Derby County v Port Vale - The Matchday Thread

[Crewton]

2 minutes ago, DRBee said:

In our current team Knight is quite good at dropping to the floor and getting a free kick.

I think it's fairer to Jason to say that he's very good at drawing a challenge from an opponent and going down after contact. IMO it's usually justified, because he's getting the kind of close attention that is in itself foul play but which is rarely punished unless a player does go down. It's usually in defensive positions too. I don't recall him ever being awarded a penalty in that way. 

Franny Lee earned quite a few though! 

[Tamworthram]

10 minutes ago, DRBee said:

In our current team Knight is quite good at dropping to the floor and getting a free kick.

And so is Sibley

[Crewton]

1 minute ago, Tamworthram said:

And so is Sibley

Sibley gets kicked TF every time he plays, opposition players in his face trying to provoke him, the works. He doesn't get half the free kicks and penalties that he should. I wouldn't blame him if he did perfect a way of conning the officials for his own protection, because they offer him zero. 

[Oldben]

https://www.stokesentinel.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/port-vale-derby-nathan-smith-7684196

The view from the opposition conveniently ignores the appalling refereeing.

[jono]

3 hours ago, Crewton said:

I think it's fairer to Jason to say that he's very good at drawing a challenge from an opponent and going down after contact. IMO it's usually justified, because he's getting the kind of close attention that is in itself foul play but which is rarely punished unless a player does go down. It's usually in defensive positions too. I don't recall him ever being awarded a penalty in that way. 

Franny Lee earned quite a few though! 

I have no problem with a player making sure the ref sees a foul, even mild theatrics might be permissible within reason . BUT I have a problem when there isn’t a foul in the first place and bit of theatre does not include pretending you’ve been hit in the face when you haven’t. ! Refs should work harder and players need to try and stay on their feet and let the ref judge. 
 

yeah, I know, I’m dreaming ?. But you know what ? If we don’t stand up for and reward sportsmanship then what’s the point 

[NottsRam]

On 09/10/2022 at 02:16, Ramifications said:

David Clowes must be wondering, what on earth have I gone and done. 

Level headed business men tend not to go into a blind panic at the first hint of an issue, unlike the majority of Derby fans?

 

[SSD]

It's taken me a couple of days (and a hangover, cheers ref!) to analyse the match. 

I thought first half we did okay. Lovely finish from Collins and it's a real shame he's going to be out for 3 matches. His confidence has grown and he'll easily hit 15-20 goals. Second half the team was all over the place. Granted, the refereeing decisions were abysmal, we won't get many worse than him in middle. He shouldn't be refereeing professional matches. I still think we wouldn't have got more than a point based on the performance.

What shocked me was the lack of composure on the ball. It had that whiff of small team tactics. Ping it up the field quick when possible, no build up play in midfield. Pump the ball into the box. There is no way Port Vale should have 20 shots at our goal, for a home team that's frankly embarrassing. And this is down to having no control on the ball whilst in possession. It was like watching a basketball match and from my point of view it was horrible to watch. It's a very different style of football. Maybe it is because I've been used to watching plenty of passes and possession for years.

We need to find that sweet spot of being more aggressive going forward but settling on the ball at the right times. Rosenior could have us passing for days, mostly being easy on the eye (apart from passing out from the back), yet he could never get a result away from home. Paul Warne has come in and turned the style 180 degrees. Counter attacking, launching it 50 yards and hoping for a defensive mistake or runner. 

PW can get around with not so pretty football away from home. If he decides to be persistent with this longer play, (I won't say hoofing it), then I don't think the fans will be as forgiving if we lose at home in this division. Early days of course. 

Edited October 10, 2022 by SSD

[jono]

20 minutes ago, SSD said:

It's taken me a couple of days (and a hangover, cheers ref!) to analyse the match. 

I thought first half we did okay. Lovely finish from Collins and it's a real shame he's going to be out for 3 matches. His confidence has grown and he'll easily hit 15-20 goals. Second half the team was all over the place. Granted, the refereeing decisions were abysmal, we won't get many worse than him in middle. He shouldn't be refereeing professional matches. I still think we wouldn't have got more than a point based on the performance.

What shocked me was the lack of composure on the ball. It had that whiff of small team tactics. Ping it up the field quick when possible, no build up play in midfield. Pump the ball into the box. There is no way Port Vale should have 20 shots at our goal, for a home team that's frankly embarrassing. And this is down to having no control on the ball whilst in possession. It was like watching a basketball match and from my point of view it was horrible to watch. It's a very different style of football. Maybe it is because I've been used to watching plenty of passes and possession for years.

We need to find that sweet spot of being more aggressive going forward but settling on the ball at the right times. Rosenior could have us passing for days, mostly being easy on the eye (apart from passing out from the back), yet he could never get a result away from home. Paul Warne has come in and turned the style 180 degrees. Counter attacking, launching it 50 yards and hoping for a defensive mistake or runner. 

PW can get around with not so pretty football away from home. If he decides to be persistent with this longer play, (I won't say hoofing it), then I don't think the fans will be as forgiving if we lose at home in this division. Early days of course. 

The composure point is well made. If we were a team full of rufty tufties it would be understandable, but we have a group with good ball skills. They weren’t used to the extent they should have been. Yes, we need that sweet spot. pretty passing in our own half isn’t the answer but ball on the ground in the middle of the park will get us a lot further than losing at head tennis. 

[Blondest Goat]

23 hours ago, CBX1985 said:

I'm a qualified referee and I'm usually supportive, but yesterdays was total disgrace.  I can get that big calls are hard.  I can accept mistakes.  I can even give dispensation for reffing in a lower league that we are used to.

We had offsides given that the linesman did not flag for and the referee was wrongly placed; penalties given after 10-15 seconds - he didn't know, and if you don't know you can't give it. 

But, rough with the smooth.  We'll get a ref like that one day.

Cashin could easily have been sent off last week.  

[Blondest Goat]

7 hours ago, Tamworthram said:

And so is Sibley

They are very often not given as fouls though.

[PistoldPete]

57 minutes ago, Blondest Goat said:

Cashin could easily have been sent off last week.  

With Saturdays ref anything would have been possible. 

[kevinhectoring]

9 hours ago, Crewton said:

think it's fairer to Jason to say that he's very good at drawing a challenge

it's amazing that players aren't told not to fall into his traps. His stock ruse is to show the oppo the ball then, when they go for it, to step between the two of them and get shoved in the back. He's got excellent balance and very quick feet so it's the easiest thing, and the ref has no choice. I think we've seen it 50 times 

[jono]

9 hours ago, Crewton said:

Sibley gets kicked TF every time he plays, opposition players in his face trying to provoke him, the works. He doesn't get half the free kicks and penalties that he should. I wouldn't blame him if he did perfect a way of conning the officials for his own protection, because they offer him zero. 

I’m probably making this up to fit my own mindset but there are certain types of ref … those that lean towards creative players and protect them because they appreciate skill and frown on thuggery. Then there are those that think players are con men,  out to fool them and they’ll give nothing to anyone.

And players are the same. P takers, cheats along with a fair few sportsmen and battlers. It all goes wrong when there are misreadings of who’s who. ?

[chadlad]

14 hours ago, jono said:

The composure point is well made. If we were a team full of rufty tufties it would be understandable, but we have a group with good ball skills. They weren’t used to the extent they should have been. Yes, we need that sweet spot. pretty passing in our own half isn’t the answer but ball on the ground in the middle of the park will get us a lot further than losing at head tennis. 

When you have a midfield 3 of Bird, Knight and Hourihane it makes no sense for the ball to be flying over their heads.

[Crewton]

15 hours ago, SSD said:

There is no way Port Vale should have 20 shots at our goal, for a home team that's frankly embarrassing.

That's where plain stats can be a bit misleading though. Two of those shots were the penalties; one third of the remainder were from outside the area and iirc didn't trouble Wildsmith; half of them came after Collins was sent off, which is understandable as we were a player short; only 3 shots on target, including the 2nd penalty and the winning goal. Wildsmith made one save, a shot from distance that was straight at him. None before the sending off. 

I think allot of views have been distorted by the 32+6 minutes that followed the sending off. Port Vale handled that period well, DCFC didn't. We went "long" without the players to do so successfully. The game became messy, our tactics increasingly desperate. I don't think we were second best, or performing terribly before the SO : afterwards, we were, unquestionably.