Conor Hourihane

[Srg]

2 minutes ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

It's sometimes got a whiff of entitlement to it in my view. Every time any player that has been tenuously connected with us looks like they are off somewhere else there's people (not just in here, but amongst our fans in general) pouncing on it like there wont be any players left by the end of June, and that Derby have some divine right to be front of the queue at this level purely because we are Derby.

Doesn't work like that. Of course I would love to see new players coming in that fit the bill as quickly as possible, but we've all been following Derby long enough to know it's never that simple and never will be.

It's the same whiff from those talking about style of play.

[Day]

Just now, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

It's sometimes got a whiff of entitlement to it in my view. Every time any player that has been tenuously connected with us looks like they are off somewhere else there's people (not just in here, but amongst our fans in general) pouncing on it like there wont be any players left by the end of June, and that Derby have some divine right to be front of the queue at this level purely because we are Derby.

Doesn't work like that.

Yeah, not sure I would use the word entitlement but that’s exactly what happens, every transfer window.

If the club were coming out announcing interest in a player that went elsewhere, I would understand it, yet it’s from journalists who have traffic targets to hit.

Derby being a big club down here will naturally be “linked” to a shed load of players, thought we would be all used to it now.

[CBX1985]

2 minutes ago, JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta said:

It's sometimes got a whiff of entitlement to it in my view. Every time any player that has been tenuously connected with us looks like they are off somewhere else there's people (not just in here, but amongst our fans in general) pouncing on it like there wont be any players left by the end of June, and that Derby have some divine right to be front of the queue at this level purely because we are Derby.

Doesn't work like that.

Indeed.  As though players should see any offer we make as akin to them playing for Rochdale and being asked transfer and lead the attack for Barcelona.  

We are a big club for our division, but there are bigger clubs out there.  Everyone has there own objectives for who they play for; players are human - they sometimes want to be close to family, shorter commute, get offered perks or benefits.  Multi millionaires have less need to be money driven.

We want people who want to be here and are reasonable.  Some will leave because we are not/no longer a good fit.  Some will come for the converse.  Panicking in the transfer market is what got us into trouble.  If players are too expensive, unfit, or unmotivated we are better off with someone else.  

Hourihane, I think, will want to finish his two years.  

[Foreveram]

8 minutes ago, David said:

Yeah, not sure I would use the word entitlement but that’s exactly what happens, every transfer window.

If the club were coming out announcing interest in a player that went elsewhere, I would understand it, yet it’s from journalists who have traffic targets to hit.

Derby being a big club down here will naturally be “linked” to a shed load of players, thought we would be all used to it now.

It must be time to panic, even Grimsby Town have Signed 3 players in the last two days including former England international Danny Rose….. oh wait it’s not that Danny Rose.

[Electric Ram]

Good luck to him if this is what he really wants to do, but in my humble opinion when we first signed him I was so excited we had a player of his quality joining us. sadly I was wrong i thought he had fairly average season and didn't live up to his reputation being innocuous in games and very poor in dead situations. god knows how he made that best league 1 team I'm sure if he goes we could bring in a few  decent freebie signings if his wages are freed up. 

[Ghost of Clough]

5 hours ago, Wolfie20 said:

Unless you can tell me otherwise, I'm assuming all our coaching roles are currently filled so, yeah, let's sack one to accommodate a player with just a year left on his contract or start going down the slippery slope of creating jobs which aren't necessary, particularly when the Club is still having to work to a business plan agreed with the EFL.

 

A number of positions to fill, including a role as 'Youth Development Phase Coach' and 'Professional Player to Coach Scheme – Academy Coach'

[Gerry Daly]

We need a more physical and aggressive player than Hourihane in the middle of the park. Him and Bird doesn't work and I would much prefer to keep Bird. I hope he does go and we can use his wages elsewhere 

[jimbobram]

On 08/06/2023 at 21:10, MackworthRamIsGod said:

God knows how I spell his name.

Slightly concerned to read he has a new job at Aston Villa coaching their under16s in the evening.

And when asked if he will still be at Derby his answer was "as it stands".

Who next to jump the ship, Betty the tea lady? Head hunted by Ebbsfleet United?

get a grip

[MACKWORTHRAM]

3 hours ago, Gerry Daly said:

We need a more physical and aggressive player than Hourihane in the middle of the park. Him and Bird doesn't work and I would much prefer to keep Bird. I hope he does go and we can use his wages elsewhere 

I honestly do not get the hype around Bird at all. 

I have no idea what he is. He's he a holding midfielder? Because he barely tackles and looks scared to head it. Far too lightweight.

Doesn't affect the game, doesn't control a game, doesn't score anywhere near enough goals and doesn't assist either. Flatters to deceive so many times.

For saying how good some of our fans think he is I thought he was poor on the whole last season. 

[MackworthRamIsGod]

1 hour ago, jimbobram said:

get a grip

"Get a grip" I cannot believe I missed that one off my "I was born in Derby and am a complete brain dead dufus" bingo card...unreal.

I always remember "give your head a wobble" because it makes no sense to me what so ever and "I bet your fun at parties" but forgot that nugget.

Thanks 👍 

[Andrew3000]

Agree. He's techn8cally very good and likeable but he does not seem to have a clear contribution. I don't think what he does is subtle or unappreciated either. He' can excell at passing and finishing but most of the time hes not anything. It's sad because he's gifted but can't carve out a niche. Connor scored, assisted and even tackled. I don't like them together, but I'd sooner have Smith and hourihane any day, just more balance and purpose.

[Ghost of Clough]

9 hours ago, MACKWORTHRAM said:

I honestly do not get the hype around Bird at all. 

I have no idea what he is. He's he a holding midfielder? Because he barely tackles and looks scared to head it. Far too lightweight.

Doesn't affect the game, doesn't control a game, doesn't score anywhere near enough goals and doesn't assist either. Flatters to deceive so many times.

For saying how good some of our fans think he is I thought he was poor on the whole last season. 

I dont think he's a DM, more of a tidy link up player who would be best slightly further up the pitch. However, in the recent past we did have a DM who was adored by the fans but his output was never questioned.

Thorne joined Derby aged 21 and scored 5 and assisted 6 in all competitions (73 apps). Thorne was playing in a side challenging for promotion every season and was surrounded with better players.

Bird turned 21 at the start of the 21/22 season and scored 4 goals and assisted 8 in all competitions since then (94 apps). Bird has only ever been in sides struggling towards the bottom of the table (until last season) with players not as good as those Thorne played with.

Bird had a career best of 8 goal contributions last season. Thorne's best was 7 in 15/16 with his next best being 4 in 13/14 (split between Watford and Derby). 

[Van der MoodHoover]

14 hours ago, Electric Ram said:

...sadly I was wrong i thought he had fairly average season and didn't live up to his reputation being innocuous in games and very poor in dead situations. god knows how he made that best league 1 team I'm sure if he goes we could bring in a few  decent freebie signings if his wages are freed up. 

Lack of pace was a problem, but being dead does put it into some context.....🤣

[Caerphilly Ram]

39 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said:

Lack of pace was a problem, but being dead does put it into some context.....🤣

Hopefully Warne works a spot of voodoo magic with our recruitment and resurrects Bird in the eyes of some supporters

[Blondest Goat]

Assuming he's part of Warnes plans...

[Chester40]

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I dont think he's a DM, more of a tidy link up player who would be best slightly further up the pitch. However, in the recent past we did have a DM who was adored by the fans but his output was never questioned.

Thorne joined Derby aged 21 and scored 5 and assisted 6 in all competitions (73 apps). Thorne was playing in a side challenging for promotion every season and was surrounded with better players.

Bird turned 21 at the start of the 21/22 season and scored 4 goals and assisted 8 in all competitions since then (94 apps). Bird has only ever been in sides struggling towards the bottom of the table (until last season) with players not as good as those Thorne played with.

Bird had a career best of 8 goal contributions last season. Thorne's best was 7 in 15/16 with his next best being 4 in 13/14 (split between Watford and Derby). 

Wellllll...  @Ghost of Clough, you have just proved Gorgeous George was massively over-rated... I've no problem with that argument 😜

[May Contain Nuts]

3 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I dont think he's a DM, more of a tidy link up player who would be best slightly further up the pitch. However, in the recent past we did have a DM who was adored by the fans but his output was never questioned.

Thorne joined Derby aged 21 and scored 5 and assisted 6 in all competitions (73 apps). Thorne was playing in a side challenging for promotion every season and was surrounded with better players.

Bird turned 21 at the start of the 21/22 season and scored 4 goals and assisted 8 in all competitions since then (94 apps). Bird has only ever been in sides struggling towards the bottom of the table (until last season) with players not as good as those Thorne played with.

Bird had a career best of 8 goal contributions last season. Thorne's best was 7 in 15/16 with his next best being 4 in 13/14 (split between Watford and Derby). 

People's judgement of these two players isn't just down to their goal contributions though. Whilst Bird isn't really a DM, it is the position on the pitch he's most often played so people make that association, so the defensive side of his game comes into question perhaps more than it should.

Then again, with him playing in lesser teams and often deployed as a DM you might expect his defensive contributions to be the higher of the two?

I'm not sure bringing Thorne into the discussion does Bird all that many favours really - he was a 'proper' DM who had some goals in his locker, the goals were a bonus. What Thorne had, something that Bird (currently) lacks was a real sense of presence. An almost imperious authority over players much older and more experienced than himself. A bit like Bielik he possessed the ability to damn near control a midfield on his own, going both ways.

Bird's defensive abilities are nowhere near as bad as some make out - and this is not a post designed to try to prove that they are, this post is to show why Thorne was so highly regarded and why his injury hit career has felt such a waste - but if we are making a comparison between the two...

(League only)
Appearances/Minutes Played
Thorne: 69 (4687) - only 12 / 1011 of these were before his ACL injury
Bird: 139 (10647)

Tackles made / Success rate / Every x minute
Thorne: 171 / 71.5% / 19.6
Bird: 207 / 72.4% / 37.2

...in 2015/16 alone Thorne made 103 tackles. The past 2 seasons seasons combined, Bird has made 121 tackles.

Interceptions made / Every x minute
Thorne: 110 / 42.6
Bird: 134 / 79.5

Aerials won / success rate
Thorne: 85 / 58.6%
Bird: 126 /  47.5%

Blocked  Shots/Crosses/Passes  (every x minute)
Thorne: 26 / 14 / 62 (180.2 / 334.8 / 75.6)
Bird: 22 / 16 / 80 (484 / 665.4 / 133.1)

Times fouled / Every x minute
Thorne: 49 / 95.6
Bird: 48 / 221.8

 

 

Edited June 10, 2023 by Kokosnuss

[Blondest Goat]

Imagine how good Thorne would've looked in league one.  

[Gerry Daly]

3 minutes ago, Blondest Goat said:

Imagine how good Thorne would've looked in league one.  

Yeah for 5 minutes before he got injured, just like Bielik

[ollycutts1982]

Are we really comparing Bird to Thorne? Wow just wow. I knew some Rams fans were deluded but wow. 
 

I don’t get the hype around goals and assists for CDM’s, deeper lying midfielders who get us playing and keep us ticking over like Thorne did. Thorne was always available for the ball and always received it on the half turn and was progressive. Bird hides and is constantly square on so his only option is back to where it’s come from or the other CB. 

Anyone who disagrees go and look it up on YouTube. 

Edited June 10, 2023 by ollycutts1982