kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 7 minutes ago, nottingram said: Is it not generally accepted that Martin isn’t capable of playing many more games? Fair enough on Ayew, I had assumed he hadn’t got that many. But kind of fits into my point that he is a wide forward - goals can be shared between more players in good and functional teams. I guess there’s not much point discussing things further if you don’t believe that Lawrence, Knight, Sibley, Rooney and Whittaker among others are capable of adding as many goals to a team as Mount and Wilson. Just think this 15-20 goal a season striker thing is a strange and arbitrary sound bite that gets thrown about. Take Fulham and look at their options in wide positions - Knockaert, D-Reid, Cavaleiro, then Cairney and Johansen are decent scorers from midfield. All excellent players. They rely so much on Mitrovic almost to a fault to the point that the others have suffered. Mitrovic injured for the play offs and all of their goals have come from wide or midfield and they’re into the PO final. As above, what is to say that Martin is capable of playing many more games. His fitness issues are well known about and he deserves credit for even playing as much as he has with them. I am by no means anti Martin. Think he is and has been good to excellent for us. But also don’t subscribe to the idea that he’s the be all and end all as I have explained ad nauseum. Breaking the structures we now have in place for someone we can’t guarantee consistent starts from would be crazy. The issue we now have is replacing him....fine letting him go if we have a replacement lined up but we clearly haven’t and if cocu thought that waggers or Marriott was the answer then Martin wouldn’t have had the opportunities to play that he had this season. I just hope that Cocu can get another good,extremely cheap,young,hold up striker in and ready for the new season or we will be knackered before we even start. To my mind,we needed at least another season with CM in the side to allow us to bring someone else on to perform the same role. Its done now though,so be fascinating to see how Cocu and the club handle this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nottingram Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 5 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said: What like most of the restarted season? Fair enough, started 7/9. Maybe he should’ve scored more in them then ? In all seriousness I think to get the best out of him he does need to be rotated more than that. He wasn’t as effective as we know he can be in some of those games, partly due to the team setup and I would say partly due to his condition which clearly is not his fault. I don’t believe we are in a position to be able to commit longer contracts and highish wages on that. I do rate him but just think that’s our new reality, and think there’s bigger priorities than replacing him. That’s all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 What I will say - when this new striker ever comes in, is that he’s gonna get a rough ride from a section of fans. Gonna be a lot heaped on the shoulders of him, or not rated soon as he not scores for 2/3 games..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 6 minutes ago, Mafiabob said: What I will say - when this new striker ever comes in, is that he’s gonna get a rough ride from a section of fans. Gonna be a lot heaped on the shoulders of him, or not rated soon as he not scores for 2/3 games..... What like happens with Marriott and Waghorn? And used to happen with Martin? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 12 minutes ago, Mafiabob said: What I will say - when this new striker ever comes in, is that he’s gonna get a rough ride from a section of fans. Gonna be a lot heaped on the shoulders of him, or not rated soon as he not scores for 2/3 games..... I think that depends on his style and attitude...but let’s face it,we are a group of fans,all supporting the same club but are clearly split on brexit lines on the style of play we want from the team. Dont forget,plenty here liked what they saw under rowett and hated Mac,so bringing in another striker in martins mould isn’t going to make them happy,no matter how good they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, nottingram said: Dunno, thought I explained that? Marriott highly unlikely to be as poor or have such injury troubles again, Knight and Sibley able to contribute more from midfield. Full season of Rooney probably playing further forward and (hopefully) a new right sided winger / forward targeted as a priority. A similar season from Lawrence would be good as well. Then you have Whittaker and JHI hopefully able to contribute a little bit as well. Good luck if you're hoping we'll get a 46 game season out of Rooney. Can't see that myself. He'll have slowed down to walking football by Feb......? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: I think that depends on his style and attitude...but let’s face it,we are a group of fans,all supporting the same club but are clearly split on brexit lines on the style of play we want from the team. Dont forget,plenty here liked what they saw under rowett and hated Mac,so bringing in another striker in martins mould isn’t going to make them happy,no matter how good they are. Agreed - fook getting along and agreeing, otherwise we wouldn’t have this platform anymore and @Davidwill need to have a real job..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 minute ago, Van der MoodHoover said: Good luck if you're hoping we'll get a 46 game season out of Rooney. Can't see that myself. He'll have slowed down to walking football by Feb......? Sadly this is the case,if they thought Martin was slow Rooney had drawn to a virtual standstill by the last game and was in fact a liability.....plus he couldn’t place or hang onto a ball by the end. If anything,I would have been happier to see Rooney moving into that coaching role more this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexxxxx Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 Sad to see him go. One of my favourite players to have played for the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuffLuff Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 2 hours ago, MACKWORTHRAM said: Also I have a family friend that knows X’s wife pretty well. And trust me when I say this. X isn't bothered about Derby. He has no loyalties to us at all. He fully expected to be gone this season. But for some reason he came back. I’m gonna use this template in every player discussion going forward, it’s too good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 4 minutes ago, TuffLuff said: I’m gonna use this template in every player discussion going forward, it’s too good! I’ve heard Ken Dodds,dads dog,concurs....So it must be true Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 9 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said: Sadly this is the case,if they thought Martin was slow Rooney had drawn to a virtual standstill by the last game and was in fact a liability.....plus he couldn’t place or hang onto a ball by the end. If anything,I would have been happier to see Rooney moving into that coaching role more this season. I do worry that the deal with 32 red means Rooney must play if available - he used to rotated in and out of man utd squad across a 38 match league season so he's not only ageing and slowing but being asked to increase his output! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I really do have a worrying feeling that Martin might be picked up by one of the relegated clubs or one of the clubs rebuilding after a tilt at the play-offs. Why else would he walk away from the table? With him being available on a free transfer, the risk is practically zero. Championship clubs like Bournemouth, Watford, Swansea, and either Brentford or Fulham will all see coveted players leave in the summer and as a result will have room in the wage budget to accommodate him and his wage demands. Bournemouth could lose Wilson and King. Watford could lose Deeney. Brentford could lose Watkins amongst others. Fulham could lose Mitrovic, and so on. But of course these clubs will all be looking for a continuation of the attractive brand of football they play. In terms of technical ability, Martin would be a wonderful fit and could be a really shrewd addition for clubs of this profile. It is easy to see him thriving in a team already brimming with pace, mobility and technical ability. He might not have the pace of Watkins or the physicality of Mitrovic or Deeney, but if you get the right calibre of players in and around him, I have no doubt he would flourish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chester40 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, RamLad1884 said: Sounds like he's gone looking to see if someone else will give him the terms he wants and if not will end back with us. Not sure how to feel if he spends all summer looking elsewhere just to come back. Be staggered if his agent hasn't given him some kind of idea of what he can get elsewhere. Otherwise why bother having one!! Surely he has a figure from Derby... Say 10k a week for a year. Isn't that what an agent is for...phone round seeing what he could get elsewhere. Must fancy he can at least match it or he would have signed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie20 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 3 hours ago, David said: Translation being, sadly Martin’s demands did not fall in line with our wage bill reduction vision going forward. We thank Martin for his service and wish him luck finding a club that will meet his demands. However, if he struggles to find a club our offer remains on the table. The problem with that is, how long does Cocu monitor the situation when it’s clear we will need to bring in a replacement? Cocu being Cocu I would expect him to already have a shortlist of potential replacements in mind, after all, good management includes having contingency plans to cope with the unexpected, which this isn't in truth. I'm sorry to see him go - hope everything works out for him - those months when he was sent out on loan were painful for many fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 Just now, Chester40 said: Surely he has a figure from Derby... Say 10k a week for a year... No wonder he wouldn't sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 Goals from midfield? Lawrence, Sibley and Rooney are 3 of the most likely players to score from outside the box in the Championship. We had a full season out of one of those, half out of one, and not even a quarter from the other. I can only see our midfield scoring more next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CornwallRam Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, Anag Ram said: We've still got Rammie! I believe that that Rammie got sacked for mimicking a linesman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo Ram Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 I am in two minds. Think he is talented and been a great servant to the club. But on the other hand I think we could do with more pace and mobility up top. Good luck to him ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong Posted July 31, 2020 Share Posted July 31, 2020 8 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: Goals from midfield? Lawrence, Sibley and Rooney are 3 of the most likely players to score from outside the box in the Championship. We had a full season out of one of those, half out of one, and not even a quarter from the other. I can only see our midfield scoring more next season. Could you explain how and why you come to this conclusion? what exactly has stopped them scoring more this season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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