The Administration Thread

[Crewton]

4 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

I can see 2 key stumbling blocks to the stadium being owned by the council. If the PB doesn't want to rent from Mel then why would they want to rent from Mel? If the council are being offered generous terms by Mel then why not offer them to a PB? If the council want a revenue-sharing arrangement to make this financially viable surely that's going to eat into any viability of profitability for the club and owner? The second, is where they find the money. Even if they're paying it back over time that's going to be a decent chunk from Derby city council's budget. It might be they figure the loss of derby county would be such a financial hit to revenue they need to do it but I could see the outlay being an issue. 

I can understand exactly why Mel might be willing to sell the stadium to DCC for a lower price than to a potential buyer of the club - because it would be effectively enabling a public body to take ownership of a community asset for less than half its value rather than a potential asset-stripper who could immediately flip the stadium ownership to a third party for a profit. 

 

[Leeds Ram]

6 minutes ago, Crewton said:

I can understand exactly why Mel might be willing to sell the stadium to DCC for a lower price than to a potential buyer of the club - because it would be effectively enabling a public body to take ownership of a community asset for less than half its value rather than a potential asset-stripper who could immediately flip the stadium ownership to a third party for a profit. 

 

I can understand why Mel may be willing to offer a cheaper price to the council but if the issue is paying off the MSD loan and he can't afford to surely that doesn't leave him with a ton of wiggle room? Has there been any indication any of the genuine bidders in for us are 'asset strippers'? I've certainly not seen any. If they want to own the stadium then surely the matter of who they're renting it from isn't the issue. 

[DCFC1388]

The council buying the stadium removes the priniciple of new owners paying Morris' stadium debt which may have been more of an issue than the cost itself. Also gets rid of Mel out of the equation.

[Ram-Alf]

8 minutes ago, Carnero said:

Council buying the stadium and leasing it back with a purchase options is a great idea.

We've got some weird ducking 'supporters' on here, determined to find a problem with every solution ?

I wonder how many of those wont use the new water park/swimming baths that have cost a lot of loot, It's an asset for those who would want to use it, Or family and friends, A Council is there for the public, The public pay for the Council to run the area that it's charged to run, Derby City Council have purchased my home, It's going to a family who have a disabled child, It's a bungalow with 2 bedrooms, I only need 1 bedroom, Would those who criticise DCC also criticise spending funds on a property that will generate money and hopefully hold it's price or go up in value. 

[Elwood P Dowd]

28 minutes ago, Curtains said:

There may be no alternative so I wouldn’t down grade what a good gesture it would be to save DCFC .

The assembly rooms plant room caught fire and devastated the building as an ongoing concern .

It would have cost more to repair than renew .

I believe there were mistakes with insurance issues allegedly 

 

The insurance problem is Derby City Council, to keep costs down, pay a very high Excess amount, I believe it’s in a couple of million, so if the Assembly room repair cost are, for example, £5 million DCC pay £2 million. I not sure my figures are correct but I’m sure you understand the principle ?

Edited April 3, 2022 by Elwood P Dowd

[RamBeauIV]

24 minutes ago, Carnero said:

Council buying the stadium and leasing it back with a purchase options is a great idea.

We've got some weird ducking 'supporters' on here, determined to find a problem with every solution ?

That Boro article further up the fred stated that in 2019 the Riverside Stadium costs £8.9M per year to run. PPS must be similar or even more (as we've got running water inside our stadium).  Makes the lease quite expensive and a liability.

Also, if MA does come back in with an offer, will all council tax payers be happy to financially support a billionaire? 

[Stagtime]

27 minutes ago, Carnero said:

Council buying the stadium and leasing it back with a purchase options is a great idea.

We've got some weird ducking 'supporters' on here, determined to find a problem with every solution ?

I don’t see a problem with govt owned stadiums. Every NRL side here plays out of a govt owned ground and it is a non issue.

[Curtains]

16 minutes ago, RamBeauIV said:

That Boro article further up the fred stated that in 2019 the Riverside Stadium costs £8.9M per year to run. PPS must be similar or even more (as we've got running water inside our stadium).  Makes the lease quite expensive and a liability.

Also, if MA does come back in with an offer, will all council tax payers be happy to financially support a billionaire? 

MA wants to get the dregs of the football club it would appear allegedly just as it collapses into the liquidation 

He won’t pay enough which is 50 Million allegedly 

Edited April 3, 2022 by Curtains
Used administration when meant liquidation

[Curtains]

11 minutes ago, Elwood P Dowd said:

The insurance problem is Derby City Council, to keep costs down, pay a very high Excess amount, I believe it’s in a couple of million, so if the Assembly room repair cost are, for example, £5 million DCC pay £2 million. I not sure my figures are correct but I’m sure you understand the principle ?

Yes of course I understand the dilemma for the council regarding Tax payers money and excess regarding insurance costs .

The fire was very unfortunate at the Assembly Rooms but it was getting somewhat dilapidated.

I just think over a period PP and DCFC will be well worth saving as DCFC is definitely a community asset and buying and leasing initially is a very good option 

It might not come to fruition but I sure hope it does .

[nottingram]

Am probably being a bit thick - from a buyer perspective how is it any different spending £30m on the club and leasing the ground from MM (which we were told is an option), or spending £30m on the club and leasing the ground from the council? So not sure what it solves really unless it is just more likelihood of a cooperative relationship with the council?

[Curtains]

1 minute ago, nottingram said:

Am probably being a bit thick - from a buyer perspective how is it any different spending £30m on the club and leasing the ground from MM (which we were told is an option), or spending £30m on the club and leasing the ground from the council? So not sure what it solves really unless it is just more likelihood of a cooperative relationship with the council?

No one wants to buy the Stadium at price MM wants because of MSD loan payback so the Council would be saving Derby County with a long term project with a buy back option fo DCFC eventually 

[Comrade 86]

A few of us suggested exactly this when the Council met with some of the stakeholders a few weeks back. I said then and I stand by the view expressed, that from a fiscal perspective, it's an absolute no-brainer given they would be able to levy a ground-rent of between £1m and £2M per annum. Some folk need to do the basic maths on this. The deal would add to the Council coffers, not detract from them and that's before one considers the broader 'indirect' social and fiscal benefits. Furthermore, the Council will not have to stump up the £22M, which some on here appear not to grasp at all. A greater concern to me would be whether this arrangement might detract from the appeal of the club to the current bidders, though I sense they are only offering a token price for the stadium in any case.

All of this notwithstanding, my preferred option would still be that Morris consider his stated commitments and at very least, substantially reduce the asking price for the stadium. It won't happen of course, but by rights, he should actually without further delay, agree to transfer ownership to the new owners 'for £1.00' in keeping with his promise to do so, or have the class to explain to a fan base who feel betrayed and misled by him, why he is unable to.

.

[nottingram]

1 minute ago, Curtains said:

No one wants to buy the Stadium at price MM wants because of MSD loan payback so the Council would be saving Derby County with a long term project with a buy back option fo DCFC eventually 

But in both cases the buyers will have paid £30m for the club with no stadium then have to pay annual leasing costs?

Always struck me was that the issue was essentially that if the buyer was paying £30m they would want the stadium included within that 

[Crewton]

33 minutes ago, Leeds Ram said:

Has there been any indication any of the genuine bidders in for us are 'asset strippers'?

Everyone I've seen suggested as being "genuine bidders" are people/consortiums whose motivation is ultimately to make a profit. That means that selling off valuable assets to reduce their exposure can't be ruled out, certainly not in the mind of someone who's being publicly pressurised to sell to those parties at a huge discount. All my own speculation, of course. 

[YouRams]

49 minutes ago, Carnero said:

Council buying the stadium and leasing it back with a purchase options is a great idea.

We've got some weird ducking 'supporters' on here, determined to find a problem with every solution ?

It should be gifted to the Council as an apology from Morris for leaving the club and the citys club in so much ****, instead tax payers money will be buying it and MM gets away with his millions in tact. 

[Curtains]

4 minutes ago, 86 Hair Islands said:

A few of us suggested exactly this when the Council met with some of the stakeholders a few weeks back. I said then and I stand by the view expressed, that from a fiscal perspective, it's an absolute no-brainer given they would be able to levy a ground-rent of between £1m and £2M per annum. Some folk need to do the basic maths on this. The deal would add to the Council coffers, not detract from them and that's before one considers the broader 'indirect' social and fiscal benefits. Furthermore, the Council will not have to stump up the £22M, which some on here appear not to grasp at all. A greater concern to me would be whether this arrangement might detract from the appeal of the club to the current bidders, though I sense they are only offering a token price for the stadium in any case.

All of this notwithstanding, my preferred option would still be that Morris consider his stated commitments and at very least, substantially reduce the asking price for the stadium. It won't happen of course, but by rights, he should actually without further delay, agree to transfer ownership to the new owners 'for £1.00' in keeping with his promise to do so, or have the class to explain to a fan base who feel betrayed and misled by him, why he is unable to.

.

Totally agree but the MSD loan against the Stadium appears to be the MM issue regarding this as he would have to take a 20 Million hit allegedly.

I see the Council as being a lat resort option but unfortunately we are getting to that point .

If the PB was given the buy back option at a later date within contracts then I don’t see an issue other than lease charges 

 

[Curtains]

11 minutes ago, nottingram said:

But in both cases the buyers will have paid £30m for the club with no stadium then have to pay annual leasing costs?

Always struck me was that the issue was essentially that if the buyer was paying £30m they would want the stadium included within that 

Well they would have as it would be in a contracted option .

Bit like when you buy a new car on PCP

Maybe not a great analogy but I think you get my drift 
 

I don’t need to explain as it’s in this article 

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/derby-county-takeover-news-council-6899640

Edited April 3, 2022 by Curtains
Added

[Ramarena]

2 hours ago, RipleyRich said:

Nottm City Council have always owned that land I think.

I guess Derby City Council would borrow in order to make any purchase. They don`t have a shortage of assets to secure against, and if the "Rent" is equal to or greater than the loan cost, then who could have an issue?

 

Oh I can think of a few people

[Comrade 86]

1 minute ago, Curtains said:

Totally agree but the MSD loan against the Stadium appears to be the MM issue regarding this as he would have to take a 20 Million hit allegedly.

But he's not 'taking a hit' my friend. He borrowed this money to cover operational costs rather than use his own. If there was no intention to service this debt, then he had no business taking it on. It stinks and this is even before one considers the burden to the club of meeting interest payments on the principal debt which rise with every day that passes.

If there are reasons why he can't at least compromise, liquidity being a plausible example, then why not say as much? I'd politely suggest that that's the very least the long-suffering fan-base deserve, not to mention our numerous creditors.

[Curtains]

1 minute ago, 86 Hair Islands said:

But he's not 'taking a hit' my friend. He borrowed this money to cover operational costs rather than use his own. If there was no intention to service this debt, then he had no business taking it on. It stinks and this is even before one considers the burden to the club of meeting interest payments on the principal debt which rise with every day that passes.

If there are reasons why he can't at least compromise, liquidity being a plausible example, then why not say as much? I'd politely suggest that that's the very least the long-suffering fan-base deserve, not to mention our numerous creditors.

I agree