Lots of players out of contract in Summer

[Comrade 86]

7 minutes ago, oodledoodle said:

You sound like my Mrs

She has my deepest sympathy, on so many levels.

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

3 hours ago, hintonsboots said:

If we get promoted how many of them would you keep ?

This season would be a great time to go up so we can rebuild for the Championship and not League 1 

[jimtastic56]

1 hour ago, Chris_Martin said:

probably not but will any striker get us enough goals playing in this negative style ?

waghorn has been injured for a lot of them 2 seasons by the way.

Correct but 3 goals in 51 games shows what a step up the Championship is . Understand your feelings about Warne .

[Chris_Martin]

11 minutes ago, jimtastic56 said:

Correct but 3 goals in 51 games shows what a step up the Championship is . Understand your feelings about Warne .

to be fair to waghorn a lot of them appearances have been cameos off the bench

[DCFC Kicks]

I'm shocked so many on here don't realise how good of a player Hourihane is. Maybe its because he's wasted in our current team. He's top end Championship quality.

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

34 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

to be fair to waghorn a lot of them appearances have been cameos off the bench

[Comrade 86]

1 hour ago, jimtastic56 said:

Correct but 3 goals in 51 games shows what a step up the Championship is . Understand your feelings about Warne .

I think it's got a lot to do with confidence and feeling in a good place with Waggy. He needs to feel loved and right now I hope he does, as he's earned it. Keep him happy and healthy and he'll be our best signing of the window. He's a fair bit better than L1 level at peak and to my eye he looks in better shape physically than I've seen in a fair while. He'll always be a bit of a unit but he does look to have cut some bulk and I think he looks sharper for it and he's still strong as an ox anyway.

Long may it last.

[Ambitious]

My genuine concern is that we plan on recycling through free agency from year to year, giving players one/two year deals that does little to build and install a culture at a club. Obviously, it doesn’t always have to be done in that fashion - Forest have famously signed 44 players in the last three transfer window. There’s many ways of doing it.

I just feel that we have such a short-term mindset and pushing all our chips into the middle of the table on experienced pros, who are out of contract from Championship clubs in the hope that they have enough to win promotion. I think our recruitment strategy is hugely different to any other side in League One. I don’t think our approach is that much different to what it was under Mel Morris - minus the splash loan signings. It has the same feel to it, just on a smaller scale. 

I think to the day I die, I’ll be critical of the recruitment staff at this club. The last time where we really showed any competence in that regard was under George Burley - Rasiak, Smith, Peschisolido, Reich, Bisgaard and Idiakez all signed on frees in a 6 month period. Of course, they weren’t all hits, but he was able to out-perform his budget significantly. He showed some creativity in the market - Rasiak and Idiakez are two of the best players I’ve seen at this club in my lifetime. Signed as out of contract overseas players. 

Clough did ok, but also brought some shockers to the club. McClaren was a good coach, did well with loans but recruitment wasn’t brilliant. We’ve always seem to have a restricted pool of players available to us, it would be good to see us spread our wings a little bit - push the recruitment strategy and go find those players in the lower divisions in France, Germany, Spain, wherever who clearly have technical ability, quickness and an edge to their game. It takes a bit of work, but everything is available remotely now via wyscout and other platforms. 

[Ghost of Clough]

7 hours ago, Ambitious said:

We’ve always seem to have a restricted pool of players available to us, it would be good to see us spread our wings a little bit - push the recruitment strategy and go find those players in the lower divisions in France, Germany, Spain, wherever who clearly have technical ability, quickness and an edge to their game. It takes a bit of work, but everything is available remotely now via wyscout and other platforms. 

I agree, although I think the Scandinavian market is the one to tap into at the moment due players from those countries being a better match to the expected physicality of our leagues. Belgium and Netherlands are still worthwhile checking out, but less likely to get as many players who can adapt.

Some managers don't like statistical recruitment. Then you have those who will only look at certain data. Warne for example loves his running data (we've heard him pick out Knight and Thompson for this), whilst he taken a snipe at people comparing more technical data such as crosses.

Edited September 8, 2023 by Ghost of Clough

[DCFC1388]

7 hours ago, Ambitious said:

My genuine concern is that we plan on recycling through free agency from year to year, giving players one/two year deals that does little to build and install a culture at a club. Obviously, it doesn’t always have to be done in that fashion - Forest have famously signed 44 players in the last three transfer window. There’s many ways of doing it.

I just feel that we have such a short-term mindset and pushing all our chips into the middle of the table on experienced pros, who are out of contract from Championship clubs in the hope that they have enough to win promotion. I think our recruitment strategy is hugely different to any other side in League One. I don’t think our approach is that much different to what it was under Mel Morris - minus the splash loan signings. It has the same feel to it, just on a smaller scale. 

Do you not think that is mainly down to the restrictions that are in place. We haven't spent any money on transfer fee's for a few years now but I don't think that is really through choice more like a necessity.

Last year it looks liked the max we could offer was 2 years which is why at the end of this season we have so many out of contract, this was always going to happen unfortunately. We will have to see what our transfer activity is like next summer before we can judge Clowes and/or the current recruitment team.

I do however agree with the rest of your post. Our recent transfers from abroad have been shocking, I cant even remember our last good one? Bueno maybe? 

Edited September 8, 2023 by DCFC1388

[Ghost of Clough]

2 minutes ago, DCFC1388 said:

Do you not think that is mainly down to the restrictions that are in place. We haven't spent any money on transfer fee's for a few years now but I don't think that is really through choice more like a necessity.

Last year it looks liked the max we could offer was 2 years which is why at the end of this season we have so many out of contract, this was always going to happen unfortunately. We will have to see what our transfer activity is like next summer before we can judge Clowes and/or the current recruitment team.

I do however agree with the rest of your post. Our recent transfers from abroad have been shocking, I cant even remember our last good one? Bueno maybe? 

Last year, yes. We could only offer 2 year deals. however, we can no offer at least 3 year deals, with Rooney being the only existing under contract player to have extended his deal . We should start seeing more, in particular: Wildsmith, Cashin, Thompson, Bird, and Sibley. However, 2 of those will likely want to be given a consistent run in their preferred positions before committing and the other 3 will be want to be playing Championship football next season whether with us or another club. The remaining players who are out of contract will likely have their fate decided by which division we play in next season.

[DCFC1388]

24 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Last year, yes. We could only offer 2 year deals. however, we can no offer at least 3 year deals, with Rooney being the only existing under contract player to have extended his deal . We should start seeing more, in particular: Wildsmith, Cashin, Thompson, Bird, and Sibley. However, 2 of those will likely want to be given a consistent run in their preferred positions before committing and the other 3 will be want to be playing Championship football next season whether with us or another club. The remaining players who are out of contract will likely have their fate decided by which division we play in next season.

I'm sure there will be deals on offer to all players Warne wants to keep beyond this season whether in League 1 or 2, especially the youngsters as we have to offer them a deal to get a compensation fee if they leave (i think).

[RoyMac5]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I agree, although I think the Scandinavian market is the one to tap into at the moment due players from those countries being a better match to the expected physicality of our leagues. Belgium and Netherlands are still worthwhile checking out, but less likely to get as many players who can adapt.

Some managers don't like statistical recruitment. Then you have those who will only look at certain data. Warne for example loves his running data (we've heard him pick out Knight and Thompson for this), whilst he taken a snipe at people comparing more technical data such as crosses.

I would have hoped that our new 'recruitment setup' was going to do exactly that sort of thing. It seems to me one of the few ways to widen our net, as I can't see Warne have personal contacts outside of England? I wonder if there will be a clash of 'cultures' happening in recruitment soon?

Edited September 8, 2023 by RoyMac5

[MadAmster]

My take.... Loach, Fozzy and maybe Waggy will retire. Cash and Bird will go, IMO. Tommo and Sibs likely to stay. Not much point in having NML and Barks if we aren't going to play wingers and neither of them is a wing back. Hourihane, Smith and Collins to be let go? All of which means another rebuild next summer. That would be 3 consecutive summers of squad rebuilding. Probably not the best plan going forward.

[roboto]

1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said:

I would have hoped that our new 'recruitment setup' was going to do exactly that sort of thing. It seems to me one of the few ways to widen our net, as I can't see Warne have personal contacts outside of England? I wonder if there will be a clash of 'cultures' happening in recruitment soon?

Wasn't there some sort of issue with registering international players due to the Poznan/Jozwiak payment saga? I think it got mentioned briefly somewhere that UEFA wouldn't allow us to register players, or something like that, but not sure how true it was.

Might explain why we haven't signed any players from outside of the English league system. Even the links to players in Ireland that were within our financial capabilities didn't seem to come to fruition.

[RoyMac5]

5 minutes ago, roboto said:

Wasn't there some sort of issue with registering international players due to the Poznan/Jozwiak payment saga? I think it got mentioned briefly somewhere that UEFA wouldn't allow us to register players, or something like that, but not sure how true it was.

Might explain why we haven't signed any players from outside of the English league system. Even the links to players in Ireland that were within our financial capabilities didn't seem to come to fruition.

Wasn't that paid off in July? 

[Ram a lamb a ding dong]

That would be a great question to ask at the forum 

[Walkley Ram]

1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said:

I would have hoped that our new 'recruitment setup' was going to do exactly that sort of thing. It seems to me one of the few ways to widen our net, as I can't see Warne have personal contacts outside of England? I wonder if there will be a clash of 'cultures' happening in recruitment soon?

We took Oxford's recruitment team didn't we? I seem to remember it was earlier this year. They've been able to unearth some real gems, and have made back good money on the players they've turned over. Time will tell, but at the moment it's not looking like they've done the same for us. Unless the targets they identified were too expensive or unrealistic.

Maybe players see the name "Derby County" and expect a bigger payday than they would when they see "Oxford United".

[ram59]

Restrictions have put us in a place whereby we have many players out of contact next season. In order to extend any  of those contracts you need agreement on both sides and looking at next year's situation from both the club and the players' point of view, it's very difficult to get agreement.

ATM, there's a great deal of uncertainty which division this club will be in next season. It makes it difficult for the club to decide who they want to keep and how much they can offer. Likewise, will players be satisfied playing more lg1 football?

[Stuniverse]

17 hours ago, Curtains said:

What does this tell us 

Players out of contract next summer: Liam Thompson, Nathaniel Mendez-Laing, Tom Barkhuizen, Conor Hourihane, Korey Smith, Martyn Waghorn, Louie Sibley, James Collins, Eiran Cashin, Max Bird, Craig Forsyth, Scott Loach

Mainly that when we signed players in the summer of 2022 that we could only offer two-year contracts.