Rooney shouldn’t be allowed to bring in the players he wants

[turbo]

Might be an unpopular opinion but if the takeover all goes smoothly then I hoping we go about things differently.

The successful model applied by the majority of successfully promoted clubs involves a football director who overseas a team that delivers recruitment based on the clubs blueprint for success. The idea behind this is that if the manager leaves or is shown the door you are not left with a group of players that the next manager doesn’t want so you have to start out all over again, you need to be able to keep consistency if a piece of the cog is taken out of the club.

Whether finances will allow the club to run like this I don’t know

[Mostyn6]

Unworkable in majority of cases in English football. 

[LeedsCityRam]

5 minutes ago, turbo said:

Might be an unpopular opinion but if the takeover all goes smoothly then I hoping we go about things differently.

The successful model applied by the majority of successfully promoted clubs involves a football director who overseas a team that delivers recruitment based on the clubs blueprint for success. The idea behind this is that if the manager leaves or is shown the door you are not left with a group of players that the next manager doesn’t want so you have to start out all over again, you need to be able to keep consistency if a piece of the cog is taken out of the club.

Whether finances will allow the club to run like this I don’t know

There's merit in the underlying principle but the title of the thread is probably going to get some folks' back up.

Given what he has to had to put up with this season, Rooney deserves the opportunity to bring his own players into the club in a stable environment. Lets not forget the club has been hollowed out & so there is a massive job on to rebuild the first team & under 23 squad...Rooney's connections and draw will be crucial to entice players here so we can hit the ground running in League One. This is absolutely not the time to put restrictions on him other than a budget.

Going forward, yes it would be wise to have a Director of Football who recruits players on a manager's behalf but that appointment should only be made with Rooney's full buy in as a faciltator, not a restriction. The key point though is hiring a manager (when Rooney goes) who plays a very similar style of football to Rooney...it is the idiotic idea that you can bring in a manager with a totally different playing style that wastes money & necessitates squad rebuilds/wasted players.

Edited April 20, 2022 by LeedsCityRam

[DarkFruitsRam7]

13 minutes ago, turbo said:

Might be an unpopular opinion but if the takeover all goes smoothly then I hoping we go about things differently.

The successful model applied by the majority of successfully promoted clubs involves a football director who overseas a team that delivers recruitment based on the clubs blueprint for success. The idea behind this is that if the manager leaves or is shown the door you are not left with a group of players that the next manager doesn’t want so you have to start out all over again, you need to be able to keep consistency if a piece of the cog is taken out of the club.

Whether finances will allow the club to run like this I don’t know

Completely agree in the long run, but Kirchner said the other day that we literally don’t have a recruitment team right now. It will be on Rooney this summer, so let’s hope he finds some gems like he did last summer.

[richinspain]

13 minutes ago, turbo said:

Might be an unpopular opinion but if the takeover all goes smoothly then I hoping we go about things differently.

The successful model applied by the majority of successfully promoted clubs involves a football director who overseas a team that delivers recruitment based on the clubs blueprint for success. The idea behind this is that if the manager leaves or is shown the door you are not left with a group of players that the next manager doesn’t want so you have to start out all over again, you need to be able to keep consistency if a piece of the cog is taken out of the club.

Whether finances will allow the club to run like this I don’t know

The idea behind this is that the next manager will be chosen because he has the same philosophy as the director of football. How about the chairman just chooses the next manager, but makes sure he has the same philosophy as the last one? That way the manager chooses HIS players, but needs fewer.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

I love Rooneys style of playing out from the back and through the lines. I hope it becomes our style for the foreseeable future even if/when he goes. 

[YouRams]

Rooney will have better contacts/respect than the majority of people in English football. Every young lad thats grown up watching him will want to play for him, I think we'll see some gem loans like the lampard season and I'm all for it! 

[Ramchop]

I suspect the first team loans/signings will be Rooney's. 

Out of interest though, if we don't have a recruitment team, who signed Ebiowei, Plange etc? I want them signing the u23s

[Duracell]

Every time we've done this, it's gone exceptionally well. 

[angieram]

7 minutes ago, Ramchop said:

I suspect the first team loans/signings will be Rooney's. 

Out of interest though, if we don't have a recruitment team, who signed Ebiowei, Plange etc? I want them signing the u23s

Signed before we went into administration. Our recruitment for the academy has been exceptional for a long time. 

[Rich84]

10 minutes ago, Ramchop said:

I suspect the first team loans/signings will be Rooney's. 

Out of interest though, if we don't have a recruitment team, who signed Ebiowei, Plange etc? I want them signing the u23s

Presumably the recruitment team was released once we went into administration,  so they were working last summer....

[DarkFruitsRam7]

49 minutes ago, richinspain said:

The idea behind this is that the next manager will be chosen because he has the same philosophy as the director of football. How about the chairman just chooses the next manager, but makes sure he has the same philosophy as the last one? That way the manager chooses HIS players, but needs fewer.

I think coaching a first team squad is enough of a full time job as it is, without having to worry about doing your own recruitment, overseeing the academy, etc. 

I certainly think clubs who let simply let their head coaches coach the team are giving them a better chance of succeeding than those who make them do everything.

Of course, the head coach should have a voice in the recruitment process. But I think it’s best if they’re allowed to focus on what they’ve been hired to do, and let other specialists lead recruitment.

[Dean (hick) Saunders]

44 minutes ago, The Scarlet Pimpernel said:

I love Rooneys style of playing out from the back and through the lines. I hope it becomes our style for the foreseeable future even if/when he goes. 

How do we think this style will work in L1?

I am excited for the journey, but one of my doubts is the match up with the style of teams down there (Rotherham, Wycombe types) who we struggled to deal with at Champ level. Each time we play them they will be having the big day against Rooney and a cup tie level raising type effect.

I think we will need to evolve the personnel and style to make sure we can match the energy and physicality of the L1 battlers, while still keeping the identity we have developed this year.

Edited April 20, 2022 by Dean (hick) Saunders

[DarkFruitsRam7]

I do worry slightly that, because of Rooney’s exceptional performance (as well as Kirchner’s links to him), there might be a bit of a cult surrounding him moving forwards.

He deserves loyalty, but no manager should ever be untouchable. I hope Kirchner opts for a proper structure and long-term plan rather than truly making us Wayne Rooney’s Derby County.

[mrdave85]

I disagree to an extent, I understand the principle but I can’t see any of the top managers agreeing to players they have no say in. They have to coach/manage them after all.

[rammieib]

Completely disagree.

Fundamental to the success of the team is the manager chooses who he wants and doesn't want. No player should ever come into the first team squad without the approval of the manager. No player should ever leave, unless the chairman/CEO override the decision because the offer was so high that from a finance perspective for the club, we need to accept it - and even then, you need to ideally have a manager who can understand and accept this.

In no club should a Technical Football Position be more important than a manager.

Anyway - for me, the argument falls down over one simple point - you've made the assumption the Director of Football remains in place long term. This for me has the same likelihood as a manager remaining in place!

 

[davenportram]

3 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

I do worry slightly that, because of Rooney’s exceptional performance (as well as Kirchner’s links to him), there might be a bit of a cult surrounding him moving forwards.

He deserves loyalty, but no manager should ever be untouchable. I hope Kirchner opts for a proper structure and long-term plan rather than truly making us Wayne Rooney’s Derby County.

I want the opposite. I want us to have Rooney’s passion, ideals and philosophy.  For this to work he needs to bring the players he identifies in, within the business plan limits. Any structure that stifles his player recruitment will hinder him doing his job.

the rebuild is from the ground up. Rooney is a scholar from two clubs with history - both had success under long term managers whose philosophy ran through the clubs veins, through the players and fans. Obviously one had more success than the other, but he knows the importance of stability and a vision of how the club should be.

CK will know this too, as he is apparently successful in his own right in business. 
 

success is about having the right people in place, any structure has to support the Manager, not designed to hamstring him. 
 

we have a chance now to build - build a club, ethos, vision and structure that will breed success.
 

I think Rooney will stay with as as long as he can build the club in his way, will he leave us in the future? Possibly, but why would he if we are successful?

[DarkFruitsRam7]

4 minutes ago, davenportram said:

I want the opposite. I want us to have Rooney’s passion, ideals and philosophy.  For this to work he needs to bring the players he identifies in, within the business plan limits. Any structure that stifles his player recruitment will hinder him doing his job.

the rebuild is from the ground up. Rooney is a scholar from two clubs with history - both had success under long term managers whose philosophy ran through the clubs veins, through the players and fans. Obviously one had more success than the other, but he knows the importance of stability and a vision of how the club should be.

CK will know this too, as he is apparently successful in his own right in business. 
 

success is about having the right people in place, any structure has to support the Manager, not designed to hamstring him. 
 

we have a chance now to build - build a club, ethos, vision and structure that will breed success.
 

I think Rooney will stay with as as long as he can build the club in his way, will he leave us in the future? Possibly, but why would he if we are successful?

Fair one. I certainly would take more pride in a club that achieves success through the philosophy you describe. I just think it's less likely to work in the long run, and I certainly don't think the philosophy I've described would hamstring the manager.

Edited April 20, 2022 by DarkFruitsRam7

[davenportram]

4 minutes ago, DarkFruitsRam7 said:

Fair one. I certainly would take more pride in a club that achieves success through the philosophy you describe. I just think it's less likely to work in the long run, and I certainly don't think the philosophy I've described would hamstring the manager.

Why not? It has worked for Liverpool, 

 

lomg term success is a result of a string philosophy with stable leadership.

Edited April 20, 2022 by davenportram

[BatRam]

In my opinion, yes the club should set boundaries to prevent our previous downfall of buying garbage for millions.

But at the same time you have to back the manager.

Kirchner wants to keep Rooney so thats the style of play he wants for the club.

I'm hoping this is an era of us recruiting well and not having our pants down in the transfer windows ?