The Paul Warne Poll

[FlyBritishMidland]

5 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

7th, behind Magner, Rosenior, Mac1, Wassall, Clough and Clement. Also 7th for win percentage, with Cecil Potter moving up to 6th spot and Clement dropping down a few places.

I meant win percentage.  And it related to managers having been in charge for at least 20 games so a reasonable spell, otherwise David Lowe would be the best ever and never be beaten.  That would discount Rosenior and Wassall making PW 5th, although I though he’d moved up to 4th but stand corrected.

[May Contain Nuts]

17 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

Posturing, presumptive, judgemental, condescending nonsense, and some.

Didn't use any naughty words though, so it's all fine.

[i-Ram]

2 minutes ago, Kokosnuss said:

Didn't use any naughty words though, so it's all fine.

If your Darts were as good as your self-control tonight, you must have thrown some very good arrows.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

If your Darts were as good as your self-control tonight, you must have thrown some very good arrows.

No buddy, from what he said earlier when he was posting his nonsense he was too pissed 😂

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, sage said:

See my response to I-Ram below. I can't be arsed to repeat it to you because of the difficulties you have in reading what I'm saying 😂

Happy trolling.

[May Contain Nuts]

Well, somebody's well and truly lost the plot 🤣

Utterly bizarre.

 

[Mucker1884]

There was I, trying to work out whether we were looking at a pair of kippers, sharks, or prize carps… and it turns out one of them was actually a turkey all along!  🤔😜 🤪😵‍💫🥴
 

This is the best holiday read ever!  😎😁

Edited August 30, 2023 by Mucker1884

[alram]

On 28/08/2023 at 21:09, Wolfie said:

So we should only sign players who’ll still be with us in 5 years time? On our budget? With fans wanting quick promotion? OK. 

If fans want a quick promotion we shouldn’t be setting up a 5 year plan

 

i don’t care how long it takes us to get out the league as long as I see clear progression not is fumbling around in the market offering anyone over 30 deals

[alram]

On 28/08/2023 at 21:00, BOB BIGGS said:

I presume, but don’t know, that he sees it unfolding in 2 or 3 stages. First Stage is to get players in to get back into the Championship, followed by different players to try to consolidate our position. 
 

Only time will tell…

Yes I have no issue with that but the 5 year plan mentioned was just to be a championship club

[alram]

On 28/08/2023 at 19:54, Brailsford Ram said:

The lengths of the contracts suggest they won't see out the culmination of the five year plan but just help us through the period of restriction inflicted by the EFL agreed business plan.

If that’s the case and our approach changes next summer I’ll be fullly supportive of what I am seeing but the profile of players we are signing is by choice not by necessity there is loads of players at this level signed for frees that would suit a longer term vision  

[Ghost of Clough]

23 minutes ago, alram said:

If fans want a quick promotion we shouldn’t be setting up a 5 year plan

 

i don’t care how long it takes us to get out the league as long as I see clear progression not is fumbling around in the market offering anyone over 30 deals

The 5 year plan was to be a stable Championship club. An example of this playing out cold be:
Year 1 (last season): Challenge for top 6
Year 2: Win promotion
Year 3: Avoid relegation
Year 4: Lower-midtable
Year 5: Midtable
It doesn't mean (as I interpret from your posts) that we have 5 years to get back to the Championship.

Whilst I 100% agree with you on preferring to sign players the 'right side of 30', I can also see the opposite side of the argument. There are few young promising players available on a free or negligible fee. Wildsmith, Vickers, Rooney, Cashin, Ward, Wilson, Elder, Bird, Thompson, Fornah, Sibley and John-Jules all fit within the ideal age range, with the majority of our signings so far joining that group.

However, I feel we could have pushed harder on signings younger alternatives to the players we have signed, such as Matt Pennington, Lloyd Jones, Jack Sparkes, Jensen Weir, Aaron Pressley, Tyler Walker

[kevinhectoring]

33 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

The 5 year plan was to be a stable Championship club

it was a stroke of inspired pr      fans were talking about and expecting an immediate return to the championship. DC’s comments managed expectations whilst saying absolutely nothing about when the owner expected or wanted promotion.

It will have occurred to him that the two worst scenarios for the latest generation of clowses would be : to ramp up to championship outgoings, then to fail to be promoted. or (even worse) to ramp up, win promotion and then sink back down. Either might require him to follow in kirchner’s footsteps and sell a plane

 

[i-Ram]

18 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said:

it was a stroke of inspired pr      fans were talking about and expecting an immediate return to the championship. DC’s comments managed expectations whilst saying absolutely nothing about when the owner expected or wanted promotion.

It will have occurred to him that the two worst scenarios for the latest generation of clowses would be : to ramp up to championship outgoings, then to fail to be promoted. or (even worse) to ramp up, win promotion and then sink back down. Either might require him to follow in kirchner’s footsteps and sell a plane

or a set of chisels.

[Brammie Steve]

20 hours ago, ariotofmyown said:

I really liked that post, but you smell.

Of roses?

[Mostyn6]

I'm beginning to draw parallels with Nigel Clough. I think Warne clearly has a bit of man-management and work-ethic, however appears reluctant/unaware of where he's lacking, and doesn't appear to be willing/aware to fill the lacking areas with his backroom staff.

Nigel was very loyal to the likes of Crosby and Martin Taylor. I think Warne is similar, and this is not diverse enough in terms of skillset.

[ilkleyram]

2 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

The 5 year plan was to be a stable Championship club. An example of this playing out cold be:
Year 1 (last season): Challenge for top 6
Year 2: Win promotion
Year 3: Avoid relegation
Year 4: Lower-midtable
Year 5: Midtable
It doesn't mean (as I interpret from your posts) that we have 5 years to get back to the Championship.

Whilst I 100% agree with you on preferring to sign players the 'right side of 30', I can also see the opposite side of the argument. There are few young promising players available on a free or negligible fee. Wildsmith, Vickers, Rooney, Cashin, Ward, Wilson, Elder, Bird, Thompson, Fornah, Sibley and John-Jules all fit within the ideal age range, with the majority of our signings so far joining that group.

However, I feel we could have pushed harder on signings younger alternatives to the players we have signed, such as Matt Pennington, Lloyd Jones, Jack Sparkes, Jensen Weir, Aaron Pressley, Tyler Walker

You're right of course, that we have more players in the 'ideal' age range than perhaps some give credit to Clowes/Pearce/Warne for achieving.  From an age perspective only, the squad looks better balanced this season than last never mind what will happen over the next couple of days.  And maybe it's because the 5 year plan you describe is the one that is in their minds.

An alternative would be:

Year 1 (last season) Challenge for top 6

Year 2 (this season) In play offs/challenge for top 2

Year 3 (next season) Promotion from league 1

Year 4 Midtable/lower end of Championship.  Warne extends contract

Year 5 Top end of Championship/build for EPL

That effectively gives us two more transfer windows - January 24 and summer 24 - to reduce the average age of the squad still further whilst maintaining a core of senior/older/experienced players, with greater emphasis on more younger players arriving in the summer of 24 ahead of Year 3. And recruiting then with a significant eye on players who will also cope/prosper in the Championship (your 'younger list' being examples) so that the summer of 25 (year 4) becomes more of a 'topping up' window. 

All very interesting but as Billy Davies knows you can't pick your moment to get promoted and football teams rarely develop in a linear fashion.  Sometimes luck plays a larger role than planning and noises off are nowadays a more significant factor than in days gone by.

[alram]

3 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

The 5 year plan was to be a stable Championship club. An example of this playing out cold be:
Year 1 (last season): Challenge for top 6
Year 2: Win promotion
Year 3: Avoid relegation
Year 4: Lower-midtable
Year 5: Midtable
It doesn't mean (as I interpret from your posts) that we have 5 years to get back to the Championship.

Whilst I 100% agree with you on preferring to sign players the 'right side of 30', I can also see the opposite side of the argument. There are few young promising players available on a free or negligible fee. Wildsmith, Vickers, Rooney, Cashin, Ward, Wilson, Elder, Bird, Thompson, Fornah, Sibley and John-Jules all fit within the ideal age range, with the majority of our signings so far joining that group.

However, I feel we could have pushed harder on signings younger alternatives to the players we have signed, such as Matt Pennington, Lloyd Jones, Jack Sparkes, Jensen Weir, Aaron Pressley, Tyler Walker

i think you are pushing it calling the likes of wildsmith, vickers, ward & elder young to be honest! And the rest of those were already here apart from wilson & fornah who i said when they signed i am happy with them. 

 

it is definitely a myth that the only option we had was to sign older players, there is plenty at a good age and quality available with our restrictions

[Jourdan]

It all comes down to ambition v strategy and which to favour.

I think we would all love to see us strategically bringing in young players with potential to grow, but honestly is it really compatible with where we are as a club?

We are one of the biggest clubs in League One, let’s not forget. How much is that level of expectation and the need to show ambition weighing on us?

We seem to be recruiting players based on the idea that it will make a statement of intent, show ambition, get people talking, and most crucially, put bums on seats.

In terms of squad building and looking to the future, we probably shouldn’t have signed Hourihane, Barkhuizen, Smith, Chester, Davies, Stearman and McGoldrick last season and in many ways we could and should have signed alternatives to Nelson, Bradley, Elder, Washington, Waghorn and so on this season if we were looking to the future.

We have built the current squad on reputation and experience, not profile and potential. I don’t think style of play is a factor. We haven’t really excelled in any style as yet, only shown flashes of potential.

However it’s like a double edged sword. On one hand, fans will say we need pedigree and experience and we are Derby County and we shouldn’t settle for being the next Exeter City. On the other hand, fans will say we want to see young players with power and pace and to see the team grow together.

When you really think about it, in the position we are in, we can’t really win. If say last summer we had filled the squad with players similar to Oduroh and said trust the process, there would have been uproar after 15 games because ultimately the expectation is still there irrespective of the strategy.

[Rev]

38 minutes ago, Jourdan said:

If say last summer we had filled the squad with players similar to Oduroh and said trust the process, there would have been uproar after 15 games because ultimately the expectation is still there irrespective of the strategy.

I think the opposite.

Last season was the chance to go in that direction, I believe everyone would have accepted the new reality and got behind the boys regardless. 

Once we started bringing in ex prem footballers, and well known Championship players, that increased the fans expectations, alongside the recruitment of a new management team a few weeks later. 

I'm not saying the strategy DC went for was right or wrong, but if we'd have gone down the route of playing the kids, I'd suggest our fans would've backed it well beyond 15 games.

 

[Raich Carter]

The geek in me can't help but wonder if this poll allowed multiple votes over time and then plot the sentiment against games. I imagine the view is quite different after a couple of wins and if we lose a few then it'd be back to 'Warne out'... Fickle much? 😉