Is this our worst Championship team since 08?

[Ram-a-lama fa fa fa]

3 minutes ago, Animal is a Ram said:

To answer the question slightly differently, I think it's testament to the increasing quality of the division. 

The team that came down in '08 was lower than a snake's belly, and likely wouldn't hold a candle to the starting XI vs Blackburn - yet, they finished 18th.

agree. just looked at that 08 squad and jeez we had some crap!

id only put commons and hulse in this team. possibly barnes as well

[Bris Vegas]

35 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

Why don't you know?

Other people know after one game, call yourself a fan?

 

I don't know why i'm bothering tbh. We'll know next May if its our worst ever Championship team. By default, if we stay up it wont be our worst.

But the question wasn’t by next May, do you think this will be worst squad since 2008?

The question was the current set of players. Not the current set of players + potential signings between now and August 31.

Maybe I’ll rephrase.

Was the XI against Blackburn the worst Championship XI we have had since 2008?

Or is this current squad the worst Derby squad to have started a Championship season?

[rammieib]

Despite having God knows how many people in technical or scouting positions, a combination of them and our manager can't attract players good enough to come to this club sadly.

 

[Bris Vegas]

12 minutes ago, Animal is a Ram said:

To answer the question slightly differently, I think it's testament to the increasing quality of the division. 

The team that came down in '08 was lower than a snake's belly, and likely wouldn't hold a candle to the starting XI vs Blackburn - yet, they finished 18th.

Starting line up vs. Doncaster

                                                  Carroll

Albrechtsen             McEveley            Stubbs                 Mears

 Kazmierczak               Green       Pereplotkins          Commons

                                      Ellington         Hulse

 

and you thought a backline of Foz, Cashin, Nelson had pace issues? 

Carroll is better than any GK we have currently.

Mears was a decent player. Albrechtsen had played over 100 Championship games for WBA. Is that comparable to Nelson? McEverly is arguably better than Elder.

Commons and Hulse are better than anything we have now. 

Green was a solid player. Similar to Adams? 

Ellington, Kaz and Plop were awful.

I’d say that team had more individual quality than this current one.

[uttoxram75]

10 minutes ago, Bris Vegas said:

But the question wasn’t by next May, do you think this will be worst squad since 2008?

The question was the current set of players. Not the current set of players + potential signings between now and August 31.

Maybe I’ll rephrase.

Was the XI against Blackburn the worst Championship XI we have had since 2008?

Or is this current squad the worst Derby squad to have started a Championship season?

Your picking the wrong one to troll Bris.

I'll be the one singing the loudest in the South Stand all season and doing my best to get behind my team. 

As it stands, i have no idea how the season will pan out. If we keep out of a relegation fight, beat Stoke and Leeds twice, i'll be happy.

[Bris Vegas]

1 hour ago, uttoxram75 said:

Your picking the wrong one to troll Bris.

I'll be the one singing the loudest in the South Stand all season and doing my best to get behind my team. 

As it stands, i have no idea how the season will pan out. If we keep out of a relegation fight, beat Stoke and Leeds twice, i'll be happy.

I’m not attempting to troll anyone. 

This forum is unfortunately becoming a mini version of Twitter. Rather than debating the point, or ignoring it, too many are content to leave snide comments or derail topics with personal agendas based on who said what, not what was actually said.

It would probably be better off if David changed everybody’s name to anonymous and the icon to a Ram. At least then we may actually have some decent discussion without the personal jibes thrown in.

[i-Ram]

6 hours ago, uttoxram75 said:

Your picking the wrong one to troll Bris.

I'll be the one singing the loudest in the South Stand all season and doing my best to get behind my team. 

Oh I do enjoy a good old ‘l’m a proper fan’ post. 

[Eaststander7]

7 hours ago, rammieib said:

Despite having God knows how many people in technical or scouting positions, a combination of them and our manager can't attract players good enough to come to this club sadly.

 

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Eaststander7]

7 hours ago, uttoxram75 said:

Your picking the wrong one to troll Bris.

I'll be the one singing the loudest in the South Stand all season and doing my best to get behind my team. 

As it stands, i have no idea how the season will pan out. If we keep out of a relegation fight, beat Stoke and Leeds twice, i'll be happy.

Omg….. a sensible post 

l need to have a lie down 

[Jayram]

We got promoted with a L1 squad and we still have a L1 squad give or take. Mr Clowes determination to run a tight ship financially is great in theory but sadly sustainability and competitiveness are mutually exclusive at this level. None of us know what budget PW has for players but it seems as though it isn’t quite enough to attract the kind of players who will make a major difference in the Championship. I’m sure PW will wring as much as he can out of the players we have but I don’t think as it stands we have a squad good enough to survive. Maybe if that is glaringly obvious by January Mr Clowes will have a rethink because the alternative could be a return to L1. 

[CBRammette]

Just saw this on twitter. seems appropriate
 

 

[Caerphilly Ram]

As it stands today, possibly. We’ve not yet signed our first choice goalkeeper, so in theory it’s weaker in that position than any squad since 08.

We’re still rumoured to be looking for 2 or 3 other players, so the depth is lacking in sheer numbers compared to the final squads of historic seasons.

But there’s a massive caveat to comparing the quality of an incomplete squad in the process of being finalised to the squads of the past. 
 

Having had a quick scan through, I don’t think this squad looks particularly worse than the 09/10 or 10/11 sides. Which had a handful of quality for the level at the time (09/10 - Barker, Barnes, Commons, Hulse. 10/11 - Barker, Commons, Ward, Hulse) but then also had a mix of aging pros at the end of decent careers, some youth that would go on to carve out good careers, and a smattering of players who were anywhere between solid and unremarkable. 
Which to me isn’t exactly far off where we are now, Forsyth, Nyambe, Nelson, Osborn, Barkhuizen, NML, Bradley, Collins, Jackson all have a fair few career appearances around champ level. Adams, Wilson, CBT and others have all played a lot at lower league and need to show they can step up. Cashin is young and has plenty of experience already. Ozoh and Goudmijn are as yet unknown quantities at this level so it’s unfair in my opinion to determine their quality as members of a championship side. 

Maybe comparing the quality of the squad at the end of the transfer window or the seasons end would make for a more balanced comparison of quality. At the moment it’s a bit like comparing two cakes, one of which hasn’t yet finished being baked.

[Caerphilly Ram]

6 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

I’m not attempting to troll anyone. 

This forum is unfortunately becoming a mini version of Twitter. Rather than debating the point, or ignoring it, too many are content to leave snide comments or derail topics with personal agendas based on who said what, not what was actually said.

It would probably be better off if David changed everybody’s name to anonymous and the icon to a Ram. At least then we may actually have some decent discussion without the personal jibes thrown in.

On this point, as someone who has clashed with your style of posting in the past I’m going to volunteer some constructive feedback of which it’s up to you if you act on it. 
What is it that’s caused the reaction in this thread? How could you phrase the question differently to promote the discussion and debate you’re seeking?

My suggestion would be by using open questions to invite opinion rather than pre-loading it with an emotive word like “worst”. Something like “How does the current squad, without further additions, compare to previous championship squads” invites opinion and discussion without prefacing it with an implication that it is the worst. Just a thought. 

[ossieram]

6 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

I’m not attempting to troll anyone. 

This forum is unfortunately becoming a mini version of Twitter. Rather than debating the point, or ignoring it, too many are content to leave snide comments or derail topics with personal agendas based on who said what, not what was actually said.

It would probably be better off if David changed everybody’s name to anonymous and the icon to a Ram. At least then we may actually have some decent discussion without the personal jibes thrown in.

It wouldn't take long to work out who certain people are.

[Crewton]

8 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

Carroll is better than any GK we have currently.

[Magicman]

We will need to get the keeper, strikers and gel them together soon. Avoiding relegation is our priority . Cloughs' teams were often boring to watch.

[Chester40]

6 hours ago, Bris Vegas said:

 

It would probably be better off if David changed everybody’s name to anonymous and the icon to a Ram. At least then we may actually have some decent discussion without the personal jibes thrown in.

That's your worst post ever!

Talk about taking away any personality, humour, enjoyment and context to the forum.

PS if no one knew who was posting what, you would definitely be one of the first to stop!

Edited August 16 by Chester40

[IlsonDerby]

29 minutes ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

On this point, as someone who has clashed with your style of posting in the past I’m going to volunteer some constructive feedback of which it’s up to you if you act on it. 
What is it that’s caused the reaction in this thread? How could you phrase the question differently to promote the discussion and debate you’re seeking?

My suggestion would be by using open questions to invite opinion rather than pre-loading it with an emotive word like “worst”. Something like “How does the current squad, without further additions, compare to previous championship squads” invites opinion and discussion without prefacing it with an implication that it is the worst. Just a thought. 

Or people could not be absolute snowflakes 😂 he asked whether this is the worst squad since we last arrived in the championship. It’s just a question yet some have latched onto it like it’s purely been asked to hammer the club. 
 

Actually answering the question - I think it’s on par with some of those poor squads but the competition has improved so relative to the rest of the league I think the answer might be yes, relative to the actual question I’d say maybe no? 

[Anag Ram]

I think we need to strengthen the squad for sure, but with a couple of additions, the first team should be competitive in most games.

My worry would be if we got injuries to key players. 

I don’t look at many first team players and think they can’t play. 
 

[Caerphilly Ram]

1 minute ago, IlsonDerby said:

Or people could not be absolute snowflakes 😂 he asked whether this is the worst squad since we last arrived in the championship. It’s just a question yet some have latched onto it like it’s purely been asked to hammer the club. 
 

Actually answering the question - I think it’s on par with some of those poor squads but the competition has improved so relative to the rest of the league I think the answer might be yes, relative to the actual question I’d say maybe no? 

I answered the question fairly and took it as intended, others haven’t, and Bris himself has expressed concern around the reaction to him. 

Was just offering a suggestion to avoid more of the divisive, reactive stuff on here. Like calling people snowflakes as an example 🙄 You want an open debate, you ask open questions, you want a hot take you ask a loaded question. I took a few days off from posting following the Blackburn result, perhaps I am a snowflake after all and should just carry on not bothering rather than suggesting a sensible solution to the apparent problem.