooney is in the hot seat for now.

 

 

 

Are you mental 

[i-Ram]

6 minutes ago, wollatonram said:

Are you mental 

If he is he is unlikely to acknowledge it.  For what worth I agree with him. We were a decent striker or two away from having a competitive team. Cocu was let down in the last couple of weeks of the transfer window. He had to take 3 strikers on frees, neither of whom were ready for immediate first time football. Duncan and Ibe are still struggling, and we got our first proper glimpse of Richard’s yesterday.

Anyway can’t stay and chat, got a therapy meeting in 5 minutes.

 

[uttoxram75]

15 minutes ago, wollatonram said:

Are you mental 

probably

[Jimbo Ram]

11 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

If he is he is unlikely to acknowledge it.  For what worth I agree with him. We were a decent striker or two away from having a competitive team. Cocu was let down in the last couple of weeks of the transfer window. He had to take 3 strikers on frees, neither of whom were ready for immediate first time football. Duncan and Ibe are still struggling, and we got our first proper glimpse of Richard’s yesterday.

Anyway can’t stay and chat, got a therapy meeting in 5 minutes.

 

If it is a straight choice between Wazza and Cocu, Cocu every time ?

[CWC1983]

Theres an Anton Ferdinand documentary on BBC tomorrow that will no doubt bring John Terry back into the spotlight.

If he was the preferred choice a few weeks ago perhaps its been put on hold until the club assess the media / public reaction.  

[Ramarena]

1 hour ago, wollatonram said:

Are you mental 

I must be mental too, because in hind sight I’d rather have stuck another few weeks with Cocu than the mess we have had with the committee and Rooney!

Cocu’s time had pretty much come but we needed to do what the red dogs did and have a manager lined up and ready to go not limp along with the work experience!

[Chris_Martin]

14 hours ago, wollatonram said:

Waghorn - most of his career at this level and never come close to a 20 goal season

Lawrence - sorry but he is awful, slows every attack down and just shoots when he sees the goal . MASSIVELY overrated and other teams don’t see him as a threat

Clarke - he is okay but that’s it. We have never looked solid since he has come in and our set piece record at both ends speak for itself. not close to being best in the division.

Beliek - his price tag speaks for itself, massively overpaid for him and he’s never fit so it’s almost irrelevant.

Marshall - are you joking? The guy has been bang average since he arrived, look at the goal today. He has a good rep but that’s it, and that goes for the entire squad - too many players living off former glories, young and old.

Joz - goal against Holland? Oh great, how many goals or assists has he got for us? And you are talking about any top 6 team taking him? It is madness 

like I say, OVERRATED. The squad is the problem not the managers

Waghorn - Yeah ok he hasn't hit 20 goals a season, but he has got 12-16 goals every season since 2015. And considering most of them games were playing on the right i would say thats actually quite decent. 

Lawrence - agree with you that he slows play down but i think thats because Cocu has gradually killed his attacking instincts. He looked good under Lampard when they played fast football, you can't deny that. Tends to be a bit hit or miss but has actually rarely played in his best position since we signed him. When he's bad, he is bad, but when he's good, he's very very good. 

Bielik - Not sure how you can say he's always injured. Has had one injury in the last 3 years and it just happened to be a bad one. You don't get in the Poland national team if your not a good player.

Clarke - You say we've never looked solid since he's come in. We kept 12 clean sheets last season, even with Cocu in charge. You also say that we have a terrible record at set piece's, well it's been that way for a long time at Derby, way before Clarke joined. Are you forgetting he our current player of the season. Name the CB's that are better than him if you don't think he would get in a top 6 side. 

Jozwiak - Don't really understand your point about Jozwiak. You can't deny his quality, look at him playing for Poland, then you'll see what he's capable of. We need a manager who can get him to play to what he's capable of. And the fact that Southampton and Galatasaray wanted him I'm pretty sure he's good enough to be in a top 6 championship side. It's madness that you think he wouldn't.

Marshall - No I'm not joking. Has probably been our best player so far, made countless saves, probably earned us all 7 of our points in the league. Name some better keepers than Marshall in this league? don't think there are many.

If it's the players faults and not the manager. Then how can almost the same squad (bar 2/3 loan players) go from narrowly losing the play off final, to failing so miserably last season? 

My point is that the players are generally all capable of being top 6, we just need a manager/coaches who can get them to play to what their capable of.  

[DCFC Kicks]

37 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

Waghorn - Yeah ok he hasn't hit 20 goals a season, but he has got 12-16 goals every season since 2015. And considering most of them games were playing on the right i would say thats actually quite decent. 

Lawrence - agree with you that he slows play down but i think thats because Cocu has gradually killed his attacking instincts. He looked good under Lampard when they played fast football, you can't deny that. Tends to be a bit hit or miss but has actually rarely played in his best position since we signed him. When he's bad, he is bad, but when he's good, he's very very good. 

Bielik - Not sure how you can say he's always injured. Has had one injury in the last 3 years and it just happened to be a bad one. You don't get in the Poland national team if your not a good player.

Clarke - You say we've never looked solid since he's come in. We kept 12 clean sheets last season, even with Cocu in charge. You also say that we have a terrible record at set piece's, well it's been that way for a long time at Derby, way before Clarke joined. Are you forgetting he our current player of the season. Name the CB's that are better than him if you don't think he would get in a top 6 side. 

Jozwiak - Don't really understand your point about Jozwiak. You can't deny his quality, look at him playing for Poland, then you'll see what he's capable of. We need a manager who can get him to play to what he's capable of. And the fact that Southampton and Galatasaray wanted him I'm pretty sure he's good enough to be in a top 6 championship side. It's madness that you think he wouldn't.

Marshall - No I'm not joking. Has probably been our best player so far, made countless saves, probably earned us all 7 of our points in the league. Name some better keepers than Marshall in this league? don't think there are many.

If it's the players faults and not the manager. Then how can almost the same squad (bar 2/3 loan players) go from narrowly losing the play off final, to failing so miserably last season? 

My point is that the players are generally all capable of being top 6, we just need a manager/coaches who can get them to play to what their capable of.  

I agree mostly but,

It doesn't matter how good Clarke is when he's had to play along side terrible RCB's mostly. (apart from that one time Phil played him in RCB, I will never understand the logic behind that). It also doesn't help he seems to play with a different CB partner and or in a different system every other week. I can name 6 different players he's played alongside in 1 and a bit seasons he's been here.

Bielik's hardly been available while he's been here so he's effectively not even been in the squad most of the time, so I don't know how you can add him to your reasons for how this is a "top 6 squad".

You also say the same squad bar 2/3 loan players reached the play-off final, but they weren't just normal players, They're top quality. You've also forgot Keogh. Those 3 plus Keogh carried the whole team that season. 

Having said that, the players have the quality to easily be mid table and they would be if they had a decent manager.

[Ramarena]

41 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

Waghorn - Yeah ok he hasn't hit 20 goals a season, but he has got 12-16 goals every season since 2015. And considering most of them games were playing on the right i would say thats actually quite decent. 

Lawrence - agree with you that he slows play down but i think thats because Cocu has gradually killed his attacking instincts. He looked good under Lampard when they played fast football, you can't deny that. Tends to be a bit hit or miss but has actually rarely played in his best position since we signed him. When he's bad, he is bad, but when he's good, he's very very good. 

Bielik - Not sure how you can say he's always injured. Has had one injury in the last 3 years and it just happened to be a bad one. You don't get in the Poland national team if your not a good player.

Clarke - You say we've never looked solid since he's come in. We kept 12 clean sheets last season, even with Cocu in charge. You also say that we have a terrible record at set piece's, well it's been that way for a long time at Derby, way before Clarke joined. Are you forgetting he our current player of the season. Name the CB's that are better than him if you don't think he would get in a top 6 side. 

Jozwiak - Don't really understand your point about Jozwiak. You can't deny his quality, look at him playing for Poland, then you'll see what he's capable of. We need a manager who can get him to play to what he's capable of. And the fact that Southampton and Galatasaray wanted him I'm pretty sure he's good enough to be in a top 6 championship side. It's madness that you think he wouldn't.

Marshall - No I'm not joking. Has probably been our best player so far, made countless saves, probably earned us all 7 of our points in the league. Name some better keepers than Marshall in this league? don't think there are many.

If it's the players faults and not the manager. Then how can almost the same squad (bar 2/3 loan players) go from narrowly losing the play off final, to failing so miserably last season? 

My point is that the players are generally all capable of being top 6, we just need a manager/coaches who can get them to play to what their capable of.  

Agree with most of that but the players do bare some responsibility, we know many of them are capable of better no matter who is managing them.

Some of them need to take a long look in the mirror!

[Chris_Martin]

12 minutes ago, DCFClks said:

I agree mostly but,

It doesn't matter how good Clarke is when he's had to play along side terrible RCB's mostly. (apart from that one time Phil played him in RCB, I will never understand the logic behind that). It also doesn't help he seems to play with a different CB partner and or in a different system every other week. I can name 6 different players he's played alongside in 1 and a bit seasons he's been here.

Bielik's hardly been available while he's been here so he's effectively not even been in the squad most of the time, so I don't know how you can add him to your reasons for how this is a "top 6 squad".

You also say the same squad bar 2/3 loan players reached the play-off final, but they weren't just normal players, They're top quality. You've also forgot Keogh. Those 3 plus Keogh carried the whole team that season. 

Having said that, the players have the quality to easily be mid table and they would be if they had a decent manager.

Good points made there. 

Agree its been difficult for Clarke  with so much chopping and changing. But do you not think he would get in some of the better sides in this division and not look out of place?

Understand what your saying with Bielik but i was just trying to say the potential is there.

With regards the loan players, completely agree Mount was top quality, but Tomori hasn't done anything since he let Derby. Dosn't get a game for Chelsea, can't even get in a matchday squad. Don't get me wrong i absolutly loved him at Derby, but he was not very good in the air and positioning was questionable. More often than not his incredible pace bailed him out of trouble. Is Clarke any better or worse? on balance i don't think theres much in it. Harry Wilson was great for us, but if you take away the free kicks some games he was not really involved. Honestly thought he would go on to better things, but is now just back in the championship with Cardiff, would you really class him as a top quality player, i don't know. 

Agree with you about the manager though. 

[DCFC Kicks]

4 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

Good points made there. 

Agree its been difficult for Clarke  with so much chopping and changing. But do you not think he would get in some of the better sides in this division and not look out of place?

Understand what your saying with Bielik but i was just trying to say the potential is there.

With regards the loan players, completely agree Mount was top quality, but Tomori hasn't done anything since he let Derby. Dosn't get a game for Chelsea, can't even get in a matchday squad. Don't get me wrong i absolutly loved him at Derby, but he was not very good in the air and positioning was questionable. More often than not his incredible pace bailed him out of trouble. Is Clarke any better or worse? on balance i don't think theres much in it. Harry Wilson was great for us, but if you take away the free kicks some games he was not really involved. Honestly thought he would go on to better things, but is now just back in the championship with Cardiff, would you really class him as a top quality player, i don't know. 

Agree with you about the manager though. 

Yes Clarke is good, but you could swap Clarke for van Dijk in this back line and they'd still fail. One negative I would say of Clarke is that he's not much of a leader. That's why I think we have to play Davies at the moment.

I just don't think you can even mention Bielik. How can you criticise a manager because we have players like Beilik in the squad and therefore should be doing better, when the manager hasn't been able to play Bielik because he's not there.

I don't agree with you on the loan players. Thiers a reason Liverpool wanted £15 million for Wilson. He probably would have joined a prem team had there'd been no pandemic and it cost £2 million just to loan him. I think if Cardiff play him in the right way, he'll get them promoted. Tomori doesn't play because he's at Chelsea, he'd get into most prem teams outside the top six. He also has an England cap.

You've also not mentioned Keogh, integral part of the team for many seasons and was the base for how the entire team played for almost 8 years. Gone and never replaced.

and you forgot Mount. Full England international, top prem player. Even got an England cap while he was at Derby. He should never have even been in Championship with his quality. 

If you take those 4 out we'd have finished mid table that season, which is where we should be now. 

[hintonsboots]

Steve Cooper . Now there’s a proper manager. Am I on the correct thread ??