Margaret Beckett on Radio Derby

[uttoxram75]

44 minutes ago, Norman said:

Can we get a mod to make a thread with all of the EFL's wrongdoings over the last 2 years.  Have the thread open for people to list the points and then close it and pin it? 

Bullet point format including the likes of the stadium valuation fiasco  using Morcambe's ground as a template, to telling MPs to not make public statements? 

It can then be sent to MPs and the media who have just got involved and who will be unaware of how long and ridiculous this whole process has been.

Great idea. 

It doesn't have to be a mod. If someone has the time and patience to do it we will make sure it gets closed and pinned when its ready. 

[BucksRam]

16 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

Can you link her e-mail please 

 margaret.beckett.mp@parliament.uk 

[uttoxram75]

6 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

Great idea. 

It doesn't have to be a mod. If someone has the time and patience to do it we will make sure it gets closed and pinned when its ready. 

Oops, @David is already on it!

We communicate about as well as the EFL..........

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

21 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

Can you link her e-mail please 

margaret.beckett.mp@parliament.uk
 

I got an automatic reply 

[JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta]

1 hour ago, Ellafella said:

Absolutely- school boy error by EFL; she now will not let go of this.

Huge fan of this. Much like in our original LAP hearing, they simply cannot help but shoot themselves in the foot.

[Old Spalding Ram]

1 minute ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said:

margaret.beckett.mp@parliament.uk
 

I got an automatic reply 

That’s to say your email has been received, I’m suspecting her email in-box is pretty busy at the moment! ??

[PistoldPete]

11 minutes ago, uttoxram75 said:

Great idea. 

It doesn't have to be a mod. If someone has the time and patience to do it we will make sure it gets closed and pinned when its ready. 

I had been planning to do this. But it is such a long list, it would take too long. 

[Bald Eagle's Barmy Army]

3 minutes ago, Old Spalding Ram said:

That’s to say your email has been received, I’m suspecting her email in-box is pretty busy at the moment! ??

It was, the first few lines read

Thank you for your email. 

 

This is an automatic acknowledgement to confirm that it has been received.  

 

There is a strict parliamentary protocol that means I can only take up cases from people who live in the Derby South constituency.  

[PistoldPete]

Brilliant from Dame Margaret . Well done to her. What a lady.

[BucksRam]

Not in her constituency but I've emailed her my thanks too. 

[BOB BIGGS]

24 minutes ago, BucksRam said:

Not in her constituency but I've emailed her my thanks too. 

So have I?

[Ghost of Clough]

5 hours ago, Ellafella said:

Absolutely great idea. A timeline of facts. 

Someone can use this as a starting point if they want...

Timeline of events, beginning with the introduction of financial regulation in the Championship.

1.       2012 - FFP Rules (monitored over 1 season) implemented

2.       24/05/14 - Derby lose to FFP cheats QPR in the Playoff Final

3.       November 2014 – P&S rules (monitored over 3 seasons) voted in to replace FFP rules for the 16/17 season onwards.

4.       Summer 2015 – Derby change amortisation policy for the 15/16 season (after discussing the change with the auditors)

5.       07/04/17 – 15/16 accounts are submitted to Companies House

6.       06/04/18 – 16/17 accounts are submitted to Companies House

7.       Spring 2018 –2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL (within limits)

8.       12/04/18 – Revised 2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL due to differences between FFP and P&S calculations (£5m over the limit)

9.       04/05/18 – DCFC placed under embargo

10.   May 2018 – Stadium valued at £81.1m (profits basis) and £74.4m (DRC basis) by JLL

11.   June 2018 – Discussions with EFL to agree on stadium sale and how much to be included in the accounts)

12.   28/06/18 – Stadium sold for £81m. Revised 2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL (within limits)

13.   03/07/18 – Embargo lifted

14.   04/07/18 – EFL confirmation that DCFC met their P&S requirements for the 3 year period to 2018.

15.   15/02/19 – EFL Executive confirmation that £81.1m was fair value for the stadium.

16.   06/03/19 – placed under embargo for late submission of P&S statements

17.   29/03/19 – 2019 P&S statements submitted to EFL (within limits) and embargo lifted. New embargo placed on club due to being close to the limit.

18.   05/04/19 – 17/18 accounts are submitted to Companies House

19.   April 2019 - MFC queried, “in forceful terms”, the legitimacy of such a sale and leaseback arrangement

20.   15/04/19 – EFL query why amortization fluctuates so much between seasons.

21.   13/05/19 – Meeting between DCFC and EFL to discuss amortization, EFL stated “it is an acceptable accounting policy” with the EFL stating large future impairments are a risk for the club to take on

22.   24/05/19 – MFC submitted a claim against Derby, stating we cheated P&S by selling the stadium for too much and it wasn’t arms length.

23.   09/07/19 – MFC claim PPS should have been sold at a fair value of £22.8m

24.   11/07/19 – Embargo lifted

25.   30/07/19 – MFC officially threatened the EFL and DCFC with proceedings unless the EFL initiated disciplinary action against DCFC

26.   06/09/19 – MFC servered notice of arbitration to get profits from stadium sales excluded from P&S calculations (including those in the past)

27.   02/12/19 – EFL hired expert valued stadium at £42-50m. Expert had not visited the stadium but deemed the facilities to be “bog standard” and drew comparisons to Morecombe’s 6476 stadium with 3 terraced stands.

28.   16/01/20 – Derby charged with selling the stadium above it’s true value and for using improper amortization policy, resulting in exceeding P&S limits in the 3 years to 2018

29.   Early 2020 – Derby placed under embargo

30.   25/08/20 – DC cleared of overvaluing the stadium, found guilty for 1 of 5 particulars relating to the amortisation policy (not worded it adequately in the accounts), but insisted the policy was compliant with FRS102. DC panel consisted of accountants

31.   07/09/20 – EFL appealed against the DC decision

32.   07/09/20 – Boro started an arbitration against Derby and the EFL, in particular regarding the stadium valuation which allowed us to sign Waghorn

33.   22/10/20 – Boro’s application rejected

34.   30/11/20 – De novo hearing held and dismissed (EFL wanting draft 18/19 accounts submitted after DC decision to be considered)

35.   15/12/20 – EFL application for new evidence to be considered (18/19 draft accounts), dismissed 22/01/21

36.   July 2021 – LAP decision resulting in a restatement of 15/16 accounts onwards with a compliant amortization policy and a £100k fine. LAP did not consist of any accountants.

37.   22/09/21 – Derby enter administration

38.   16/11/21 – Administrators agree 9-point deduction due to EFL’s claim of a P&S overspend, a result of the EFL rejecting our new amortisation policy

 

Other noteworthy events:

EFL stated as wanting the points deduction against Derby to be applied in 20/21 to cause maximum punishment (relegation) when the season had already concluded.

Embargoes: 04/05/18-03/07/18, 06/03/19-11/07/19, early 2020-present

[BondJovi]

Nearly 4 years under some form of embargo.... 

[Archie]

4 hours ago, BucksRam said:

Not in her constituency but I've emailed her my thanks too. 

I have too and asked her to keep it up! 

Her late husband Leo would be very proud of her. Like the rest of us.

[Abu Dhabi Ram]

18 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Someone can use this as a starting point if they want...

Timeline of events, beginning with the introduction of financial regulation in the Championship.

1.       2012 - FFP Rules (monitored over 1 season) implemented

2.       24/05/14 - Derby lose to FFP cheats QPR in the Playoff Final

3.       November 2014 – P&S rules (monitored over 3 seasons) voted in to replace FFP rules for the 16/17 season onwards.

4.       Summer 2015 – Derby change amortisation policy for the 15/16 season (after discussing the change with the auditors)

5.       07/04/17 – 15/16 accounts are submitted to Companies House

6.       06/04/18 – 16/17 accounts are submitted to Companies House

7.       Spring 2018 –2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL (within limits)

8.       12/04/18 – Revised 2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL due to differences between FFP and P&S calculations (£5m over the limit)

9.       04/05/18 – DCFC placed under embargo

10.   May 2018 – Stadium valued at £81.1m (profits basis) and £74.4m (DRC basis) by JLL

11.   June 2018 – Discussions with EFL to agree on stadium sale and how much to be included in the accounts)

12.   28/06/18 – Stadium sold for £81m. Revised 2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL (within limits)

13.   03/07/18 – Embargo lifted

14.   04/07/18 – EFL confirmation that DCFC met their P&S requirements for the 3 year period to 2018.

15.   15/02/19 – EFL Executive confirmation that £81.1m was fair value for the stadium.

16.   06/03/19 – placed under embargo for late submission of P&S statements

17.   29/03/19 – 2019 P&S statements submitted to EFL (within limits) and embargo lifted. New embargo placed on club due to being close to the limit.

18.   05/04/19 – 17/18 accounts are submitted to Companies House

19.   April 2019 - MFC queried, “in forceful terms”, the legitimacy of such a sale and leaseback arrangement

20.   15/04/19 – EFL query why amortization fluctuates so much between seasons.

21.   13/05/19 – Meeting between DCFC and EFL to discuss amortization, EFL stated “it is an acceptable accounting policy” with the EFL stating large future impairments are a risk for the club to take on

22.   24/05/19 – MFC submitted a claim against Derby, stating we cheated P&S by selling the stadium for too much and it wasn’t arms length.

23.   09/07/19 – MFC claim PPS should have been sold at a fair value of £22.8m

24.   11/07/19 – Embargo lifted

25.   30/07/19 – MFC officially threatened the EFL and DCFC with proceedings unless the EFL initiated disciplinary action against DCFC

26.   06/09/19 – MFC servered notice of arbitration to get profits from stadium sales excluded from P&S calculations (including those in the past)

27.   02/12/19 – EFL hired expert valued stadium at £42-50m. Expert had not visited the stadium but deemed the facilities to be “bog standard” and drew comparisons to Morecombe’s 6476 stadium with 3 terraced stands.

28.   16/01/20 – Derby charged with selling the stadium above it’s true value and for using improper amortization policy, resulting in exceeding P&S limits in the 3 years to 2018

29.   Early 2020 – Derby placed under embargo

30.   25/08/20 – DC cleared of overvaluing the stadium, found guilty for 1 of 5 particulars relating to the amortisation policy (not worded it adequately in the accounts), but insisted the policy was compliant with FRS102. DC panel consisted of accountants

31.   07/09/20 – EFL appealed against the DC decision

32.   07/09/20 – Boro started an arbitration against Derby and the EFL, in particular regarding the stadium valuation which allowed us to sign Waghorn

33.   22/10/20 – Boro’s application rejected

34.   30/11/20 – De novo hearing held and dismissed (EFL wanting draft 18/19 accounts submitted after DC decision to be considered)

35.   15/12/20 – EFL application for new evidence to be considered (18/19 draft accounts), dismissed 22/01/21

36.   July 2021 – LAP decision resulting in a restatement of 15/16 accounts onwards with a compliant amortization policy and a £100k fine. LAP did not consist of any accountants.

37.   22/09/21 – Derby enter administration

38.   16/11/21 – Administrators agree 9-point deduction due to EFL’s claim of a P&S overspend, a result of the EFL rejecting our new amortisation policy

 

Other noteworthy events:

EFL stated as wanting the points deduction against Derby to be applied in 20/21 to cause maximum punishment (relegation) when the season had already concluded.

Embargoes: 04/05/18-03/07/18, 06/03/19-11/07/19, early 2020-present

This is great! Didn’t we lose to FFP ‘cheats’ Villa in a play off final too? We took no action against them. 

[Ram1988]

Thank you Margaret ! I thought she represented the fans well in parliament today and has shown real passion to fight our cause.

[PistoldPete]

22 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Someone can use this as a starting point if they want...

Timeline of events, beginning with the introduction of financial regulation in the Championship.

1.       2012 - FFP Rules (monitored over 1 season) implemented

2.       24/05/14 - Derby lose to FFP cheats QPR in the Playoff Final

3.       November 2014 – P&S rules (monitored over 3 seasons) voted in to replace FFP rules for the 16/17 season onwards.

4.       Summer 2015 – Derby change amortisation policy for the 15/16 season (after discussing the change with the auditors)

5.       07/04/17 – 15/16 accounts are submitted to Companies House

6.       06/04/18 – 16/17 accounts are submitted to Companies House

7.       Spring 2018 –2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL (within limits)

8.       12/04/18 – Revised 2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL due to differences between FFP and P&S calculations (£5m over the limit)

9.       04/05/18 – DCFC placed under embargo

10.   May 2018 – Stadium valued at £81.1m (profits basis) and £74.4m (DRC basis) by JLL

11.   June 2018 – Discussions with EFL to agree on stadium sale and how much to be included in the accounts)

12.   28/06/18 – Stadium sold for £81m. Revised 2016-18 P&S information submitted to EFL (within limits)

13.   03/07/18 – Embargo lifted

14.   04/07/18 – EFL confirmation that DCFC met their P&S requirements for the 3 year period to 2018.

15.   15/02/19 – EFL Executive confirmation that £81.1m was fair value for the stadium.

16.   06/03/19 – placed under embargo for late submission of P&S statements

17.   29/03/19 – 2019 P&S statements submitted to EFL (within limits) and embargo lifted. New embargo placed on club due to being close to the limit.

18.   05/04/19 – 17/18 accounts are submitted to Companies House

19.   April 2019 - MFC queried, “in forceful terms”, the legitimacy of such a sale and leaseback arrangement

20.   15/04/19 – EFL query why amortization fluctuates so much between seasons.

21.   13/05/19 – Meeting between DCFC and EFL to discuss amortization, EFL stated “it is an acceptable accounting policy” with the EFL stating large future impairments are a risk for the club to take on

22.   24/05/19 – MFC submitted a claim against Derby, stating we cheated P&S by selling the stadium for too much and it wasn’t arms length.

23.   09/07/19 – MFC claim PPS should have been sold at a fair value of £22.8m

24.   11/07/19 – Embargo lifted

25.   30/07/19 – MFC officially threatened the EFL and DCFC with proceedings unless the EFL initiated disciplinary action against DCFC

26.   06/09/19 – MFC servered notice of arbitration to get profits from stadium sales excluded from P&S calculations (including those in the past)

27.   02/12/19 – EFL hired expert valued stadium at £42-50m. Expert had not visited the stadium but deemed the facilities to be “bog standard” and drew comparisons to Morecombe’s 6476 stadium with 3 terraced stands.

28.   16/01/20 – Derby charged with selling the stadium above it’s true value and for using improper amortization policy, resulting in exceeding P&S limits in the 3 years to 2018

29.   Early 2020 – Derby placed under embargo

30.   25/08/20 – DC cleared of overvaluing the stadium, found guilty for 1 of 5 particulars relating to the amortisation policy (not worded it adequately in the accounts), but insisted the policy was compliant with FRS102. DC panel consisted of accountants

31.   07/09/20 – EFL appealed against the DC decision

32.   07/09/20 – Boro started an arbitration against Derby and the EFL, in particular regarding the stadium valuation which allowed us to sign Waghorn

33.   22/10/20 – Boro’s application rejected

34.   30/11/20 – De novo hearing held and dismissed (EFL wanting draft 18/19 accounts submitted after DC decision to be considered)

35.   15/12/20 – EFL application for new evidence to be considered (18/19 draft accounts), dismissed 22/01/21

36.   July 2021 – LAP decision resulting in a restatement of 15/16 accounts onwards with a compliant amortization policy and a £100k fine. LAP did not consist of any accountants.

37.   22/09/21 – Derby enter administration

38.   16/11/21 – Administrators agree 9-point deduction due to EFL’s claim of a P&S overspend, a result of the EFL rejecting our new amortisation policy

 

Other noteworthy events:

EFL stated as wanting the points deduction against Derby to be applied in 20/21 to cause maximum punishment (relegation) when the season had already concluded.

Embargoes: 04/05/18-03/07/18, 06/03/19-11/07/19, early 2020-present

Thanks GoC

[Ghost of Clough]

12 minutes ago, Abu Dhabi Ram said:

This is great! Didn’t we lose to FFP ‘cheats’ Villa in a play off final too? We took no action against them. 

I'm reluctant to call any club 'cheats' without official confirmation on how they cheated. So far no charge for Villa and no punishment for their heavy spending.

[OohMartWright]

A good summary @Ghost of Clough. Is it worth quoting the "EFL are disappointed .... " statement regarding their decision to appeal to add a bit more context?

[sage]

1 minute ago, OohMartWright said:

A good summary @Ghost of Clough. Is it worth quoting the "EFL are disappointed .... " statement regarding their decision to appeal to add a bit more context?

This