v Blackpool (H) Match Thread

[Chris_Martin]

28 minutes ago, Barney1991 said:

We would get good money for cashin and sign someone in a lower fee and spend money elsewhere 

judging by our recruitment team, that wouldnt be a good thing.

[Caerphilly Ram]

Just watched this back. The defending for both their goals is poor.  For the first, failing to get a tackle in or clear it before the cross comes in from the left, and then the lack of desire/decisiveness from 3 white shirts (Elder, Cashin, Bradley?) which allows Beesley to get his shot in is almost laughable. Then the second again comes from a combined lack of the correct decisive action/miscommunication/poor execution of a decisive action between Bradley, Elder and Vickers. Elder attempted to take charge with the header back but Vickers and Bradley had both already half committed leaving the space for the tap in 🤦🏻‍♂️ Even more frustrating when in the build up the team had sat in in a line of 5-3-2 to be more solid and gets undone by the long ball into the channel leading to the mix up. 
However, there were signs of what the team can do in there. Bird picked the ball up in good areas and drove forward, there was some intricate build up play around the box leading to the Waghorn and Washington chances (not just get it wide and cross it). Forsyth’s calm assurance to clear up one moment at the back, then play it into Smith in midfield, who shifted it to the left wing, then the ball goes infield to Bird who pushed forward and laid it to Waghorn for the shot was all showed what is possible from this group of players. There’s hope that it can come good, but Warne needs to address whatever fallout there is from last night, tweak the system to avoid those defensive errors from the off, and get them all playing with more pride on Saturday.

EDIT - special mention to Vickers pulling off a great stop after Wilson lost it up the pitch. Wilson needs coaching around when to try his stepovers and when to just lump it back into the mixer, he didn’t need to try and bamboozle the defender there, he could have just crossed it back in. 

Edited August 9, 2023 by Caerphilly Ram

[B4ev6is]

15 hours ago, Ram@Lincoln said:

When are the players allowed time off to recover from a physically and mentally draining season? The likes of NML looked totally beat from February time.

When they gain promation that's when they are allowed to go.

[sage]

7 hours ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

Sorry sage missed this earlier. You are typically measured in your criticism and constructive, not denying that. I know I’ve challenged some views but I can at least see and appreciate your rationale.

There have however long been comments from various posters about Warne that are much more about the man than the coach, pre-dating his radio interview last night. Comments dismissing the why wall, recruiting based on character as well as footballing ability, his choice of headwear, his historic experience and job roles, dismissing his career as a player and a manager, the mug thing, his humour. I get it’s not to everyone’s taste, I simply view those comments as holding less sense and rationale than a measured response to his tactics, or the post match interview or whatever. 

It was only a few posters. There are many more now.

 

[sage]

7 hours ago, Dava75 said:

Everyone knows who he means??? Please could you be specific ….which players exactly do we all know he means? 

Deflecting blame? In the same interview where he said “I need to do better” and “I take responsibility” 🤷🏼‍♂️

You appear to be mixing fact and personal speculation to suit your agenda - almost like a third rate politician!!

 

 

He means Bird. Radio Derby picked up on it straight away. He was the only one in the starting line up who we had received an offer for.

All very straightforward. 

I don't have an agenda. I haven't asked for Warne to go. I'm not his biggest fan but been on the fence till last night.

[DavesaRam]

7 hours ago, jimtastic56 said:

I have attended the last 3 home games and and in all of them - the opposition midfield players have been able to carry the ball from box to box without a challenge going in . We don’t have a midfield player that could tackle a Pukka Pie. I would consider putting Collins in midfield v Burton for a bit of aggression.

Collins is already there, except when he is out on the wing.

[DavesaRam]

What puzzles me is this idea that it takes ao many games for the players to ”gel”. Both Wigan and Blackpool have had big disruptions to their squads, but Wigan played like they had been together for 12 months or more, and judging by the comments Blackpool are similar.

Thinking back we have regularly started seasons slowly while the players get up to speed, all the tome being stuffed by teams who are up to speed from day one.

[Millenniumram]

7 hours ago, Archied said:

So you’ve decided who it is and what he means ,, yer right you keep telling yourself it’s ok to throw around personal and professional bile at the derby manager because you don’t and or rate him and we’ve lost two games and I will keep believing that’s it’s no different from fans throwing personal crap at billy sharp , it’s not ok to get so  offensive and hyperbolic to players and managers

Mate, any idiot can tell that’s who Warne was referring to. Thinking anything else is wilful ignorance.

So calling someone a Sunday league manager is exactly the same as calling them a rapist? Can you hear how ridiculous you sound?

[Millenniumram]

1 hour ago, B4ev6is said:

When they gain promation that's when they are allowed to go.

Poor feckers deserve a holiday this decade at least!

[Foreveram]

1 hour ago, B4ev6is said:

When they gain promation that's when they are allowed to go.

Sounds reasonable.😏

[angieram]

55 minutes ago, DavesaRam said:

What puzzles me is this idea that it takes ao many games for the players to ”gel”. Both Wigan and Blackpool have had big disruptions to their squads, but Wigan played like they had been together for 12 months or more, and judging by the comments Blackpool are similar.

Thinking back we have regularly started seasons slowly while the players get up to speed, all the tome being stuffed by teams who are up to speed from day one.

Do you think we've been overworked in pre-season? We looked knackered from kick off last night. 

[HorsforthRam]

1 minute ago, angieram said:

Do you think we've been overworked in pre-season? We looked knackered from kick off last night. 

I think we may have. At the age some of the players are, they need rest between games are hard sessions. Not another hard session cos they aren’t deemed fit enough. Two games a week should be enough for hard training. In between should be rest and training formations and tactics. 

[Chris_Martin]

5 hours ago, B4ev6is said:

When they gain promation that's when they are allowed to go.

looks like they'll never be retiring then

[Phoenix]

3 hours ago, HorsforthRam said:

I think we may have. At the age some of the players are, they need rest between games are hard sessions. Not another hard session cos they aren’t deemed fit enough. Two games a week should be enough for hard training. In between should be rest and training formations and tactics. 

I believe it was Bill Paisley who used to say something to the effect ' We don't leave our energy/strength on the training pitch'

[Archied]

3 hours ago, Millenniumram said:

Mate, any idiot can tell that’s who Warne was referring to. Thinking anything else is wilful ignorance.

So calling someone a Sunday league manager is exactly the same as calling them a rapist? Can you hear how ridiculous you sound?

Mate any idiot could wonder if there’s a few players he referring to ( maybe bird included or not ) let’s say bird , cashin , sibley , barks are looking for moves and all of a sudden the positive togetherness and focus of the group in pre season has gone out the window with some not really too interested in not being injured enough to push to be in the team leaving us short too and bringing a bad negative vibe , it does not have to be only a player that actually played in the Blackpool game ,,,, derrrrr , interesting bird was not subbed at half time if he was the out and out only target of Warne s comment s, 

as for the rest , your personaly and professionally rude and offensive to a derby county manager because you don’t like him and he’s lost a couple of games ,,, yeah you know where to draw the line 😂😂😂😂😂, 

not seeing too many on here giving me stick for being ridiculous,, maybe that’s says more about how you sound ?

I would have a bit of respect if you were bright enough to put your hands up and say I’m a passionate fan and was over the top in the heat of the moment then go on to say what it is you see in warne that makes him wrong for derby , he may well turn out to be , 

I won’t hold my breath on that though

[Guest]

13 hours ago, Caerphilly Ram said:

Just watched this back. The defending for both their goals is poor.  For the first, failing to get a tackle in or clear it before the cross comes in from the left, and then the lack of desire/decisiveness from 3 white shirts (Elder, Cashin, Bradley?) which allows Beesley to get his shot in is almost laughable. Then the second again comes from a combined lack of the correct decisive action/miscommunication/poor execution of a decisive action between Bradley, Elder and Vickers. Elder attempted to take charge with the header back but Vickers and Bradley had both already half committed leaving the space for the tap in 🤦🏻‍♂️ Even more frustrating when in the build up the team had sat in in a line of 5-3-2 to be more solid and gets undone by the long ball into the channel leading to the mix up. 
However, there were signs of what the team can do in there. Bird picked the ball up in good areas and drove forward, there was some intricate build up play around the box leading to the Waghorn and Washington chances (not just get it wide and cross it). Forsyth’s calm assurance to clear up one moment at the back, then play it into Smith in midfield, who shifted it to the left wing, then the ball goes infield to Bird who pushed forward and laid it to Waghorn for the shot was all showed what is possible from this group of players. There’s hope that it can come good, but Warne needs to address whatever fallout there is from last night, tweak the system to avoid those defensive errors from the off, and get them all playing with more pride on Saturday.

EDIT - special mention to Vickers pulling off a great stop after Wilson lost it up the pitch. Wilson needs coaching around when to try his stepovers and when to just lump it back into the mixer, he didn’t need to try and bamboozle the defender there, he could have just crossed it back in. 

I would add to that: I summoned the courage to watch the match on Rams Player after reading all the comments (and hearing Warne’s DCFC interview) so was definitely expecting the worst. It actually wasn’t that bad. The defending on all four goals conceded over the 2 games has been farcical, but as ridiculous as it sounds, for that reason alone the results could have been quite different.

Yes, there was a spell at the end of the first half where Blackpool kept the ball for fun, and yes I’m aware that apparently it wasn’t even their full first XI. But Derby weren’t awful, did a lot of things well enough such that we weren’t more than a lucky break (combined with zero freak-out moments in defence) from a different outcome. Just like against Wigan, we could conceivably have been saying “Well, we’re not playing great, but a win is a win” etc. (of course it’s possible Blackpool would have thrown more at it if we hadn’t gifted them the 2 goals and let them have that cushion)

The attitude/effort will be crucial on Saturday, as will eliminating the calamitous moments in defence, but after watching that I don’t think we’re as far away from getting our season back on track as I’d feared after all the understandably gloomy feedback on this match.

[RoyMac5]

5 hours ago, jameso said:

The defending on all four goals conceded over the 2 games has been farcical, but as ridiculous as it sounds, for that reason alone the results could have been quite different.

It doesn't worry you that that is the area of the team that has been strengthened the most?

[Guest]

12 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

It doesn't worry you that that is the area of the team that has been strengthened the most?

Well first I’m assuming you’re treating wing-backs as part of the defence, because he’s signed more wing-backs than any other position and their role is at least as much attacking as defending.

So, regarding the wing-backs, I don’t expect them to be of the same defensive calibre or in the same positions as an out-and-out full back, which are among the reasons for playing 3 centre backs. This is not to excuse Elder for his mistakes on Tuesday, although neither was solely his mistake. We will likely get caught out now and again in the WB positions because of the system and expectations on their role.

As for the CBS: it depends what you mean by “worry”.

I am concerned about the lack of pace. Despite Shaun Barker’s claims that Cashin is quick, he isn’t, and Bradley certainly isn’t. Nelson looks about average speed. Forsyth is actually our quickest centre back! If we play a high line we will get into trouble. It would worry me if Warne doesn’t realise that because he’s already been served up at least 3 examples in 2 games, one of which resulted in a goal.

Am I worried that Warne has actually signed two duds at CB? No- I don’t believe he has, but Bradley in particular hasn’t done much to recommend himself in the first 2 matches.

[duncanjwitham]

3 minutes ago, jameso said:

Am I worried that Warne has actually signed two duds at CB? No- I don’t believe he has, but Bradley in particular hasn’t done much to recommend himself in the first 2 matches.

I think the problem isn't that they're duds, it's that they can't do the very specific jobs they were signed for.  If we were playing a "standard" flat back 4, they'd be fine.  But with the way we're setting up - spreading the back 3 wide across the pitch and having everyone else pushing up aggressively - the centre halves get very isolated from each other.  So they need to be mobile to cover the big gaps between them (which Bradley and Cashin aren't), and they need to be comfortable on the ball to get out of trouble when they're under pressure and there's no easy-out pass (which Nelson and Bradley aren't). The first issue is why we keep seeing us get carved open down the middle (the 1-on-1 that Wigan missed is a good example, I think).  The second issue is why we keep seeing the under-hit back-pass type of stuff.

[Sufferingfool]

23 hours ago, oomarkwright said:

I went to the game last night so feel I can comment based on what I saw.

Positives

The second half they played a lot better. There was more intensity, desire, commitment and inter play between players. 

There were good opportunities to get at least the first goal back. Waggy had a good chance and put it wide. It goes in. Who knows? 

It was clear Wag and Wash are not up to speed or fit. It was clear that this team had not played together before and therefore there were missed off the ball moves and patterns of play that didn't work. 

I will give fair credit to the young lads in the south stand for the noise and support in the second half. Throughout most of it in fact. Well done. The team barely deserved it. Made me proud. Sorry us East Standers were like a library. 

Fozzy played well. The man of the moment Bird had a much better second half. Tommo had a good game. Cash was giving it everything including that lovely bit of skill to beat 2 players and a crunching 50/50.

So not all bad. 

Blackpool were very impressive first half and yes even in the second they sat back but there passing was crisp playing thru the thirds. That section where they passed about 60 balls to each other and had it for 2-3 minutes sublime. 

We have played 2 ex championship teams. 

However, that first half was dreadful. Cashs passing was terrible. Each ball was just hoofed up front and Blackpool hoovered them up. 

Didn't see a specific error for the first goal, just general lack of tight marking. 

Yes, a miss communication by Elder. It's his first game. Both him and Wilson couldn't seem to have the ability or fitness to pass their full back and the dilly dallying led to what should have been the second goal had it not been for that amazing shmeical type save by Vickers. 

Overall very disappointing but fair result. 

What was more worrying was the interview afterwards, and agree with others that that was not good. Don't think he has an answer to the problem but it needs exercising before Saturday.

If things are that bad then negotiate with Hull for a slightly better price. Said it the other day, need a 'Kavanagh' type enforcer and controller and a much bigger younger centre forward. Shame we didn't get May or Stockton but we need to find someone. 

Given that our saviour wanted Warne and made that bold decision,  we have to back and support him. Not sure we will go up this season now, so hold tight for another season and try and get it right next summer. Early days so strap in for a bumpy ride. 

That is exactly how I saw the game as you say great support second half and the passage of play from Blackpool was sublime and deserved a goal. If they had scored at the end of it I would have stood and applauded. There were positives and if Waggy or Wash had scored then it would have been interesting. For me Fozzy has to start at CB and Tommo in the centre when he passes forwards he looks very accomplished.